03/01/00

LC000301

VAL>> ON LIFE AND TIMES TONIGHT --

WARREN>> THE LAPD ACCEPTS THE BLAME FOR FAILING TO PROTECT AND SERVE ALL THE CITIZENS OF LOS ANGELES.

GAY YEE>> THE 362-PAGE REPORT IS A REVIEW OF LAPD DEPARTMENT PRACTICES, A SCATHING REVIEW OF THE INNER WORKINGS OF THE RAMPART DIVISION.

BERNARD PARKS>> IT CLEARLY IS EVIDENT THAT THE IMAGE OF THIS DEPARTMENT IS TARNISHED. THE WHOLE CRIMINAL JUSTICE SYSTEM IS TARNISHED. THE CREDIBILITY OF PEOPLE BELIEVING THAT THEY'RE INNOCENT UNTIL PROVEN GUILTY IS TARNISHED.

VAL>> AND ON TONIGHT'S THINKERS, SHAKERS & NEWSMAKERS, THE SPIN BEGINS ON THE RAMPART REPORT.

RICHARD RIORDAN>> I'M PROUD OF WHAT THEY'VE DONE. THEY HAVE NOT TRIED TO HIDE ANYTHING AND THIS IS WHY THE PEOPLE OF THIS CITY TRUST AND HAVE CONFIDENCE IN THEIR POLICE DEPARTMENT.

WARREN>> ALSO TONIGHT, WHO THINKS UP THIS STUFF?

[FILM CLIP]

IN THE WORDS OF THE WRITER'S GUILD OF AMERICA, SOMEBODY WROTE THAT. WE'LL LOOK AT WHAT WRITERS LOOK FOR WHEN THEY HONOR THE YEAR'S TOP SCREENPLAYS.

VAL>> THESE STORIES COMING UP NEXT ON LIFE AND TIMES TONIGHT FOR WEDNESDAY, MARCH 1, 2000.

LIFE AND TIMES TONIGHT IS MADE POSSIBLE BY THE FOLLOWING CORPORATIONS AND FOUNDATIONS:

THE JAMES IRVINE FOUNDATION
WHICH IS DEDICATED TO THE DEVELOPMENT OF AN INFORMED CALIFORNIA CITIZENRY.

GTE
A COMPANY COMMITTED TO TELECOMMUNICATIONS EXCELLENCE AND AN OPEN DIALOGUE AMONG ALL PEOPLE.


AND THE L.K. WHITTIER FOUNDATION
DEDICATED TO IMPROVING THE QUALITY OF LIFE BY SUPPORTING INNOVATIVE ENDEAVORS IN THE FIELDS OF MEDICINE, HEALTH, SCIENCE AND EDUCATION.

WARREN>> GOOD EVENING, I'M WARREN OLNEY.

VAL>> AND I'M VAL ZAVALA.

WARREN>> OUR TOP STORY TONIGHT, THE LAPD'S OWN REPORT ON THE RAMPART CORRUPTION SCANDAL. CHIEF BERNARD PARKS RELEASED THE REPORT TODAY, CALLING THE EPISODE A LIFE-ALTERING EXPERIENCE FOR HIS DEPARTMENT.

VAL>> THE REPORT CITES POOR SUPERVISION AND A CULTURE OF MEDIOCRITY INSIDE THE RAMPART DIVISION, BUT IT PUTS THE BLAME FOR THE WORST CORRUPTION SCANDAL IN LAPD HISTORY ON INDIVIDUAL OFFICERS, NOT THE ENTIRE DEPARTMENT. GAY YEE WAS THERE WHEN THE REPORT WAS MADE PUBLIC.

GAY>> THE 362-PAGE REPORT IS A REVIEW OF LAPD DEPARTMENT PRACTICES, A SCATHING REVIEW OF THE INNER WORKINGS OF THE RAMPART DIVISION. THE MAN WHO LED THIS INQUIRY FOUND THIS AN EMOTIONAL DAY.

MICHAEL BOSTIC>> THIS IS PROBABLY THE SADDEST DAY OF MY CAREER AND, AT THE SAME TIME, ONE OF MY PROFOUNDLY PROUDEST OF THE LAPD PERSONNEL THAT HAVE BEEN INVOLVED IN THIS INVESTIGATION. IF YOU EVER HAVE ANY DOUBTS ABOUT THE INTEGRITY OF THIS ORGANIZATION, READ THE REPORT.

GAY>> 108 RECOMMENDATIONS WERE LISTED, INCLUDING TIGHTER SCREENING OF APPLICANTS, BACKGROUND CHECKS, PSYCHOLOGICAL AND POLYGRAPH TESTS, EXPANDING INTERNAL AFFAIRS AND MORE SUPERVISORS IN THE FIELD.

BERNARD PARKS>> IT CLEARLY IS EVIDENT THAT THE IMAGE OF THIS DEPARTMENT IS TARNISHED. THE WHOLE CRIMINAL JUSTICE SYSTEM IS TARNISHED. THE CREDIBILITY OF PEOPLE BELIEVING THAT THEY'RE INNOCENT UNTIL PROVEN GUILTY IS TARNISHED. SO, YES, WE CLEARLY UNDERSTAND THAT. WE CLEARLY HAVE MADE INROADS TO ATTEMPT TO ADDRESS THAT. WE WOULDN'T BE HERE TODAY WITH A 300+-PAGE REPORT IF WE WEREN'T TRYING TO ADDRESS THAT INTERNALLY, AND WE WOULD NOT BE TRYING VERY DESPERATELY TO PROSECUTE POLICE OFFICERS FOR THEIR WRONG-DOINGS IF WE DIDN'T BELIEVE IT HAD AN IMPACT ON OUR IMAGE AND OUR CREDIBILITY.

GAY>> PARKS TOLD REPORTERS THE BUCK STOPS HERE. IF THE DEPARTMENT IS TO BLAME FOR ITS PROBLEMS, IT SHOULD BE IN CHARGE OF FIXING ITS PROBLEMS. WHEN ASKED IF HE FELT AN OUTSIDE INVESTIGATOR NECESSARY, --

BERNARD PARKS>> NO IS THE ANSWER. NEXT QUESTION?

GAY>> -- THE CHIEF BRISTLED. MAYOR RICHARD RIORDAN SIDED WITH THE CHIEF, AGREEING THAT AN OUTSIDE INDEPENDENT INVESTIGATION WAS UNNECESSARY AND HE PRAISED PARKS AND THE DEPARTMENT IN ITS EFFORT TO INVESTIGATE AND ROOT OUT POLICE CORRUPTION.

RICHARD RIORDAN>> HE'S FIRED MORE OFFICERS THAN HIS PREDECESSORS DID IN THEIR WHOLE CAREERS. HE IS TOUGH ON DISCIPLINE. HE IS A GOOD MANAGER, AS YOU CAN SEE, BY PUTTING TOGETHER THIS BOARD OF INQUIRY REPORT. CLEARLY, HE IS THE PERSON THAT WE NEED IN THIS SITUATION.

GAY>> THE REPORT FOUND THAT RAMPART CORRUPTION EXISTED BECAUSE OF A CULTURE OF "MEDIOCRITY", A CULTURE THAT THE STUDY FOUND STILL EXISTS TODAY.

MICHAEL BOSTIC>> WHAT THE REPORT CLEARLY SAYS TO US, AS THE LEADERS OF THE LOS ANGELES POLICE DEPARTMENT, IS MEDIOCRITY IS ALIVE AND WELL. THIS PROCESS STARTED MANY YEARS BACK. I'M NOT GOING TO TRY TO PINPOINT THE DATE BECAUSE EVERYBODY WILL HAVE THEIR OPINIONS ABOUT THAT. BUT IT'S CLEAR WHEN YOU READ THROUGH THIS THAT WE'VE ALLOWED MEDIOCRITY TO FLOURISH. AND WHEN I SAY WE, I'M TALKING ABOUT THE COMMAND STRUCTURE AND EVERYONE OF US THAT ARE HERE TODAY.

GAY>> BUT SOME SAY BLAMING THE PROBLEM ON A CULTURE OF MEDIOCRITY IS LETTING THE LAPD OFF TOO EASY. THERE'S A DIFFERENCE BETWEEN MEDIOCRITY AND MALEVOLENCE, THE SAME WAY THERE'S A DIFFERENCE BETWEEN INCOMPETENCE AND CORRUPTION.

ERWIN CHEMERINSKY>> THE PROBLEM IS PERVASIVE WITHIN THE POLICE DEPARTMENT. WE CAN'T LEAVE IT TO THE POLICE DEPARTMENT TO JUST CLEAN UP ITS OWN HOUSE.

GAY>> ERWIN CHEMERINSKY IS A PROFESSOR OF LAW AND POLITICAL SCIENCE AT USC. HE WAS CALLED IN BY THE POLICE PROTECTIVE LEAGUE TO DO AN INDEPENDENT REVIEW OF THE REPORT. HE BELIEVES AN OUTSIDE REVIEW IS NECESSARY AND THAT THE POLICE COMMISSION ISN'T THE GROUP TO DO THE JOB.

ERWIN CHEMERINSKY>> JUST LIKE THE DEAN IS THE MANAGER OF THIS LAW SCHOOL, THE POLICE COMMISSION IS THE MANAGER OF THE DEPARTMENT UNDER THE CHARTER. THEY ARE IN NO WAY EXTERNAL TO OR INDEPENDENT OF THE DEPARTMENT.

GAY>> AND AFTER BEING LOCKED OUT OF THE MAYOR'S PRESS CONFERENCE TODAY, MEMBERS OF THE CITY COUNCIL ARE INCLINED TO AGREE.

LAURA CHICK>> MY CONFIDENCE IN THE COMMISSION, THE WAY IT'S BEEN SET UP BY CHARTER AMENDMENT F, HAS BEEN SHAKEN, HAS BEEN SHAKEN. I THINK THE PROOF IS STILL TO COME. THIS IS THE LITMUS TEST. THIS IS THE LINE IN THE SAND. BUT I DO AGREE WITH MY COLLEAGUES' COMMENTS THAT, IN TERMS OF RESTORING POLICY MAKERS' CONFIDENCE AND ESPECIALLY THE PUBLIC'S, WHICH IS SO KEY TO THE SUCCESS OF POLICING IN A COMMUNITY, YOU'VE GOT TO HAVE SOME OUTSIDE SCRUTINY.

GAY>> IT WAS ANOTHER DARK DAY FOR THE LAPD AND RECOVERING FROM THIS BLACK MARK WON'T BE EASY. YET PARKS IS CONVINCED THAT THE DEPARTMENT WILL BOUNCE BACK FROM THE WORST SCANDAL IN ITS HISTORY. EARLIER IN THE DAY, CHIEF PARKS GAVE A HAT AND T-SHIRT TO A BOY AS PART OF THE "MAKE A WISH" PROGRAM. HE TOLD THE BOY TO WEAR IT WITH PRIDE, THE SAME PRIDE WITH WHICH HE CONTINUES TO HEAD THIS DEPARTMENT.

REPORTER>> DO YOU STILL LIKE YOUR JOB?

BERNARD PARKS>> I LOVE MY JOB. IT'S THE BEST JOB IN AMERICA.

WARREN>> OKAY, GAY. MUCH TALK ABOUT WHETHER THERE SHOULD BE AN OUTSIDE INVESTIGATION. THE CHIEF, OBVIOUSLY, AND THE MAYOR ARE VERY MUCH OPPOSED TO THAT IDEA. THE POLICE COMMISSION IS SUPPOSED TO PROVIDE CIVILIAN REVIEW. WAS THE POLICE COMMISSION EVEN THERE TODAY?

GAY>> THEY MAY HAVE BEEN. IT WAS A HUGE PACKED ROOM. CHEMERINSKY ADDRESSED THAT WHEN WE SPOKE TO HIM. WE SAID, "WHY NOT THE COMMISSION? WHY CAN'T THIS BE A LAY OUTSIDE GROUP?" HE SAID, "THEY ARE JUST SIMPLY TOO CLOSE." THAT'S NOT POSSIBLE THAT THEY WILL NOT SOMEHOW BE CONNECTED.

WARREN>> AND THEY DIDN'T FORMALLY MAKE A PRESENTATION? THEY WEREN'T THERE? THEY WEREN'T ON THE STAND? THEY DIDN'T HAVE ANYTHING TO SAY?

GAY>> NO, THEY DID NOT. NOT TODAY.

VAL>> THAT REALLY LOOKED LIKE QUITE A SCENE. ELABORATE ON THIS LOCK-OUT WITH LAURA CHICK AND OTHER CITY COUNCIL MEMBERS LOCKED OUT. WHAT HAPPENED?

GAY>> APPARENTLY WHAT HAD HAPPENED WAS THE MAYOR CALLED THE NEWS CONFERENCE IN CITY HALL AND THEY SENT UP STAFF, THE COUNCIL MEMBERS SENT UP STAFF. THEY WERE DENIED ENTRANCE, SAYING THEY DIDN'T HAVE A PRESS PASS. SO THESE FIVE COUNCIL MEMBERS WENT UP AND SAID, LET US IN. NO, YOU DON'T HAVE A PRESS PASS, NO, YOU'RE NOT ALLOWED IN. THEY WERE ADAMANT. THEY BASICALLY SAID THAT THE MAYOR IS TRYING TO PUT HIS OWN SPIN ON THE SITUATION AND ONLY ALLOWING HIS WORDS OUT, NOT THEIRS.

VAL>> BUT THEY DID EVENTUALLY GET IN?

GAY>> THEY EVENTUALLY -- IT'S QUITE FUNNY, BECAUSE WE HEARD THE POUNDING ON THE DOOR AND WE ASSUMED IT WAS ANOTHER REPORTING TEAM WHO SHOWED UP LATE TO THE NEWS CONFERENCE. LO AND BEHOLD, THEY WERE CITY COUNCIL MEMBERS.

WARREN>> DOESN'T SOUND LIKE SMOOTH COORDINATION OF TWO BRANCHES OF GOVERNMENT.

GAY>> NO, AND THAT WAS EXACTLY WHAT THEY WERE TALKING ABOUT. THIS FEELING OF THEM AGAINST US RATHER THAN WORKING AS A UNIT TO TRY AND SOLVE THE PROBLEM.

VAL>> NOW, GAY, THERE'S 108 RECOMMENDATIONS. WHAT HAPPENS NEXT WITH THIS REPORT?

GAY>> WELL, THERE IS A WHOLE LIST OF PUBLIC HEARINGS ALL THROUGH MARCH FOR PEOPLE TO COMMENT ON THIS. THEY EVEN HAVE A SPOT ON THE WEBSITE.

WARREN>> WHO'S HOLDING THE HEARINGS? IS IT THE COMMISSION?

GAY>> IT'S THE COMMISSION AND ALSO THE WEBSITE IS ANOTHER PLACE WHERE THE PUBLIC CAN ACTUALLY PUT IN THEIR QUESTIONS AND ASK THE POLICE DEPARTMENT WHAT ABOUT THIS AND WHAT ABOUT THAT, AND GETTING THEIR INPUT.

VAL>> GAY, THANK YOU VERY MUCH. WE'RE GOING TO BE FOLLOWING THIS ONE FOR A WHILE.

TIME NOW FOR TONIGHT'S THINKERS, SHAKERS & NEWSMAKERS.

THE LA CITY ATTORNEY'S OFFICE IS ADDING TO ITS STAFF AS A RESULT OF THE RAMPART SCANDAL. IT IS HIRING ADDITIONAL LAWYERS AND INVESTIGATORS AND THEY ARE GEARING UP TO HANDLE THE ANTICIPATED ONSLAUGHT OF LAWSUITS. TWENTY LAWSUITS HAVE ALREADY BEEN FILED, 15 OTHERS ARE PENDING AND THE TOTAL IS EXPECTED TO GO TO AS HIGH AS 180.

WARREN>> THOSE LAWSUITS WERE PARTIALLY THE SUBJECT OF A WEEKEND STRATEGY SESSION BY SOME OF LA'S MOST PROMINENT CIVIL RIGHTS ATTORNEYS. AMONG THEM, OUR GUEST TONIGHT, CONNIE RICE, WHO IS WITH THE ADVANCEMENT PROJECT. WE'LL GET BACK TO THE STRATEGY OF THOSE LAWSUITS IN A MOMENT. FIRST, WHAT'S YOUR INITIAL REACTION TO THIS REPORT?

CONSTANCE RICE>> IT'LL COME AS NO SURPRISE, WARREN, THAT I'M NOT IMPRESSED AND I'M NOT IN ANY WAY COMFORTED BY THIS REPORT FOR A COUPLE OF REASONS. NUMBER ONE, AS ERWIN SAID, NO ONE CAN INVESTIGATE THEMSELVES. YOU AND I CAN'T INVESTIGATE OURSELVES, LAPD CANNOT INVESTIGATE ITSELF. THE PURPOSE OF THIS REPORT IS TO FORESTALL ANY OUTSIDE INVESTIGATIONS WHICH WOULD JUST BEGIN TO UNCOVER WHAT'S --

WARREN>> THE MAYOR SAYS THIS IS A HISTORIC SELF-CRITICISM BY A GOVERNMENT AGENCY. EVEN SOME OF THE PEOPLE WHO ARE FAIRLY CRITICAL OF THE DEPARTMENT ARE SAYING THAT'S REALLY EXTRAORDINARY, IN AND OF ITSELF, THAT THEY WOULD REVEAL AS MUCH AS THEY HAVE ABOUT MISBEHAVIOR WITHIN THE LAPD.

CONSTANCE RICE>> WARREN, FOR LAPD IT MAY BE EXTRAORDINARY, BUT EVEN IF YOU TAKE THAT AT FACE VALUE, HERE'S THE PROBLEM. STRUCTURALLY, THEY CAN'T DO IT. THE COMMISSION CAN'T DO IT, THE CITY CAN'T DO IT. THIS IS A MASSIVE -- IT'S NOT JUST A COUPLE OF COPS OUT OF CONTROL. THIS IS ABOUT AN IMPLOSION OF LAPD CONTROL OVER ITS COPS. WHEN YOU HAVE THIS MANY COPS ACTING IN THIS WAY -- AND REMEMBER, WE'VE KNOWN ABOUT CRASH FOR 20 YEARS, 15 OR 20 YEARS.

VAL>> YOU MEAN, WE'VE KNOWN ABOUT THE PROBLEMS IN CRASH?

CONSTANCE RICE>> WE'VE KNOWN ABOUT THE PROBLEMS OF COPS WHO ARE OUT OF CONTROL. 77TH, RAMPART, 15 YEARS. I MEAN, I'VE KNOWN ABOUT IT FOR TEN YEARS AND I'M A COMPLETE OUTSIDER. SO EVERYBODY WHO DID THIS INTERNAL REVIEW, AT ONE POINT OR ANOTHER, MANY OF THE COMMANDING OFFICERS WHO DID THIS, AND A NUMBER OF THEM ARE GOOD OFFICERS, BUT THEY ALSO WERE COMMANDERS IN 77TH. THEY WERE COMMANDERS IN RAMPART. THERE'S NOTHING IN THIS REPORT THAT CONNECTS THEIR RELATIONSHIP, SO EVEN THE INVESTIGATORS NEED TO BE INVESTIGATED.

VAL>> WELL, WHAT YOU'RE SAYING THEN, IT SOUNDS LIKE THE ONLY OPTION HERE WOULD BE TO FIRE EVERYBODY, DISBAND THESE UNITS, IF IT'S PART OF THE CULTURE, IF IT GOES UP AND DOWN THE HIERARCHY. WHAT'S THE SOLUTION IF YOU'RE INTERPRETATION IS CORRECT?

CONSTANCE RICE>> THIS IS SO BROAD, VAL, THAT I THINK YOU NEED A SPECIAL PROSECUTOR WITH BROAD SUBPOENA POWERS AND A FEDERAL GRAND JURY. YOU WILL NOTE THAT, IN THIS WEEK'S PAPERS, YOU HAVE THE INS AND THE FBI ALSO ENTANGLED IN THIS THING, SO YOU CAN'T EVEN GO TO JUSTICE AT THIS POINT. I HAVE IN MIND SOMEONE WHO IS AN EXPERT PROSECUTOR, HAS THE CONFIDENCE OF THE COPS, THE GOOD COPS, THE CONFIDENCE OF THE JUDICIARY, THE CONFIDENCE OF THE PUBLIC. SOMEONE LIKE LAURIE LEVINSON, FOR EXAMPLE, A FORMER PROSECUTOR.

WARREN>> CURRENTLY THE DEAN AT LOYOLA UNIVERSITY LAW SCHOOL?

CONSTANCE RICE>> CURRENTLY THE DEAN AT LOYOLA UNIVERSITY LAW SCHOOL. BUT IT'S GOTTEN TO THE POINT WHERE, FOR EXAMPLE, WHO'S GOING TO INVESTIGATE THE JUDGES? THERE WERE JUDGES WHO PRESIDED OVER THESE TRIALS FOR MONTHS AND MONTHS ON END, PLEAS THAT ANYONE LOOKING AT THEM COULD TELL WERE PROBLEMATIC. I'VE SEEN JUDGES HAVE TO DISMISS CASES BECAUSE THEY KNEW THE COPS WERE LYING, BUT THE JUDGES DID NOTHING TO MAKE SURE THAT THOSE COPS PAID THE PRICE FOR THAT.

THE DA? THE CITY ATTORNEY? THE CITY ATTORNEY IS THE LAPD'S LAWYER. WHAT WAS JIM HAHN DOING ALL OF THIS TIME? YOU HAVE TO UNDERSTAND, THIS COVERS OUR ENTIRE CRIMINAL JUSTICE INFRASTRUCTURE AND, IN ORDER TO REALLY FIX IT, IT'S GOING TO HAVE TO GO A WHOLE LOT DEEPER. THIS REPORT IS REALLY -- I KNOW THE MAYOR IS VERY PROUD OF IT, I KNOW CHIEF PARKS IS PROUD OF IT, I UNDERSTAND WHY THEY'RE PROUD OF IT. BUT THE PUBLIC SHOULD UNDERSTAND THE PURPOSE OF THIS IS NOT TO UNCOVER THE DEEP CULTURAL PROBLEMS HERE IN LAPD. IT IS TO MAKE SURE THAT NOTHING ELSE TARNISHES THE IMAGE AND THAT NO OUTSIDERS GET INTO LAPD.

WARREN>> OKAY. THEY SAY, THOUGH, THAT THEY ARE GOING TO HAVE ONGOING -- THEY'RE ASKING FOR INCREASED POWERS FOR THE CHIEF. HE CAN GIVE POLYGRAPH TESTS FOR VARIOUS OFFICERS. THEY'RE GOING TO CHANGE THE TRAINING AND ENTRANCE REQUIREMENTS SO THAT THEY DON'T SLIP UP AS THEY INDICATED AND HAVE PEOPLE WITH CRIMINAL RECORDS THAT BECOME A POLICEMAN THAT THEY'RE SUGGESTING THOSE ARE THE PEOPLE WHO CAUSED THE PROBLEMS AT CRASH AND ELSEWHERE.

CONSTANCE RICE>> WRONG, WRONG. I SAY THIS BECAUSE RAFAEL PEREZ -- THERE WAS NOTHING WRONG WITH HIM WHEN HE CAME IN. HE WAS FINE WHEN HE GRADUATED FROM THE ACADEMY. IT'S LAPD'S INTERNAL CULTURE THAT TURNED HIM INTO WHAT HE BECAME. YES, THEY MISSED A COUPLE OF PEOPLE. ANY SYSTEM DOES. IT COULD BE A GOOD RECOMMENDATION THAT IT'S LAX AND NEEDS TO BE TIGHTENED UP. BUT CHIEF PARKS AND CHIEF GASCON AND A NUMBER OF OTHERS, CHIEF POMEROY, ARE RIGHT NOW REFUSING TO END RETALIATION AGAINST WOMEN WHO ARE IN THEIR COMMAND RIGHT NOW. THEY'RE STILL DOING THE RETALIATION CULTURE AND SUPPORTING AND WINKING AND LOOKING THE OTHER WAY --

WARREN>> THAT SOUNDS LIKE A DIFFERENT SUBJECT. WHAT ARE THEY RETALIATING AGAINST?

CONSTANCE RICE>> WHAT I'M SAYING IS, THEY HAVE THIS 300-PAGE REPORT SAYING THIS IS WHAT'S GOING TO GET RID OF IT? NO, THAT ISN'T WHAT'S GOING TO GET RID OF IT BECAUSE THEY'RE DOING IT RIGHT NOW. THEY'RE DOING IT RIGHT NOW TO OTHER GOOD COPS IN THEIR RANKS. THEY'RE NOT PROTECTING THEM AGAINST RETALIATION. THERE ARE FEMALE OFFICERS WHO TESTED NUMBER ONE ON THE LIEUTENANT'S TEST WHO CAN'T EVEN GET A JOB BECAUSE THEY'VE BEEN EXCOMMUNICATED FOR RAISING ISSUES. GOOD COPS CANNOT RAISE CLAIMS AND CANNOT REPORT ON THE RAFAEL PEREZS OR THE MARK FUHRMANS WITHOUT HAVING THE MACHINERY TURN ON THEM. THEIR SUPERIORS DON'T PROTECT THEM.

WARREN>> YOU'RE NOT SAYING THERE'S NO SUCH THING AS A GOOD COP IN THE LAPD?

CONSTANCE RICE>> I THINK THAT MOST OF LAPD IS FULL OF GOOD COPS. I REPRESENT A NUMBER OF THEM. I THINK THEY DO AN IMPOSSIBLE JOB. I THINK THEY DO A HORRIBLE JOB AND FOR PEOPLE WHO DON'T BACK THEM, MEANING THE MIDDLE CLASS. BUT WE ALSO LICENSE THEM IN A WAY THAT MAKES THEM DANGEROUS TO POOR COMMUNITIES. THE COPS THAT YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT, YOU CAN'T HAVE WHAT'S GOING ON IN RAMPART AND 77TH AND OTHER SPECIALIZED UNITS FOR YEARS AND YEARS AND YEARS. THIS IS LIKE THE TAIL HOOK GUYS GETTING CAUGHT, GOING INTO A ROOM TO INVESTIGATE THEMSELVES FOR TWO YEARS AND COMING OUT AND SAYING THEY HAD A LAPSE IN MANNERS. YOU DON'T NEED TWO YEARS TO INVESTIGATE WHAT YOU ALREADY KNOW AND YOU DON'T NEED A 400-PAGE REPORT TALKING ABOUT EVERYTHING IN THE WORLD EXCEPT WHAT'S WRONG.

WARREN>> THE POLICE CHIEF SAYS WE DON'T REALLY KNOW HOW FAR THIS GOES AND THAT IT WILL TAKE ANOTHER YEAR OF INVESTIGATION IN ORDER TO REALLY DETERMINE HOW FAR BEYOND THE RAMPART DIVISION CORRUPTION HAS SEEPED.

CONSTANCE RICE>> WELL, THEY DO KNOW HOW FAR IT GOES. THE CHRISTOPHER COMMISSION SAID THAT GENDER DISCRIMINATION WAS SPREAD WIDE AND FAR. THEY REFUSED TO DEAL WITH THAT. THEY DIDN'T WANT THE COMPUTER SYSTEM WHICH WOULD HAVE ALLOWED THEM TO TRACK THE PATTERNS OF ABUSES AND COMPLAINTS AGAINST COPS. THEY FOUGHT THAT. THEY MANAGED TO GET A GANG DATABASE UP AND GOING VERY FAST. THEY ABSOLUTELY UNDERMINED THE INSPECTOR-GENERAL. WHY WOULD WE BELIEVE THAT A DEPARTMENT IS REALLY READY TO CHANGE WHEN IT DOESN'T DO THE BIG THINGS THAT ARE RIGHT IN FRONT OF IT? ONE OTHER THING AND I'VE ONLY READ THE SUMMARIES AND THE EXECUTIVE SUMMARY TODAY. YOU HAVE GOT TO GET THE CRITERIA FOR PROMOTION CHANGED. IF A COP KNOWS THAT, FOR FAILING TO REPORT, THEY'RE NOT GOING TO GET REPORTED, THEY'RE NOT GOING TO GO TO POLICE OLYMPICS, THEY'RE NOT GOING TO GET ANY OF THE PERKS. RIGHT NOW, THE SYSTEM IS STILL REWARDING THEM FOR THE BEHAVIOR THAT YOU SEE IN RAMPART.

WARREN>> VERY QUICKLY, AREN'T THESE THINGS THAT THE COMMISSION NOW AND THE INSPECTOR-GENERAL MAY WELL TAKE INTO ACCOUNT, IT'S BEING SAID THAT THEY REALLY HAVEN'T HAD A CHANCE YET TO BE TESTED SINCE THE NEW CHARTER WAS PUT TOGETHER AND SO ON?

CONSTANCE RICE>> I AGREE WITH ERWIN. IT'S NOT A MATTER OF THEM HAVING A CHANCE. IT'S A MATTER OF THEIR FUNCTION. CAN THEY LEGALLY AND STRUCTURALLY DO IT? YOU AND I CAN'T INVESTIGATE OURSELVES. WHENEVER THERE'S FRAUD, YOU BRING IN AN OUTSIDE AUDITOR BECAUSE HE'S NOT CONNECTED, SHE'S NOT CONNECTED TO ANYBODY. THERE ARE NO RELATIONSHIPS, THERE'S NO STAKE AND YOU CAN DO AN INDEPENDENT AUDIT. THERE'S GOT TO BE SOMETHING NOT ONLY INDEPENDENT AT THIS POINT, COMPLETELY OUTSIDE OF OUR CRIMINAL JUSTICE SYSTEM, AND THAT'S WHY I THINK WE'RE AT THE POINT WHERE YOU'VE GOT TO HAVE A FEDERAL GRAND JURY WITH A SPECIAL PROSECUTOR.

VAL>> MOST PEOPLE, OVERALL, DESPITE THE FACT THAT YOU'RE VERY CRITICAL OF THIS REPORT, WILL CONSIDER THIS REPORT SCATHING, THE POLICE DEPARTMENT BEING VERY, VERY TOUGH ON ITSELF. A LOT OF PEOPLE READING IT IN THE PAPER WOULD BE PRETTY IMPRESSED BY WHAT SEEMS TO BE VERY OPEN, HONEST ADMISSIONS. ARE YOU SAYING THAT THIS IS WAY OFF BASE? VIRTUALLY WORTH NOTHING, THIS REPORT?

CONSTANCE RICE>> IT'S WORTH NOTHING IN CONNECTION WITH WHAT'S REALLY WRONG.

VAL>> SO YOU'RE SAYING IT DOES NOT HIT THE BULL'S-EYE?

CONSTANCE RICE>> AT ALL. IT MISSES THE ENTIRE TARGET.

VAL>> WOW. WE'VE GOT A LONG WAY TO GO THEN. CONNIE RICE, THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR COMING IN.

CONSTANCE RICE>> YOU'RE WELCOME.

WARREN>> WE'RE GOING TO TAKE A CHANGE OF COURSE NOW AWAY FROM THE HARSH REALITY OF POLICE CORRUPTION TO THE ESCAPIST FARE OF HOLLYWOOD. THIS WEEKEND, THE WRITER'S GUILD OF AMERICA HONORS ITS OWN WITH PRESENTATION OF THE 52ND ANNUAL WGA AWARDS.

VAL>> THIS TIME, WRITERS THEMSELVES VOTE ON THE BEST YEAR'S ORIGINAL SCREENPLAY AND THE BEST SCREENPLAY ADAPTED FROM ANOTHER MEDIUM. BUT HOW DO YOU JUDGE WHAT MAKES AN AWARD-WINNING SCREENPLAY? WE'LL FIND OUT IN TONIGHT'S PEOPLE, PLACES & THINGS.

AMONG THE NOMINEES FOR THIS YEAR'S WGA AWARDS ARE AMERICAN BEAUTY, THE TALENTED MR. RIPLEY AND THE CIDER HOUSE RULES, ALL OF THEM CRITICALLY ACCLAIMED AND THE PRODUCT OF A TEAM OF SKILLED ACTORS, DIRECTORS, EDITORS AND CRAFTSPEOPLE. BUT HOW DO YOU EVEN BEGIN TO DECIDE WHICH ONE HAS THE BEST WRITING?

WARREN>> HERE WITH MORE NOW IS A SCREENWRITING EXPERT, AUTHOR OF THE BOOK "STORY", ROBERT MCKEE. WELCOME TO OUR PROGRAM.

ROBERT MCKEE>> THANK YOU, WARREN, VAL.

WARREN>> TELL US WHAT YOU HAVE TO JUDGE WHEN YOU ARE DECIDED WHO WROTE THE BEST SCREENPLAY.

ROBERT MCKEE>> WELL, MOST OF PEOPLE, I THINK, PROBABLY JUST GO WITH THEIR GUTS, AS THEY SAY, AND JUST "I LIKED THIS ONE BEST OF ALL." THEY'RE ALL --

WARREN>> BUT WHAT'S AN EXPERT DO?

ROBERT MCKEE>> WELL, THEY'RE ALL EXCELLENT. IN TRYING TO SORT OUT ACHIEVEMENT AND QUALITY, IT'S VERY DIFFICULT. FOR EXAMPLE, IN THE CASE OF ORIGINAL SCREENPLAYS, THE WRITER'S GUILD HAS NOMINATED FIVE EXCELLENT FILMS, BUT OF FIVE VERY DIFFERENT GENRES. YOU HAVE AN ACTION FILM LIKE THREE KINGS. YOU HAVE A GHOST STORY, THE SIXTH SENSE, SOCIAL DRAMA, FATHER AND SON THING, MAGNOLIA. A WONDERFULLY ORIGINAL FANTASY CALLED BEING JOHN MALKOVICH AND A SCATHING SATIRE TRAGI-COMEDY, AMERICAN BEAUTY. HOW, WHEN THEY'RE SO DIFFERENT AND THEIR AMBITIONS ARE SO DIFFERENT, DO YOU JUDGE THEM ULTIMATELY? I THINK THE TEST FOR ME WOULD BE TO SORT THROUGH THEM ALL WITH THE THOUGHT OF MEANING AND EMOTION. HOW MUCH KNOWLEDGE, REALLY, OF HUMAN NATURE, INSIGHT INTO SOCIETY, INSIGHT INTO PEOPLE IS IN THESE SCRIPTS RELATIVE TO ONE ANOTHER? AND EMOTION? HOW DO THEY TAKE THAT KNOWLEDGE AND WRAP IT INTO A DEEP EXPERIENCE OF SOME KIND THAT SATISFIES?

WARREN>> LET'S TAKE A LOOK AT AN EXAMPLE OF ONE. FIRST OF ALL, BEING JOHN MALKOVICH.

ROBERT MCKEE>> WELL, IF WE COULD JUST GIVE THE AWARD FOR ORIGINALITY, BEING JOHN MALKOVICH IS THE MOST WONDERFUL CONCEPT, AS WE SAY, IN MANY A YEAR.

VAL>> WE'RE GOING TO TAKE A LOOK.

[FILM CLIP]

WARREN>> SO A WILLING SUSPENSION OF DISBELIEF IS REQUIRED?

ROBERT MCKEE>> AND WHAT'S WONDERFUL ABOUT THIS FILM IS THAT IT ECHOES A NUMBER OF EXCELLENT FILMS THESE YEARS. THEY'RE ALL ROUGHLY ABOUT THE SAME TOPIC, WHICH IS IDENTITY. PEOPLE LACKING IDENTITY. PEOPLE NOT FEELING COMFORTABLE IN THEIR OWN SKINS SEEKING TO BE SOMEONE OR SOMETHING ELSE. OF ALL OF THEM, THIS IS THE MOST BRILLIANT. BUT MY VOTE WOULD ULTIMATELY GO TO AMERICAN BEAUTY.

VAL>> WE'RE GOING TO TAKE A LOOK AT THAT. HERE'S A LITTLE CLIP.

[FILM CLIP]

WARREN>> OKAY. YOU'RE TRYING TO JUDGE A SCRIPT. HOW DO YOU DISTINGUISH BETWEEN THE SCRIPT ITSELF AND THE ACADEMY AWARD-STYLE ACTING THAT WE JUST SAW?

ROBERT MCKEE>> WELL, THE TWO ARE ONE ULTIMATELY, BUT YOU KNOW THAT ACTORS OF THIS QUALITY WOULD NOT BE IN THIS FILM IF IT WEREN'T FOR THE WRITING THAT THEY RECOGNIZED IN THE FIRST PLACE AND THE ROLES -- I MEAN, THESE ARE SUPERB CHARACTERS. AND, FOR THE MOST PART, THE ACTORS ARE NOT MAKING UP THAT DIALOGUE AND THEY'RE NOT BUILDING THOSE SCENES BEAT BY BEAT. THEY'RE EXPRESSING THIS AND I'M SURE THERE'S SOME IMPROVISATION GOING ON HERE AND THERE. BUT ULTIMATELY, ACTORS KNOW THAT THEY WANT A GREAT ROLE IN A GREAT STORY. WHEN THEY READ THE WHOLE SCREENPLAY AND THEY SEE THAT AMERICAN BEAUTY IS, I THINK AS A SCREENPLAY, AS A FILM, IS NOT JUST THE FILM OF THE YEAR, THE FILM OF THE DECADE, THAT THEY KNEW THAT THIS WAS MATERIAL FOR THEM. SO THE ABILITY OF THE MATERIAL TO ATTRACT GREAT ACTORS SPEAKS FOR ITSELF AND THEN THEY TAKE IT AS THEY WILL AND GIVE THESE SUPERB PERFORMANCES. IT'S NOT ONLY THESE TWO ACTORS, BY THE WAY, BUT THIS WHOLE CAST --

WARREN>> OH, SURE.

ROBERT MCKEE>> -- IN AMERICAN BEAUTY. I WAS PARTICULARLY MIFFED THAT CHRIS COOPER WHO PLAYS THE FATHER NEXT DOOR DID NOT GET AN OSCAR NOMINATION FOR BEST SUPPORTING. THE WHOLE FILM HINGES ON HIS PERFORMANCE ULTIMATELY IN THAT KEY SCENE IN THE GARAGE. IF THAT ACTOR CAN'T MAKE THAT MOMENT, THIS FILM COULD BE LUDICROUS.

VAL>> WELL, I DON'T NECESSARILY WANT TO GET DISTRACTED BY THE ACTING. I WANT TO STICK TO THE WRITING.

ROBERT MCKEE>> YES.

VAL>> A WHOLE ANOTHER KIND OF CHALLENGE OCCURS WHEN ONE HAS TO ADAPT AN EXISTING NOVEL --

ROBERT MCKEE>> INDEED, INDEED.

VAL>> -- AND SO WE'RE GOING TO LOOK NOW AT A WHOLE DIFFERENT CATEGORY OF WRITING AND THAT IS THE BEST SCREENPLAY FROM PRE-PUBLISHED MATERIAL. WHAT'S THE LINE-UP?

ROBERT MCKEE>> HERE YOU'VE GOT FIVE FILMS. AGAIN, ALL EXCELLENT. ADAPTING IN TWO CASES FROM FACT. OCTOBER SKY, WHICH IS I THINK A WONDERFUL FILM AND A FINE ADAPTATION OF A SOLID AUTOBIOGRAPHY, VERSUS THE INSIDER, WHICH IS BASED ON AN ARTICLE.

WARREN>> QUICKLY, LET'S TAKE A LOOK AT OCTOBER SKY.

[FILM CLIP]

WARREN>> SO WHERE DID IT COME FROM? WHERE WAS IT BEFORE IT BECAME A SCREENPLAY?

VAL>> THIS WAS A SHORT BIOGRAPHY, YOU SAY?

WARREN>> AUTOBIOGRAPHY.

ROBERT MCKEE>> YES.

WARREN>> I JUST WONDERED WHAT IT HAD BEEN BEFORE IT WAS A SCREENPLAY AND YOU SAID IT WAS AN AUTOBIOGRAPHY.

ROBERT MCKEE>> YES. A MEMOIR, REALLY, OF AN ADULT SCIENTIST LOOKING BACK ON HIS CHILDHOOD IN POVERTY AND HOW HE MANAGED TO PULL HIMSELF OUT OF THAT AND BECOME A ROCKET SCIENTIST LITERALLY.

VAL>> AS A WRITER, ONE WOULD THINK IT'S EASIER BECAUSE YOU'RE STARTING WITH EXISTING MATERIAL. YOU DON'T HAVE TO COME UP WITH A STORY LINE. YOU DON'T HAVE TO COME UP WITH A CHARACTER. SO WHAT IS THE CHALLENGE TO ADAPTING MATERIAL?

ROBERT MCKEE>> WELL, IN MANY CASES, THE CHALLENGE IS THAT THE NOVEL SIMPLY WILL NOT FIT THE SCREEN. IT ISN'T A MATTER OF ADAPTATION. YOU JUST CAN'T SHIFT IT SIDEWAYS. YOU'RE GOING TO HAVE TO RE-INVENT IT. JOHN IRVING WENT THROUGH THIS --

VAL>> THE CIDER HOUSE RULES.

ROBERT MCKEE>> -- WITH HIS OWN NOVEL, WHICH WAS MUCH TOO LARGE FOR A FILM, SO HE COLLAPSED CHARACTERS, HE TRUNCATED, HE CUT, HE WENT THROUGH 50 DRAFTS TO GET TO THE SCREENPLAY HE FINALLY DID. ON THE OTHER HAND, MY PERSONAL FAVORITE OF ALL THE CHOICES IS THE TALENTED MR. RIPLEY.

WARREN>> STOP RIGHT THERE AND WE'RE GOING TO SHOW A CLIP FROM THE TALENTED MR. RIPLEY. LET'S TAKE A LOOK AT THAT.

[FILM CLIP]

VAL>> NOW WHY IS THIS YOUR CHOICE FOR BEST WRITING? THERE WAS THE CIDER HOUSE RULES, ELECTION, THE INSIDER, ALL SUPERB SCREENPLAYS.

ROBERT MCKEE>> BECAUSE IT HAS, AS I SAID, A KNOWLEDGE, I THINK, AN INSIGHT INTO HUMAN NATURE AND AN EMOTIONAL CHARGE, IN MY MONEY, MORE POWERFUL THAN THE CIDER HOUSE RULES, WHICH I THINK IS A SWEET FILM, A LOVELY FILM AND NICE CHARACTERS, BUT A BIT TOO SWEET FOR ME. ON THE OTHER HAND, I KNOW A LOT OF PEOPLE DON'T LIKE THE TALENTED MR. RIPLEY BECAUSE THEY COULD NOT EMPATHIZE WITH THAT CHARACTER. THEY ADMIT MATT DAMON'S PERFORMANCE WAS WONDERFUL, BUT THEY JUST COULD NOT EMPATHIZE. ON THE OTHER HAND, THEY EMPATHIZED --

WARREN>> WHY NOT? WHAT WAS IT ABOUT THE CHARACTER THAT --

ROBERT MCKEE>> WELL, HE'S A PERSON WHO'S WILLING TO COMMIT MURDER TO GET WHAT HE WANTS AND A LOT OF PEOPLE FIND IT HARD TO GET INSIDE THE SKIN OF SUCH A PERSON.

WARREN>> LITTLE TOUGH.

ROBERT MCKEE>> I DON'T. OTHERS DO. I FIND IT HARD TO GET INSIDE OF TOBEY MAGUIRE'S SKIN IN CIDER HOUSE. IT WAS A WONDERFUL CHARACTER, I THINK, BUT A BIT TOO SWEET FOR ME. SO IT DOES ULTIMATELY LITERALLY COME DOWN TO TASTES SWEET AND SOUR AND I LIKE THE SOUR.

WARREN>> WE'RE GOING TO HAVE TO SEE WHETHER SWEET OR SOUR WINS AND WE'RE GOING TO HAVE TO WAIT FOR THAT. THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR BEING WITH US, ROBERT MCKEE. GOOD TO HAVE YOU.

ROBERT MCKEE>> IT'S ALWAYS A PLEASURE.

WARREN>> WRITER'S GUILD AWARDS WILL BE ANNOUNCED THIS SUNDAY, MARCH 5.

VAL>> THAT IS OUR PROGRAM FOR TONIGHT.

TOMORROW, THE INCUMBENT ANSWERS HIS CHALLENGERS. AN INTERVIEW WITH LOS ANGELES DISTRICT ATTORNEY, GIL GARCETTI. AND THE REPUBLICAN RACE FOR THE OVAL OFFICE COMES TO SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA AND ONE CANDIDATE IS PLAYING TO THE CROWD.

JOHN MCCAIN>> WE HAVE SEEN MANY, MANY SIGNS NOW: "VEGETARIANS FOR MCCAIN". SO NOW THAT WE HAVE THE HIPPIE AND VEGETARIAN VOTE, I THINK WE'RE IN PRETTY GOOD SHAPE.

WARREN>> THAT'S COMING UP TOMORROW ON LIFE AND TIMES TONIGHT.

TOMORROW ON WHICH WAY LA, THE POLICE ADMIT TO CORRUPTION, BUT SHOULD THE BUCK STOP AT THE LAPD? IN THE WAR ON CRIME, DO COPS GET THEIR CUES FROM POLITICIANS AND THE MEDIA? THAT'S TOMORROW.

KCRW 89.9 FM, WHICH WAY LA
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VAL>> THANK YOU FOR WATCHING. FOR ALL OF US HERE AT LIFE AND TIMES TONIGHT, HAVE A WONDERFUL EVENING. TAKE CARE.

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