7/18/00

LC000718

VAL>> ON LIFE AND TIMES TONIGHT --

WARREN>> A POPULAR NEIGHBORHOOD IS GETTING A MAKEOVER, BUT SOME SMALL SHOP OWNERS SEE A CONSPIRACY IN ALL THE CONSTRUCTION.

NOAH NELSON>> IN THE PAST YEAR, SOME STORES ALONG SANTA MONICA BOULEVARD HAVE CLOSED DUE EITHER TO THE CONSTRUCTION OR TO THE NATURAL CALAMITIES OF DOING BUSINESS.

RANDY SCOTT VIG>> THIS PLAN IS TO GET RID OF A LOT OF THE LITTLE BUSINESSES, THE RIFFRAFF, AND THEN TO GET IN ALL THE, LIKE, THE BIG COMPANIES LIKE URBAN OUTFITTERS, GAP, ALL THE BIG RESTAURANTS, AND THAT'S GOING TO CHANGE THE WHOLE SENSE OF THE NEIGHBORHOOD.

VAL>> AND ON TONIGHT'S THINKERS, SHAKERS & NEWSMAKERS, WE'LL ASK ONE SIMPLE QUESTION. WHY DO PRESCRIPTION DRUGS COST SO MUCH? SOME STRAIGHT ANSWERS FROM AN EXPERT WITH THE USC SCHOOL OF PHARMACY.

WARREN>> ALSO TONIGHT, IS IT ART, IS IT AN ILLUSION, OR IS IT SCIENCE? A NEW EXHIBIT GOES BEHIND THE HOCUS-POCUS TO SEE WHAT REALLY HAPPENS AFTER PERFORMERS BEGIN TO DO THEIR MAGIC.

VAL>> THESE STORIES COMING UP NEXT ON LIFE AND TIMES TONIGHT FOR TUESDAY, JULY 18, 2000.

LIFE AND TIMES TONIGHT IS MADE POSSIBLE BY THE FOLLOWING FOUNDATIONS:

THE JAMES IRVINE FOUNDATION
WHICH IS DEDICATED TO THE DEVELOPMENT OF AN INFORMED CALIFORNIA CITIZENRY.

AND THE L.K. WHITTIER FOUNDATION
DEDICATED TO IMPROVING THE QUALITY OF LIFE BY SUPPORTING INNOVATIVE ENDEAVORS IN THE FIELDS OF MEDICINE, HEALTH, SCIENCE AND EDUCATION.

WARREN>> GOOD EVENING, I'M WARREN OLNEY.

VAL>> AND I'M VAL ZAVALA.

WARREN>> OUR TOP STORY TONIGHT, THE PRICE OF PROGRESS. SANTA MONICA BOULEVARD IN WEST HOLLYWOOD IS UNDERGOING A $35 MILLION DOLLAR RENOVATION. THE PROJECT IS AT THE HALFWAY POINT, ON TARGET FOR COMPLETION NEXT YEAR, BUT WHAT IS IT DOING TO THE SMALL BUSINESSES THAT LINE THE STREET?

VAL>> EVEN LOYAL CUSTOMERS HAVE A TOUGH TIME NEGOTIATING TORN UP SIDEWALKS AND OPEN TRENCHES. CITY LEADERS SAY THE PROJECT WILL TRANSFORM SANTA MONICA BOULEVARD INTO THE CHAMPS ELYSEES OF THE WEST, BUT SOME BUSINESS OWNERS WONDER IF THEY'LL BE AROUND TO SEE IT. NOAH NELSON HAS THIS REPORT.

NOAH>> FOR ALMOST A YEAR NOW, SANTA MONICA BOULEVARD THROUGH THE CITY OF WEST HOLLYWOOD HAS LOOKED LIKE A BATTLE ZONE WITH ITS TRENCHES AND BIG MACHINES AND, IF YOU'VE TRIED TO DRIVE DOWN THE BOULEVARD, THIS IS WHAT YOU GET. A FRUSTRATING, SNAKE-LIKE TRAFFIC JAM.

THIS IS WHAT THE CITY OF WEST HOLLYWOOD SAYS THE BOULEVARD WILL LOOK LIKE A YEAR FROM NOW, A DAZZLING, TREE-LINED THOROUGHFARE OF STORES, RESTAURANTS AND NIGHT SPOTS. BUT THAT RESULT CAN'T COME TOO SOON FOR MANY OF THE SMALL BUSINESS PEOPLE IN THE AREA, PEOPLE LIKE COLIN MITCHELL WHO RUNS THE SAPORI CUCINA RESTAURANT.

COLIN MITCHELL>> AS YOU CAN HEAR IN THE BACKGROUND HERE, IT'S CAUSED A LOT OF PROBLEMS. I MEAN, I WOULD SAY IT'S CUT BUSINESS IN HALF. IT'S REALLY TAKING AWAY FROM ANY PARKING. YOU KNOW, PARKING HAS ALWAYS BEEN A PROBLEM IN THIS PARTICULAR AREA TO BEGIN WITH, SO PEOPLE CAN BARELY EVEN SEE THE RESTAURANT SOMETIMES FOR THE CONSTRUCTION. SO THAT'S CAUSED A LOT OF PROBLEMS.

NOAH>> IN THE PAST YEAR, SOME STORES ALONG SANTA MONICA BOULEVARD HAVE CLOSED DUE EITHER TO THE CONSTRUCTION OR TO THE NATURAL CALAMITIES OF DOING BUSINESS. MOST STORES LIKE FUTURE MAN CLOTHIERS HAVE HUNG ON, THOUGH MANAGER RANDY SCOTT VIG FEELS THE CITY IS CONSPIRING AGAINST SMALLER MERCHANTS.

RANDY SCOTT VIG>> THEY SAID THEY WERE GOING TO DO A BLOCK BY BLOCK LIKE YOU WOULD IN EUROPE AND THAT WOULD HAVE HELPED A LOT OF THE BUSINESSES, BUT THIS PLAN IS TO GET RID OF A LOT OF THE LITTLE BUSINESSES, THE RIFFRAFF, AND THEN TO GET IN ALL THE, LIKE, THE BIG COMPANIES LIKE URBAN OUTFITTERS, GAP, ALL THE BIG RESTAURANTS, AND THAT'S GOING TO CHANGE THE WHOLE SENSE OF THE NEIGHBORHOOD AND THE SENSE OF COMMUNITY IS GONE BECAUSE ALL THESE BUSINESSES THAT ARE CLOSING HAVE BEEN HERE FOR YEARS AND THEY'RE THE ONES THAT STARTED WITH HOLLYWOOD WHEN THERE WAS NOTHING.

NOAH>> MANY IN THE CITY'S SIGNIFICANT GAY AND LESBIAN POPULATION ARE AFRAID THAT ALL THE CHANGES WILL CAUSE THE CITY TO LOSE ITS CASUALNESS AND ITS CHARM AND SELL ITS SOUL TO CORPORATE AMERICA.

PAUL AREVALO>> WE'VE DONE EVERYTHING WE POSSIBLY CAN TO EXPEDITE THIS PROJECT AND NO ONE'S TRYING TO MAKE THE PROJECT GO ANY SLOWER.

NOAH>> CITY PLANNERS AND CITY STAFF MEMBERS SAY THEY ARE SENSITIVE TO EVERYONE'S CULTURAL AND BUSINESS CONCERNS. IN MEETINGS, THEY DISCUSS WAYS TO EMPHASIZE THE POSITIVES OF THE PROJECT.

RICK RYAN>> SOME PEOPLE RAISE CONCERNS ABOUT TRAFFIC, BUT I HAVE TO TELL YOU, THE OVERALL TONE UNANIMOUSLY IS THAT PEOPLE ARE ECSTATIC WITH THE WAY THE NEW SIDEWALKS LOOK EAST OF LA CIENEGA.

NOAH>> AN AD CAMPAIGN HAS BEEN DESIGNED TO GET THE WORD OUT THAT A NEW PART OF SANTA MONICA BOULEVARD IS ON THE WAY. THE CITY HAS EVEN DESIGNED A WEB SITE FOR AREA BUSINESSES TO ADVERTISE THEMSELVES.

BRIAN COOK>> THE CITY SPECIFICALLY BUILT THIS WEB SITE TO HELP, YOU KNOW, LESSEN SOME OF THE IMPACT AND THIS IS PART OF OUR OVERALL MARKETING CAMPAIGN THAT WE'RE DEVELOPING TO SELL SANTA MONICA BOULEVARD AS A SHOPPING, DINING AND ENTERTAINMENT DESTINATION.

NOAH>> WEST HOLLYWOOD SAYS IT IS EMBRACING, NOT ABANDONING, SMALL BUSINESS.

PAUL AREVALO>> WE HAVE DONE A MAJOR COMMUNITY OUTREACH. WE MEET WITH THE BUSINESSES REGULARLY. WE HAVE A BOULEVARD OFFICE THAT ANY BUSINESS WITH A PROBLEM OR A SITUATION CAN CALL IN AND GET AN IMMEDIATE RESPONSE. ALL IN ALL, WE RECOGNIZE THAT IT'S DIFFICULT TO DO BUSINESS AND WE'RE DOING EVERYTHING WITHIN OUR POWERS TO HELP THOSE BUSINESSES.

NOAH>> TO EASE THE BURDEN OF LOST REVENUE, THE CITY PLANS TO GIVE BUSINESSES SOME TAX RELIEF.

JOAN ENGLISH>> WE'RE DOING A REBATE ON PEOPLES' BUSINESS LICENSE TAX. BUSINESSES THAT HAVE A GROSS OF UP TO ABOUT A MILLION DOLLARS A YEAR EFFECTIVELY WILL PAY NO BUSINESS LICENSE TAX DURING THIS CONSTRUCTION PERIOD.

NOAH>> AFTER MONTHS OF THERE BEING ALMOST NOWHERE TO WALK, NEW SIDEWALKS ARE BEING POURED AND SIGNS HAVE BEEN CREATED TELLING THE PUBLIC WHAT STORES ARE OPEN.

JEFF HUFFNER IS WITH THE CITY. IT'S HIS JOB TO GO OUT AND MAKE SURE THAT THE CITY HAS A HUMAN FACE FOR BUSINESS OWNERS TO TALK TO.

JEFF HUFFNER>> THERE'S A LOT OF RUMORS THAT GET STARTED THAT WE JUST TRY TO CONSTANTLY GO OUT AND SAY -- YOU KNOW, THEY SAY, "OH, WELL, WE HEARD THE CONTRACTOR IS NOT WORKING NEXT WEEK" AND WE'RE, LIKE, "NO, THAT'S NOT TRUE. THEY WORK SIX DAYS A WEEK, 7:00 A.M. TO 4:00 P.M. THEY START AT NIGHTTIME HOURS NOW." SO WE JUST BASICALLY TRY TO GIVE THEM THE CORRECT INFORMATION AND ENCOURAGE THEM TO ALSO TALK TO THEIR ADJACENT PROPERTY OWNERS TO KIND OF PUT THOSE KIND OF RUMORS AND THINGS LIKE THAT TO REST.

NOAH>> NOW THAT SOME PEOPLE ARE SEEING PROGRESS, HUFFNER'S JOB IS GETTING EASIER.

JEFF HUFFNER>> JUST WANTED TO COME SEE IF EVERYTHING'S GOING ALL RIGHT.

>> I HOPE EVERYTHING IS GOING ALL RIGHT HERE. I TOLD EVERYBODY I'M GOING TO BE IN MY DANCING CLOTHES TOMORROW.

JEFF HUFFNER>> THAT'S PERFECT, THAT'S PERFECT.

NOAH>> A FEW MONTHS AGO, HARDWARE STORE OWNER, ROSS WILSON, WASN'T SURE ANY OF THIS WOULD HELP HIS BUSINESS. NOW HE FEELS DIFFERENTLY.

ROSS WILSON>> AT THE FIRST, WE ALL HUNG AROUND AND KIND OF CRIED ABOUT OUR BAD LUCK AND ALL THAT OF HAVING SO MANY IMPACTS FROM THE BOULEVARD RECONSTRUCTION, BUT AT THIS POINT, WE CAN SEE DEFINITELY THE LIGHT AT THE END OF THE TUNNEL. WE CAN SEE THAT THINGS ARE GOING TO BE GREAT. IT'S GOING TO BE GREAT FOR THE WHOLE NEIGHBORHOOD.

NOAH>> NEW MERCHANTS LIKE MUSIC STORE OWNER, JEFF TARDIFF, BELIEVES, IN THE END, THE BOULEVARD WILL LOOK BETTER, BUT LOOKING BETTER ISN'T ALWAYS A GOOD THING.

JEFF TARDIFF>> MY ONLY CONCERN IS THAT IT DOESN'T DRIVE UP THE PROPERTY VALUES SO MUCH THAT IT'S GOING TO SCARE OFF ALL THE SMALLER BUSINESSES LIKE MYSELF THAT MIGHT NOT BE ABLE TO PAY THE RENT THAT EVERYONE'S GOING TO WIND UP ASKING FOR WHEN THE CONSTRUCTION'S DONE. I HATE TO SEE THIS TURN INTO ANOTHER THIRD STREET PROMENADE WITH A GAP AND URBAN OUTFITTERS AND ALL THE BIG CHAINS DOWN HERE. IT'S NICE THE WAY IT IS AND IT WOULD BE NICE TO KEEP IT THAT SAME WAY, BUT I DON'T THINK IT WILL.

WARREN>> THAT'S A VERY INTERESTING POINT ABOUT THE RENTS THAT MIGHT BE CHARGED AFTER THE PROJECT IS COMPLETED, BECAUSE THIS REALLY DOES LOOK LIKE IT'S GOING TO BE QUITE AN ELEGANT PLACE, AND THE FIRST THING PROPERTY OWNERS WANT TO DO UNDER THOSE CIRCUMSTANCES, ESPECIALLY IF THEY THINK THERE ARE A LOT OF CUSTOMERS COMING IN, IS TO RAISE THE RENT.

NOAH>> WELL, SOME RENTS HAVE GONE UP ALREADY --

WARREN>> -- ALREADY?

NOAH>> -- AND THOSE SMALL BUSINESS OWNERS ARE SAYING WE CAN'T PAY THAT AND, IF IT DOES GO UP, WE'LL HAVE TO GO OUT OF BUSINESS.

WARREN>> ARE THEY SAYING THAT THE RENTS ARE GOING UP NOW IN ORDER TO FORCE THEM OUT OF BUSINESS TO MAKE ROOM FOR SOMEBODY COMING LATER?

NOAH>> THERE'S A THOUGHT BY SOME PEOPLE WHO OPERATE THERE THAT THE CITY WANTS THEM OUT SO THAT THE BIG CORPORATE CONCERNS CAN COME IN AND MAKE IT A REALLY BIG AFFAIR.

VAL>> SO, IN THE LONG RUN, WHAT DOES THE CITY HOPE TO GAIN FROM ALL THIS?

NOAH>> THE CITY WANTS IT TO BE ANOTHER THIRD STREET PROMENADE.

VAL>> THEY DO?

NOAH>> THEY DO.

VAL>> THEY SAY THAT STRAIGHT UP?

NOAH>> THEY SAY IT STRAIGHT UP. WE WANT THIS TO LOOK LIKE THIRD STREET. WE WANT THE SAME KIND OF TRAFFIC FLOW THAT COMES OVER FROM ALL OVER TOWN TO COME TO WEST HOLLYWOOD, LIKE PEOPLE GO OVER TO THE WEST SIDE NOW.

VAL>> BUT, OF COURSE, THE THIRD STREET PROMENADE DOESN'T HAVE TRAFFIC LANES THROUGH IT, SO IT WOULD BE FUNDAMENTALLY DIFFERENT IN THAT RESPECT.

NOAH>> BUT I THINK WHAT THEY'RE TALKING ABOUT IS A PLACE WHERE PEOPLE GO AND GET ENTERTAINED AND EAT AND IT BECOMES KNOWN AS THAT KIND OF PLACE.

VAL>> OF COURSE, THEY SAY THE CHAMPS ELYSEES IS WHAT THEY'RE TRYING TO IMITATE, WHICH IS, IN FACT, VERY LARGE BUSINESSES. THERE'S A DISNEY STORE AND EVERYTHING LIKE THAT, SO I DON'T KNOW IF THAT'S NECESSARILY SOMETHING YOU WANT TO EMULATE.

NOAH>> HIGH HOPES.

VAL>> AND A FEW FRENCH LESSONS. THANK YOU VERY MUCH, NOAH, FOR THAT REPORT.

OUR TOP STORY TOMORROW NIGHT, IS THE LONG BEACH AQUARIUM IN FINANCIAL TROUBLE OR HAS IT JUST HIT ROUGH WATER IN ITS DRIVE TO BECOME A MAJOR TOURIST DESTINATION?

>> SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA DESERVES AN AQUARIUM. I DON'T THINK WE HAVE ANYTHING TO PROVE TO THOSE PEOPLE. I'M ABSOLUTELY CONVINCED THAT WE'RE GOING TO BE SUCCESSFUL AND WE'RE DOING THAT FOR THE PEOPLE WHO COME HERE, FOR THE ANIMALS, FOR OUR MISSION, OUR PRESERVATION CONSERVATION AND THEN FOR THE CITY OF LONG BEACH.

VAL>> THAT'S TOMORROW ON LIFE AND TIMES TONIGHT AT 7:00 P.M.

WARREN>> WHEN YOU FEEL SICK, YOU GO TO THE DOCTOR. YOU GET A PRESCRIPTION AND THEN YOU HEAD TO THE PHARMACY TO GET IT FILLED. BUT WHEN YOU PICK UP YOUR MEDICINE AND REACH FOR YOUR WALLET, THE PRICE MAY BE A BIT HARD TO TAKE.

VAL>> PRESCRIPTION DRUG PRICES ARE SOARING AND, IF YOU'RE LUCKY ENOUGH TO HAVE GOOD HEALTH INSURANCE, YOU MAY NOT HAVE EVEN NOTICED IT. BUT IF YOU'RE UNINSURED OR ON MEDICARE, THE COST OF DRUGS CAN HAVE A SERIOUS IMPACT ON YOUR BUDGET. SO WHAT'S BEHIND THE RISE IN DRUG COSTS? THAT'S THE QUESTION IN TONIGHT'S THINKERS, SHAKERS & NEWSMAKERS.

WARREN>> JOINING US NOW IS BRAD WILLIAMS. HE IS A PROFESSOR AT THE USC SCHOOL OF PHARMACY AND HE SPECIALIZES IN GERIATRIC PHARMACOLOGY. GOOD TO HAVE YOU WITH US.

BRAD WILLIAMS>> THANK YOU.

WARREN>> GERIATRIC PHARMACOLOGY. THE OLD FOLKS PARTICULARLY ARE HARD HIT WHEN THE PRICE OF DRUGS GOES UP BECAUSE THEY USE MORE THAN ANYBODY ELSE.

BRAD WILLIAMS>> EXTREMELY. THEY USE OVER A THIRD OF THE PRESCRIPTION DRUGS PURCHASED IN THE UNITED STATES EVERY YEAR.

WARREN>> SO WHY ARE DRUGS SO EXPENSIVE?

BRAD WILLIAMS>> WELL, I THINK THERE'S A LOT OF REASONS. WE ARE PRODUCING MORE SOPHISTICATED, BETTER TARGETED DRUGS THAT ARE BETTER TOLERATED. I THINK THAT'S PART OF IT. I THINK HEALTH INSURANCE COVERAGE HAS REMOVED PEOPLE FROM THE CONCERN TO SOME DEGREE. THE COST OF ADVERTISING PRESCRIPTION DRUGS IS VERY BIG BUSINESS, AND PEOPLE EXPECT TO TAKE MEDICATION. WE'RE TREATING THINGS WITH DRUGS NOW THAT USED TO PUT PEOPLE IN THE HOSPITAL. SO, A LOT OF FACTORS.

VAL>> BUT WHY IS IT MORE EXPENSIVE HERE? BECAUSE YOU HEAR THAT, IN EUROPE, IN CANADA, OTHER COUNTRIES THAT HAVE VERY SOPHISTICATED USE OF DRUGS, THE COST IS NOT AS HIGH. WHAT ARE WE DOING WRONG? WHAT ARE THEY DOING RIGHT?

BRAD WILLIAMS>> WELL, I DON'T KNOW IF IT'S WRONG OR RIGHT. I'LL LEAVE THAT TO THE POLICY PEOPLE. BUT WHAT WE'RE DOING DIFFERENTLY IS NOT PUTTING PRICE CONTROLS ON MEDICATION.

VAL>> SO WE HAVE A COMPLETELY FREE MARKET HERE WHEN IT COMES TO PRESCRIPTION DRUGS?

BRAD WILLIAMS>> RIGHT.

WARREN>> WHAT ABOUT THE PATENT SYSTEM THAT WE HAVE AND THE USE OF BRAND NAME AS OPPOSED TO GENERIC DRUGS WHEN THEY BECOME AVAILABLE? AREN'T THOSE MAJOR COST FACTORS?

BRAD WILLIAMS>> THEY ARE TO A LARGE DEGREE AND I THINK IT TAKES SEVEN TO TEN YEARS SOMETIMES TO BRING A DRUG TO MARKET. THE PATENT CLOCK STARTS RUNNING AT DISCOVERY, NOT AT MARKETING, SO DRUG COMPANIES DO WANT TO GET THEIR MONEY BACK. GENERIC DRUGS DO HELP CUT INTO THAT, BUT EVEN WITH GENERIC DRUGS, YOU OFTEN FIND THE BRAND NAME IS STILL QUITE A BIT MORE EXPENSIVE. PEOPLE BELIEVE THAT THE BRAND NAME IS BETTER, ALTHOUGH THERE'S NOT A LOT OF DATA TO SUPPORT THAT.

VAL>> WHAT'S YOUR BASIC BELIEF? DO DRUG COMPANIES GOUGE THE PUBLIC OR DO THEY NOT?

BRAD WILLIAMS>> GOUGE MIGHT BE A STRONG TERM TO USE BECAUSE I THINK THAT THEY, LIKE ANY OTHER BUSINESS, ARE TRYING TO MAXIMIZE THEIR PROFITS FOR THEIR SHAREHOLDERS, BUT I THINK THERE ARE A LOT OF THINGS THAT COULD BE LESS EXPENSIVE. I THINK THEY REALLY DO TRY AND CONVINCE PEOPLE THAT THEIR MEDICATIONS ARE THE BEST, BUT MANY TIMES, WHEN YOU LOOK ACROSS A DRUG CLASS, THE DIFFERENCES ARE FAIRLY MARGINAL. COMPETITION REALLY DOESN'T PLAY AS STRONG A ROLE WITH MEDICATIONS AS IT DOES WITH MOST CONSUMER PRODUCTS.

WARREN>> WHAT ABOUT THE IMPACT OF DRUG ADVERTISING IN THE SENSE THAT IT CREATES A DEMAND FOR DRUGS? PATIENTS GO IN, THEN, TO DOCTORS AND THEY HAVE THE EXPECTATION THAT THEY'RE GOING TO GET DRUGS IN ORDER TO DEAL WITH THEIR PROBLEMS AND PUT PRESSURE ON DOCTORS TO PRESCRIBE DRUGS EVEN IF THOUGH THEY DON'T NEED THEM.

BRAD WILLIAMS>> THAT'S CERTAINLY THERE. I THINK, IF PRESCRIBING WERE NOT TO SOME DEGREE PATIENT-DRIVEN, DRUG COMPANIES WOULDN'T ADVERTISE. THEY ADVERTISE BECAUSE IT PRODUCES A RESULT. I DO THINK PEOPLE GO IN AND SOMETIMES THEY SAY I WANT THIS MEDICINE BECAUSE I READ ABOUT IT AND THERE MAY BE SOMETHING A WHOLE LOT LESS EXPENSIVE THAT'S AVAILABLE AND AS EFFECTIVE. ANTIHISTAMINES, FOR EXAMPLE. THERE ARE PRESCRIPTION ANTIHISTAMINES THAT DO THE EXACT SAME THING THAT THE NON-PRESCRIPTION DRUGS DO. THEY MAY CAUSE A LITTLE LESS DROWSINESS, YOU MAY HAVE TO TAKE THEM FEWER TIMES A DAY, BUT IS IT WORTH A TEN OR TWENTY TIMES PRICE DIFFERENTIAL? PROBABLY NOT.

VAL>> WHICH LEADS US TO SOME OF THE THINGS THE CONSUMERS CAN DO TO ACTUALLY HELP KEEP THE COST OF THEIR PRESCRIPTION DRUGS DOWN. ONE IS TO ALWAYS ASK YOUR DOCTOR IF THERE IS AN OVER-THE-COUNTER ALTERNATIVE TO THE PRESCRIPTION, CORRECT? AND I WAS ALSO VERY INTERESTED TO DISCOVER THAT DRUG COMPANIES DO HAVE FREE DRUG PROGRAMS FOR PEOPLE WHO REALLY ARE NEEDY AND POOR.

BRAD WILLIAMS>> THEY'RE NOT WELL ADVERTISED. THEY'RE SOMEWHAT -- THEY DON'T BRING AS MUCH MONEY. BUT THEY'RE RELATIVELY DIFFICULT TO GET HOLD OF. THERE ARE OFTEN MANY STEPS THAT PEOPLE HAVE TO GO THROUGH, IT REQUIRES THE PHYSICIAN TO WRITE A LETTER, IT'S OFTEN FOR A SHORT PERIOD OF TIME. BUT FOR PEOPLE WHO DO NEED MEDICATIONS AND CAN'T GET THEM ANY OTHER WAY, IT'S AN OPPORTUNITY.

VAL>> IT'S SOMETHING THEY SHOULD DEFINITELY LOOK INTO?

BRAD WILLIAMS>> YES.

WARREN>> IS THERE A TENDENCY ON THE PART OF DRUG COMPANIES TO DO RESEARCH INTO AILMENTS, RELATIVELY EXOTIC AILMENTS, THAT WILL LEAD TO THE DEVELOPMENT OF RATHER HIGH-PRICED DRUGS THAT THEY CAN CHARGE A LOT FOR RATHER THAN CONCERNS THAT EVERYBODY HAS THAT MIGHT BE TREATABLE IN LESS EXPENSIVE WAYS?

BRAD WILLIAMS>> I'M NOT SURE IT WOULD BE LIMITED JUST TO THE EXOTIC DISEASES BECAUSE THOSE ARE THINGS THAT THEY'RE NOT GOING TO RECOVER THEIR COSTS ON, BUT THEY OFTEN WANT THE HIGH-PROFILE THINGS THAT EVERYBODY SEEMS TO HAVE OR EVERYBODY COMPLAINS OF. ARTHRITIS, HIGH BLOOD PRESSURE, HIGH CHOLESTEROL SYMPTOMS, PAIN MANAGEMENT, ALLERGIES, THOSE KINDS OF THINGS.

VAL>> I SEE. I ALSO UNDERSTAND THAT YOU CAN ASK YOUR DOCTOR FOR FREE SAMPLES AND THERE'S CERTAIN TIMES OF THE YEAR WHEN THE DRUG COMPANIES JUST FLOOD DOCTORS WITH FREE SAMPLES. SO ONE SUGGESTION WAS, BEFORE ALLERGY SEASON, MAKE YOUR DOCTOR'S APPOINTMENT THEN WHEN YOU'RE MORE LIKELY TO GET THOSE FREE SAMPLES.

BRAD WILLIAMS>> AND THAT WILL WORK.

WARREN>> DO THEY SUBSIDIZE THE RESEARCH FOR DRUGS OF AN UNUSUAL NATURE WITH THE PROFITS THAT THEY MAKE OFF MORE COMMON ONES?

BRAD WILLIAMS>> I THINK THAT PROBABLY OCCURS TO SOME DEGREE. PART OF THAT'S SPURRED BY PATENT PROTECTION. DRUGS THAT OTHERWISE WOULD NOT BE ABLE TO RETURN A PROFIT ARE GIVEN WHAT'S CALLED "ORPHAN DRUG" STATUS, SO A DRUG --

VAL>> "ORPHAN"?

BRAD WILLIAMS>> -- "ORPHAN DRUG". IT'S A COMMERCIALLY NOT VIABLE MEDICATION FOR RELATIVELY RARE DISEASE. THERE ARE TAX INCENTIVES THAT WILL ALLOW THE DRUG COMPANY TO GET SOME PATENT PROTECTION FOR IT TO HELP REDUCE THOSE COSTS AND I THINK THEY DO IT PROBABLY SOME OUT OF THEIR OWN MONEY ALSO, BUT CERTAINLY TAX INCENTIVES GO A LONG WAY TO FOSTERING THAT.

VAL>> NOW THIS HAS BECOME A CAMPAIGN ISSUE. YOU'VE GOT BOTH PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATES TALKING ABOUT IT. DO YOU THINK THAT SOME KIND OF REGULATION OR INCLUDING PRESCRIPTION DRUGS IN OUR MEDICARE SYSTEM IS THE ANSWER? I KNOW IT'S A POLICY QUESTION --

BRAD WILLIAMS>> WELL, I THINK IT'S AN ANSWER. I THINK ONE OF THE THINGS THAT PEOPLE HAVE TO REALIZE IS THAT IT'S GOING TO COST MONEY. SOMEBODY'S GOING TO HAVE TO PAY FOR IT AND IT'S GOING TO INCREASE SOMEBODY'S COST, PROBABLY THE TAXPAYER, PROBABLY THE CONSUMER, BUT IT'S A WAY OUT AND IT IS A WAY TO MAKE MORE MEDICATIONS AFFORDABLE TO PEOPLE WHO NEED THEM.

VAL>> BRAD WILLIAMS WITH THE USC SCHOOL OF PHARMACY, THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR COMING BY. I APPRECIATE IT.

BRAD WILLIAMS>> THANK YOU.

SO, ARE YOU BEING HIT BY THE HIGH COST OF PRESCRIPTIONS AND HAVE YOU FIGURED OUT A WAY TO BEAT THE SYSTEM? WE'D LOVE TO HEAR FROM YOU ABOUT THIS OR ANY OF OUR REPORTS ON LIFE AND TIMES TONIGHT. HERE ARE THE WAYS YOU CAN REACH US:

LIFEANDTIMES@KCET.ORG
WWW.KCET.ORG.
LIFE AND TIMES TONIGHT
4401 SUNSET BLVD.
LOS ANGELES, CA 90027
(323) 953-5555

WARREN>> ALL RIGHT, TELL US NOW. DO YOU BELIEVE IN MAGIC OR IS THE HAND JUST QUICKER THAN THE EYE? A NEW EXHIBIT AT THE CALIFORNIA SCIENCE CENTER PEERS THROUGH THE SMOKE AND MIRRORS TO LOOK AT "MAGIC, THE SCIENCE OF ILLUSION".

VAL>> THE EXHIBIT IS NOT JUST ENTERTAINING. IT ALSO SHOWS VISITORS HOW MAGICIANS USE SCIENTIFIC PRINCIPLES TO CREATE THEIR ILLUSIONS. WE FIND OUT MORE ABOUT THE WONDER OF MAGIC IN TONIGHT'S PEOPLE, PLACES & THINGS.

MAGIC THESE DAYS IS A LOT MORE SOPHISTICATED THAN PULLING A RABBIT FROM A HAT, ALTHOUGH I NEVER COULD DO THAT, AND, REGARDLESS OF THE TRICK, ALL MAGIC IS BASED ON SCIENCE. THE EXHIBITION SHOWS US HOW MAGIC CAN TEACH US ABOUT THE PHYSICAL SCIENCES, MATH AND EVEN PSYCHOLOGY.

WARREN>> AND HERE WITH MORE IS DIANE PERLOV, WHO IS CURATOR OF "MAGIC, THE SCIENCE OF ILLUSION". THANKS SO MUCH FOR BEING WITH US.

DIANE PERLOV>> OH, IT'S MY PLEASURE.

WARREN>> YOU TAKING THE FUN OUT OF ALL THIS?

DIANE PERLOV>> WE HOPE NOT. WE HOPE WE'RE PUTTING FUN INTO IT.

WARREN>> WELL, YOU REALLY DO PUT THE FUN INTO IT AND YOU INTRIGUE PEOPLE BY POINTING OUT THAT THERE IS SCIENCE BEHIND THIS STUFF.

DIANE PERLOV>> YEAH, THIS EXHIBIT IS REALLY ABOUT THE ART AND SCIENCE OF ENTERTAINMENT MAGIC AND WE HAVEN'T TRIED TO TAKE THE FUN OUT OF IT. WHAT WE'VE DONE IS DEVELOP SOME CUSTOM-MADE ILLUSIONS AND SHOW THE ART AND SCIENCE OF THOSE ILLUSIONS SO THAT WE REALLY DON'T INTERFERE WITH THE WORK OF WORKING MAGICIANS, BUT WE REALLY USE MAGIC AS A HOOK TO GET PEOPLE EXCITED ABOUT SCIENCE.

VAL>> I SEE. BECAUSE IF YOU HAD ACTUALLY TAKEN A POPULAR MAGIC TRICK, BEING LIKE A DAVID COPPERFIELD ONE, HE AND OTHERS PROBABLY WOULD NOT HAVE APPRECIATED THAT. SO DID YOU GET THE ENDORSEMENT OF MAGICIANS?

DIANE PERLOV>> WELL, WE WORKED WITH A LOT OF MAGICIANS ON THIS PROGRAM AND THEY HELPED US DESIGN THESE ILLUSIONS. THEY HELPED US ALSO IN ADVISING US ALL ABOUT THE ART AND THE ART OF PERFORMANCE THAT GOES INTO THESE ILLUSIONS, AS WELL AS --

WARREN>> LET US TAKE A LOOK AT SOME OF WHAT YOU'VE GOT. WE HAVE SOME VIDEO THAT SHOWS THE EXHIBITION AND SOME OF THE PERFORMANCES THAT ARE AVAILABLE THERE. TELL US WHAT WE'RE SEEING.

DIANE PERLOV>> WHAT YOU'RE LOOKING AT IS THE MAGICIAN'S TRAINING ACADEMY AND, IN THIS AREA, YOU CAN LEARN TO DO SOME CLOSE-UP MAGIC OF YOUR OWN USING MATH AND PSYCHOLOGY.

VAL>> ARE THE YOUNG PEOPLE WHO VISIT HERE ACTUALLY TAUGHT A LITTLE MAGIC?

DIANE PERLOV>> UM-HUM, THEY'RE TAUGHT THE MAGIC. THIS IS OUR MAGIC THEATER, OUR ABRACADABRA THEATER. IT'S A LIVE, INTERACTIVE TWENTY-MINUTE MAGIC SHOW IN WHICH YOU LEARN ABOUT THE NATURE OF MAGIC AND THE RELATIONSHIP BETWEEN MAGIC AND SCIENCE. WE HAVE SOME ONE-OF-A-KIND ARTIFACTS. THIS IS HOUDINI'S MILK CAN AND HANDCUFFS THAT HOUDINI USED. THESE ARE BIRD CAGES THAT WERE USED BY CHUNG LING SOO, AND THIS IS A HISTORY WALL IN WHICH YOU CAN LEARN ABOUT MAGIC FROM ANCIENT EGYPT TO THE MODERN TIMES.

WARREN>> AND THEN AFTER KIDS, OR AFTER THE AUDIENCE, I HAVE TO INCLUDE MYSELF, I THINK, SEES THE MAGIC TRICKS, THEN THEY GO BEHIND THE SCENES AND SEE HOW THEY ARE PERFORMED. IS ANYBODY DISAPPOINTED?

DIANE PERLOV>> I DON'T THINK SO. IN FACT, WHEN WE'VE HAD VISITORS IN THERE BEFORE TESTING THE EXHIBIT, THEY RESPONDED THAT THEY WERE JUST NOT AWARE THAT SO MUCH WENT INTO MAGIC, THAT SO MUCH WAS BEHIND THE SCENES AND MAGICIANS WORKED SO HARD IN ORDER TO CREATE THESE ILLUSIONS FOR US.

WARREN>> OF COURSE, A GOOD MAGICIAN MAKES IT LOOK EASY.

DIANE PERLOV>> YES, THAT'S RIGHT. THEY MAKE --

WARREN>> -- MAKES IT LOOK LIKE MAGIC.

DIANE PERLOV>> YES, THEY MAKE IT LOOK LIKE MAGIC.

VAL>> SO YOU'VE CREATED FOUR ILLUSIONS. WE'RE GOING TO TAKE A LOOK AT THEM. WHY DON'T YOU TELL US WHAT WE'RE SEEING HERE?

DIANE PERLOV>> OKAY, GREAT. WELL, THIS IS THE DISEMBODIED HEAD ILLUSION. WE CALL IT "THE AMAZING LIVING HEAD". FRONT STAGE, YOU CAN SEE PENN & TELLER DOING A PERFORMANCE OF THIS AND THEN YOU CAN PUT YOUR OWN HEAD ON THIS PLATTER AND SEE YOUR HEAD WITHOUT A BODY. HERE'S TELLER DOING THE SAME ILLUSION. THEY USED OUR SET, ONLY THEY'VE ADDED THE ART OF PERFORMANCE.

THIS IS OUR RISE INTO THE AIR ON A CHAIR. YOU SIT IN A CHAIR AND YOU'RE LEVITATED OFF THE GROUND AND YOU DON'T KNOW HOW IT'S DONE UNTIL YOU GO BEHIND THE SCENES. GOLDFINGER & DOVE ARE THE FEATURED MAGICIANS THAT HELPED US DEVELOP THIS EXHIBIT AND THEY DEVELOPED THE STORY LINE FOR IT AND HELPED US DO THAT.

VAL>> NOW IS THIS BEHIND THE SCENES?

DIANE PERLOV>> NO, THIS IS IN FRONT OF THE SCENE. THIS IS THE AMAZING LIGHT AND HEAVY CHEST IN WHICH A CHEST IS TRANSFORMED FROM LIGHT TO HEAVY BEFORE YOUR VERY EYES FOR NO PARTICULAR REASON.

THIS IS MAX MAVEN READING YOUR MIND. IT HAPPENS REAL TIME. IT'S A VIDEO PROJECTION OF MAX. YOU PICK A SYMBOL ON THE TABLE AND HE JUST ASKS YOU FOUR QUESTIONS AND YOU FIND OUT HOW IT'S DONE.

THIS IS MAX MAVEN ALSO DOING AN ILLUSION IN WHICH HE ASKS YOU TO PICK A NUMBER BETWEEN ONE AND TEN, YOU DO A FEW CALCULATIONS AND HE GETS EVERYBODY TO COME UP WITH A VERY SIMILAR RESULT.

WARREN>> HOW DO YOU DO THAT DISEMBODIED HEAD?

DIANE PERLOV>> OH, YOU HAVE TO COME DOWN AND SEE HOW IT'S DONE.

WARREN>> CAN YOU GIVE US A HINT?

DIANE PERLOV>> YES. THIS ONE'S DONE WITH MIRRORS, LIKE A LOT OF MAGIC IS DONE WITH MIRRORS, BUT THIS ONE USES MIRRORS IN A DIFFERENT WAY THAN MAGICIANS USE MIRRORS BECAUSE, THE POINT IS, WE REALLY WANT PEOPLE TO HAVE AN APPRECIATION FOR MAGIC, BUT ALSO LEARN SOMETHING ABOUT SCIENCE. SO THEY GO BEHIND THE SCENES AND PENN & TELLER AND A VIDEO TALK ABOUT HOW IT'S DONE USING MIRRORS AND ALSO USING PSYCHOLOGY AND THE ART OF PERFORMANCE. YOU GET TO PLAY WITH SOME MIRRORS IN INTERACTIVE EXHIBITS BACKSTAGE, BUT WE ALSO LEAVE YOU WONDERING. WE SHOW YOU VIDEO CLIPS OF DISEMBODIED HEAD ILLUSIONS THAT LOOK SIMILAR, BUT WERE NOT DONE WITH MIRRORS. THEY WERE DONE IN A COMPLETELY DIFFERENT WAY, SO WE LEAVE YOU WONDERING AND LET YOU KNOW THAT THERE'S REALLY MORE TO MAGIC THAN JUST THIS ONE PRINCIPLE.

VAL>> NOW KIDS ARE NOT DISAPPOINTED TO FIND OUT THAT MAGIC IS JUST SMOKE AND MIRRORS? HAVE YOU HEARD ANY COMMENTS FROM YOUNG PEOPLE GOING "AW, GEE"?

DIANE PERLOV>> WHAT WE TRIED TO DO WITH THE EXHIBIT IS REALLY COMMUNICATE TO PEOPLE THAT IT'S MORE THAN A SIMPLE TRICK, THAT THERE'S A LOT OF DIFFERENT THINGS INVOLVED IN MAKING THE ILLUSIONS WORK. CREATING A GOOD STORY, MISDIRECTION, --

VAL>> -- WHAT'S MISDIRECTION?

DIANE PERLOV>> MISDIRECTION IS HAVING PEOPLE LOOK ONE WAY WHEN THE ACTUAL ILLUSION IS --

VAL>> -- OH, DISTRACTION.

DIANE PERLOV>> -- HAPPENING SOMEWHERE ELSE OR HAVING THE SCIENCE HAPPENING ACTUALLY BEFORE YOU'RE PAYING ATTENTION TO IT.

WARREN>> YOU SAY THIS WAS A HOOK TO GET PEOPLE INTERESTED IN SCIENCE OF A BROADER NATURE. GIVE US AN EXAMPLE OF THAT AND HOW WOULD THAT WORK. HOW WOULD IT EXTEND BEYOND THE EVENT ITSELF?

DIANE PERLOV>> WELL, FOR INSTANCE, WITH THE OPTICS, THE SCIENCE OF OPTICS. WE LET PEOPLE KNOW THAT THE MAIN PRINCIPLE INVOLVED IN OUR DISEMBODIED HEAD IS HOW LIGHT BOUNCES OFF A MIRROR AT THE SAME ANGLE AT WHICH IT ARRIVES. THAT'S A PRINCIPLE THAT'S USED IN YOUR REARVIEW MIRROR IN YOUR CAR, IT'S USED IN PERISCOPES. UNDERSTANDING HOW LIGHT BOUNCES OFF A MIRROR ALLOWS YOU TO MANIPULATE MIRRORS IN SUCH A WAY THAT YOU CAN CREATE ILLUSIONS, YOU CAN SEE AROUND CORNERS, YOU CAN SEE THINGS THAT AREN'T REALLY THERE, CREATING ILLUSIONS. SO WE KIND OF SHOW HOW THAT'S DONE.

WARREN>> OKAY, WITHOUT TELLING US HOW IT'S DONE, WHAT'S THE PRINCIPLE INVOLVED IN LIFTING THE CHAIR, THE LEVITATION?

DIANE PERLOV>> OH, THE LEVITATION ILLUSION THAT WE DO IS BASED ON SIMPLE MECHANICS. A LOT OF THEM ARE DONE DIFFERENTLY, BUT WE DO IT WITH SIMPLE MECHANICS OR CAMOUFLAGE.

WARREN>> IS SOMEBODY SOMEPLACE WITH A CRANK?

DIANE PERLOV>> YOU HAVE TO COME BACKSTAGE AND FIND OUT HOW IT'S DONE.

VAL>> AND JUST GIVE US A HINT. HOW ABOUT THE HEAVY AND THE LIGHT CHEST? WHAT'S THE SCIENTIFIC PRINCIPLE THERE?

DIANE PERLOV>> THAT'S AN INTERESTING ONE. THAT IS AN HISTORIC ILLUSION THAT WAS DONE ABOUT A HUNDRED YEARS AGO BY ROBERT HUDAN IN FRANCE AND THAT ONE IS BASED ON ELECTROMAGNETISM. HE USED ELECTROMAGNETISM BEFORE IT WAS FAMILIAR TO THE POPULAR. NOWADAYS THAT ILLUSION ISN'T DONE BECAUSE PEOPLE ARE SO FAMILIAR WITH THE SCIENCE PRINCIPLE. BUT MAGICIANS ARE A LOT LIKE INVENTORS. THEY TINKER WITH SCIENCE PRINCIPLES THAT PEOPLE MIGHT NOT BE FAMILIAR WITH TO CREATE REALLY INTERESTING ILLUSIONS.

WARREN>> GREAT STUFF.

VAL>> FANTASTIC.

WARREN>> THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR COMING IN AND TELLING US ABOUT IT.

DIANE PERLOV>> THANK YOU.

VAL>> THANK YOU SO MUCH, DIANE PERLOV.

IF YOU WANT TO GET MORE ABOUT THE EXHIBIT, YOU CAN CHECK THE NUMBER AND THE WEB SITE ON YOUR SCREEN. IT'S CALLED "MAGIC, THE SCIENCE OF ILLUSION". IT OPENS THIS SATURDAY AT THE CALIFORNIA SCIENCE CENTER IN EXPOSITION PARK.

[323-SCIENCE]
[WWW.CASCIENCECTR.ORG]

WARREN>> THAT'S IT FOR TONIGHT'S PROGRAM. MEANTIME, BACK TO REALITY.

TOMORROW ON WHICH WAY LA, THE FOSTER CARE SYSTEM IN LOS ANGELES LEAVES KIDS ADRIFT WHEN THEY TURN EIGHTEEN. THE AUTHOR OF "WHITE OLEANDER" WILL JOIN OUR DISCUSSION ABOUT REPAIRING A TROUBLED SYSTEM. THAT'S TOMORROW.

KCRW 89.9 FM, WHICH WAY LA
WEEKDAYS FROM 1-2 P.M.
REBROADCAST AT 7:00 P.M.

VAL>> FOR ALL OF US HERE AT LIFE AND TIMES TONIGHT, WE'RE ABOUT TO DO OUR DISAPPEARING ACT. HAVE A GREAT EVENING.

LIFE AND TIMES TONIGHT WAS MADE POSSIBLE BY THE FOLLOWING FOUNDATIONS:

THE JAMES IRVINE FOUNDATION
WHICH IS DEDICATED TO THE DEVELOPMENT OF AN INFORMED CALIFORNIA CITIZENRY.

AND THE L.K. WHITTIER FOUNDATION
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