2/5/02

LC020205

VAL>> ON LIFE AND TIMES TONIGHT --

JESS>> MAYOR JAMES HAHN SAYS NO TO ANOTHER TERM FOR POLICE CHIEF, BERNARD PARKS, BUT THAT'S NOT THE END OF IT. IN FACT, THE BATTLE IS JUST BEGINNING.

NAJEE ALI>> IT'S A SLAP IN THE FACE OF THE BLACK COMMUNITY AND IT'S THE GREATEST ACT OF BETRAYAL I'VE EVER WITNESSED POLITICALLY IN LOS ANGELES.

VAL>> WE'LL ALSO LOOK AT TURMOIL IN HOLLYWOOD, THE NASTY FEUD WITHIN THE SCREEN ACTORS GUILD. YOU'LL RECOGNIZE THE MAIN PLAYERS, ACTORS VALERIE HARPER AND MELISSA GILBERT. BOTH WANT TO LEAD THE UNION, BUT THEIR FIRST ELECTION WAS OVERTURNED. NOW THE SECOND CAMPAIGN HAS MORE INTRIGUE THAN A DAYTIME SOAP OPERA. TONIGHT WE'LL TRY TO UNRAVEL SOME OF THE TANGLED PLOT.

JESS>> AND A LOOK AT THE GREATEST GENERATION THAT EVER WALKED ON FOUR LEGS, MILITARY CANINE SOLDIERS. DURING WORLD WAR II, THE MARINES TRAINED NEARLY 1,000 DOGS AS SCOUTS AND MESSENGERS. TONIGHT PATT MORRISON TALKS WITH THE FORMER COMMANDER OF A WAR DOG PLATOON ABOUT THESE COURAGEOUS ANIMALS AND THEIR FINEST HOURS.

VAL>> THESE STORIES COMING UP NEXT ON LIFE AND TIMES TONIGHT.

LIFE AND TIMES TONIGHT IS MADE POSSIBLE BY THE FOLLOWING FOUNDATIONS:

THE L.K. WHITTIER FOUNDATION
DEDICATED TO IMPROVING THE QUALITY OF LIFE BY SUPPORTING INNOVATIVE ENDEAVORS IN THE FIELDS OF MEDICINE, HEALTH, SCIENCE AND EDUCATION.

THE CALIFORNIA ENDOWMENT
THE STATE'S LARGEST HEALTH FOUNDATION SUPPORTING ORGANIZATIONS THAT DIRECTLY IMPROVE THE HEALTH AND WELL-BEING OF CALIFORNIA'S DIVERSE COMMUNITIES. THE CALIFORNIA ENDOWMENT, A PARTNER FOR HEALTHIER COMMUNITIES.


VAL>> GOOD EVENING, I'M VAL ZAVALA.

JESS>> AND I'M JESS MARLOW.

BERNARD PARKS' CAMPAIGN FOR A SECOND TERM AS LOS ANGELES POLICE CHIEF IS IN BIG TROUBLE AND MANY AFRICAN-AMERICAN LEADERS SAY THEY FEEL BETRAYED BY MAYOR JAMES HAHN, THE MAN THEY HAD HELPED ELECT.

VAL>> TODAY HAHN CAME OUT AGAINST PARKS AND SAID IT MIGHT BE BEST IF THE CHIEF TOOK HIMSELF OUT OF THE RUNNING. BUT THAT'S NOT LIKELY TO HAPPEN AND, IN THE MEANTIME, AS GAY YEE REPORTS, THE BATTLE OVER PARKS' JOB IS BECOMING A MATTER OF RACE.

GAY>> IT WAS A MAJOR BOMBSHELL, BUT CONSIDERING THE HISTORY OF POOR RELATIONS BETWEEN THE MAYOR AND THE CHIEF, IT SHOULD HAVE BEEN NO SURPRISE.

JAMES HAHN>> I'VE INFORMED THE POLICE COMMISSION PRESIDENT, RICK CARUSO, THAT I DO NOT SUPPORT CHIEF PARKS' REAPPOINTMENT AS CHIEF OF POLICE. THE CHIEF AND I HAVE HAD REAL DIFFERENCES ON MAJOR ISSUES, POLICE REFORM, RECRUITMENT AND RETENTION AND COMMUNITY POLICING. IT'S BECAUSE OF THESE DIFFERENCES THAT I CANNOT SUPPORT HIS REAPPOINTMENT.

GAY>> WHAT A DIFFERENCE FROM JUST LAST WEEK WHEN PARKS THREW A PARTY TO CELEBRATE HIS 37 YEARS IN THE LAPD AND TO ANNOUNCE HE WANTED A SECOND FIVE-YEAR TERM.

BERNARD PARKS>> AS PER THE REQUIREMENT OF THE LOS ANGELES POLICE CITY CHARTER, I AM FORMALLY TRANSMITTING MY REQUEST TO THE POLICE COMMISSION FOR A SECOND FIVE-YEAR TERM.

GAY>> IT WAS CLEAR FROM THE FACES IN THE CROWD THAT PARKS HAD THE SUPPORT OF KEY AFRICAN-AMERICAN LEADERS, THE SAME PEOPLE WHO HELPED PUT JAMES HAHN IN THE MAYOR'S OFFICE.

JAMES HAHN>> THE CHIEF AND I CONTINUE TO HAVE MAJOR DIFFERENCES IN THESE THREE CRITICAL AREAS AND A HOUSE DIVIDED CANNOT MOVE FORWARD.

GAY>> THE MAYOR SAYS HE AND THE CHIEF JUST NEVER SAW EYE TO EYE ON MANY THINGS, INCLUDING HOW TO IMPLEMENT THE CONSENT DECREE REFORMS, RECRUIT OFFICERS AND RESTORE COMMUNITY POLICING. LAST NIGHT BEFORE HE WENT PUBLIC WITH HIS DECISION, HE MET WITH DANNY BAKEWELL AND OTHER LEADERS IN THE AFRICAN-AMERICAN COMMUNITY TO BREAK THE NEWS.

DANNY BAKEWELL>> WELL, WE WERE SHOCKED AND HE VERY POLITELY SAID I UNDERSTAND THAT THIS IS NOT SOMETHING THAT YOU WOULD AGREE WITH ME ON, BUT THIS IS A DECISION THAT I'VE MADE AND I WILL BE MAKING THAT ANNOUNCEMENT TOMORROW. I WILL TELL YOU, THERE WAS A GREAT DEAL OF OUTRAGE AND FURY IN THE ROOM.

GAY>> AND IN THE CORRIDORS OF CITY HALL, THERE WAS EQUAL SHOCK AND DISMAY FROM AFRICAN-AMERICAN CITY COUNCIL MEMBERS.

NATE HOLDEN>> I'VE BEEN CLOSE TO THE HAHN FAMILY ALL OF MY POLITICAL CAREER. I'M JUST IN SHOCK. NOT ONLY AM I IN SHOCK, BUT THE PEOPLE THAT I REPRESENT ARE IN SHOCK. THE PEOPLE IN THIS CITY ARE IN SHOCK. THEY'RE IN DISBELIEF.

JAN PERRY>> PEOPLE ARE CALLING IN. THEY'RE ANGRY. THEY'RE DISAPPOINTED. THEY'RE CONFUSED. THIS IS A MAN OF INTEGRITY WITH AN ALREADY DEMONSTRATED TRACK RECORD OF A WILLINGNESS AND AN ABILITY TO IMPLEMENT THE CONSENT DECREE, A MAN WITH A LONG RECORD OF SERVICE.

GAY>> THE MAYOR PRAISED PARKS FOR HIS 37 YEARS ON THE FORCE, BUT HE JUST COULDN'T SUPPORT HIM FOR ANOTHER FIVE AS CHIEF. HE SAYS IT WAS A DIFFICULT DECISION, ONE THAT WASN'T BASED ON POLITICS OR PERSONAL FRIENDSHIPS. BUT NAJEE ALI OF PROJECT ISLAMIC HOPE SAYS THE MAYOR'S DECISION IS A SLAP IN THE FACE FOR THE AFRICAN-AMERICAN COMMUNITY. ALI WAS SO OUTRAGED THAT HE PICKED UP THE PAPERWORK NEEDED TO RECALL THE MAYOR.

NAJEE ALI>> MAYOR HAHN WOULD NOT BE IN OFFICE HAD IT NOT BEEN FOR THE BLACK VOTE. WE PUT MAYOR HAHN IN OFFICE AND FOR HIM NOT TO REAPPOINT CHIEF PARKS AND SUPPORT HIM IS A SLAP IN THE FACE OF THE BLACK COMMUNITY AND IT'S THE GREATEST ACT OF BETRAYAL I'VE EVER WITNESSED POLITICALLY IN LOS ANGELES.

GAY>> ALI'S ANGER ECHOES THAT OF MANY AFRICAN-AMERICANS, STRONG HAHN LOYALISTS WHO NOW CLAIM THE MAYOR IS CAVING UNDER PRESSURE FROM THE POLICE PROTECTIVE LEAGUE, THE UNION THAT'S WAGING A MILLION DOLLAR CAMPAIGN AGAINST THE CHIEF. CITY COUNCILMAN, DENNIS ZINE, IS A FORMER POLICE UNION PRESIDENT. HE SAYS PARKS HAS NO SUPPORT FROM THE RANK AND FILE.

DENNIS ZINE>> WELL, I LOOK AT THIS AS A DECISION FOR THE GOOD OF THE CITY REGARDLESS OF THE COMMUNITIES OF LOS ANGELES. WE NEED TO MAINTAIN PUBLIC SAFETY AND, WHEN AN ORGANIZATION COMES UP WITH A NEARLY 94 PERCENT NO CONFIDENCE IN THE LEADER OF THE ORGANIZATION, THAT'S A CHILLING NUMBER.

GAY>> THE MAYOR SAYS IT ALL BOILS DOWN TO THIS: HE NEEDS SOMEONE HE CAN WORK WITH.

JAMES HAHN>> THE CHIEF IS A WONDERFUL MAN AND A WONDERFUL HUMAN BEING WHOM I ENORMOUSLY RESPECT, BUT WE DISAGREE ON SOME OF THESE FUNDAMENTAL ISSUES. I'M GOING TO HONOR MY COMMITMENT TO THE PEOPLE OF THIS CITY TO DO WHATEVER I CAN TO MAKE SURE THIS IS THE SAFEST BIG CITY IN AMERICA, ONE THAT HAS A POLICE DEPARTMENT THAT DOES RESPECT THE COMMUNITIES THAT IT SERVES. I FELT THAT I NEEDED TO HAVE SOMEBODY THAT I COULD WORK WITH TO ACCOMPLISH THOSE GOALS.

GAY>> HAHN DOESN'T HAVE THE FINAL WORD ON PARKS' REAPPOINTMENT. THAT JOB BELONGS TO THE FIVE-MEMBER POLICE COMMISSION, BUT ALL OF THEM ARE HAHN APPOINTEES.

DANNY BAKEWELL>> ONLY TIME WILL TELL. I THINK, YOU KNOW, MR. HAHN IS BETTING ON THE FACT THAT OUR COMMUNITY HAS A SHORT MEMORY. FOUR YEARS OR THREE AND A HALF YEARS IS A LONG TIME. BUT I WILL TELL YOU THAT TODAY, IF HE WERE RUNNING FOR OFFICE, HE MAY HAVE A LOT OF COMMUNITIES THAT WOULD BE EMBRACING HIM, BUT THE AFRICAN-AMERICAN COMMUNITY WOULD NOT BE ONE OF THEM.

GAY>> FOR DECADES, THE HAHN NAME HAS BEEN A GREAT RACIAL UNIFIER IN LOS ANGELES. MANY SAY TODAY'S ANNOUNCEMENT BY THE MAYOR DOES NOTHING TO CHANGE THAT. BUT IN OPPOSING PARKS, JAMES HAHN CROSSED A DIVIDE THAT SOME AFRICAN-AMERICANS MAY NEVER FORGIVE OR FORGET. IN LOS ANGELES, GAY YEE FOR LIFE AND TIMES.

JESS>> JOINING US NOW ARE TWO VETERAN JOURNALISTS WHO KNOW THE POLITICS SURROUNDING THE LAPD, JILL STEWART WHO COVERS CITY HALL FOR NEW TIMES AND JOE DOMANICK, SENIOR FELLOW AT USC'S INSTITUTE OF JUSTICE.

JILL, LOOKING AT THE POLITICS OF THE ISSUE, THE MAYOR, AS GAY YEE POINTED OUT, DOES NOT HAVE THE FINAL WORD. IT IS THE POLICE COMMISSION THAT MAKES THE DECISION. WHY DIDN'T THE MAYOR DUCK THE ISSUE?

JILL STEWART>> THIS IS INTERESTING BECAUSE, ACTUALLY, THE MAYOR HAS NO SAY AT ALL IN GETTING RID OF CHIEF PARKS. ONLY THE CITY COUNCIL AND THE POLICE COMMISSION PLAY A ROLE IN GETTING RID OF HIM, SO HE COULD HAVE STAYED OUT OF IT COMPLETELY. I AM A LITTLE BIT SURPRISED AND CONFUSED AND DON'T THINK WE'RE HEARING THE FULL ANSWER.

WE WERE PROMISED, I THINK, OVER THE YEARS THAT THE NEW CHARTER WOULD STOP ANYBODY WHO WAS REALLY HORRIBLE FROM BEING THE CHIEF -- NO MORE AWFUL MEMORIES OF DARYL GATES AND SO ON -- BUT THAT THEY WOULDN'T BE MEDDLING IF THEY DISAGREED WITH POLICY. BUT THIS MORNING IN CITY HALL, JAMES HAHN SPOKE AGAIN AND AGAIN ABOUT HOW HE DISAGREED WITH THE CHIEF'S POLICY. SO WE DO INDEED HAVE A MAYOR GOING AFTER A CHIEF FOR POLICY AND I THINK IT'S GOING TO BE INTERESTING TO SEE HOW HAHN DESCRIBES AND EXPLAINS HIS POSITION.

VAL>> BUT EVEN THOUGH THE MAYOR SAYS HE'S GOING AFTER THE POLICE CHIEF ON POLICY, THIS HAS MAJOR RACIAL OVERTONES, YES?

JOE DOMANICK>> IT ONLY HAS MAJOR RACIAL OVERTONES BECAUSE THE AFRICAN-AMERICAN COMMUNITY IS MAKING IT HAVE MAJOR RACIAL OVERTONES. THE FACT OF THE MATTER IS THAT PARKS HAS BEEN A FAILED CHIEF. THE MAYOR HAS A RIGHT AND A DUTY TO TRY TO HOLD HIM TO THE CHRISTOPHER COMMISSION REFORMS, TO NOT INTERFERING AND COOPERATING WITH THE CONSENT DECREE, WITH A WHOLE HOST OF THINGS. YOU KNOW, HE'S TRYING TO IMPLEMENT DISCIPLINE, BUT YOU DON'T IMPLEMENT DISCIPLINE BY ALIENATING ALL OF THE TROOPS AND PART OF THE COMMAND STAFF, THE LOWER PART OF THE COMMAND STAFF. SO BY EVERY MEASURE, I THINK CHIEF PARKS DOESN'T DESERVE TO BE HIRED.

JESS>> THE ISSUE OF RACE CLEARLY IS COMING TO THE FRONT, THOUGH. DOES THAT NOT PRETTY MUCH GUARANTEE THAT, IF PARKS IS RELIEVED, HIS SUCCESSOR WILL ALSO BE AFRICAN-AMERICAN?

JOE DOMANICK>> WELL, I DON'T KNOW ABOUT THAT. I WOULD HOPE THAT THAT WOULD NOT BE A CRITERIA. I WOULD HOPE THAT THE CRITERIA WOULD BE THAT THE NEW CHIEF HAS EXPERIENCE IN REFORMING THE DEPARTMENT, IN COMMUNITY POLICING AND A WHOLE HOST OF DIFFERENT WAYS THAT WILL MAKE THE DEPARTMENT BETTER AND TAKE IT AWAY FROM ITS OLD BAD SELF. WHETHER HE'S AN AFRICAN-AMERICAN OR NOT AN AFRICAN-AMERICAN DOESN'T ENTER INTO IT.

YOU KNOW, L.A.'S HAD TEN YEARS OF AFRICAN-AMERICAN CHIEFS NOW AND I THINK THERE WAS A TIME THAT I WOULD HAVE SUPPORTED, YOU KNOW, THE REQUIREMENT THAT THE CHIEF BE AN AFRICAN-AMERICAN CHIEF. BUT I THINK, AFTER TEN YEARS, WE NEED THE BEST PERSON POSSIBLE OR OTHERWISE WE'RE NEVER GOING TO GET THIS DEPARTMENT REFORMED.

VAL>> JOE IS TALKING AS IF CHIEF PARKS IS ALREADY OUT, BUT NOT NECESSARILY, YES?

JILL STEWART>> DON'T FORGET, CHIEF PARKS IS A VERY INTERESTING FIGHTER AND POLITICAL FIGHTER AND HE STOOD DOWN GIL GARCETTI LAST YEAR AND SORT OF WON WITH THE MEDIA. EVEN THOUGH I AGREE WITH JOE ON THE RACE ISSUE, I DON'T THINK THIS IS ABOUT SKIN COLOR, BUT I DO THINK THE CHIEF HAS BEEN VERY, VERY GOOD AND VERY, VERY HARD ON DISCIPLINE AND REFORM. I DON'T THINK, FOR EXAMPLE, THE FEDERAL MONITOR HAS A LOT OF PROBLEMS WITH CHIEF PARKS, SO WHY DOES THE MAYOR HAVE SO MANY PROBLEMS?

I'M AFRAID THAT THE BLACK COMMUNITY IS GOING TO GO WITH SKIN COLOR ON THIS, BUT THAT'S NOT WHY JAMES HAHN IS TARGETING THE CHIEF. WHY IS HE TARGETING THE CHIEF? I'M NOT SURE. I KNOW HE DOESN'T LIKE WORKING WITH THE CHIEF. HE DOESN'T LIKE THE CHIEF DISAGREEING WITH HIM, BUT JAMES HAHN IS NOT THE CHIEF'S BOSS. THE POLICE COMMISSION IS.

JESS>> THE INSIDERS ARE SAYING THE POLICE COMMISSION IS PROBABLY GOING TO COME DOWN THREE TO TWO AGAINST PARKS. IF THAT HAPPENS, THE CITY COUNCIL IS ALREADY BEING LOBBIED. IT TAKES, WHAT, A TWO-THIRDS VOTE OF THE CITY COUNCIL TO OVERTURN A POLICE COMMISSION RULING?

JILL STEWART>> THE CITY COUNCIL HAS TO HAVE TEN VOTES TO INTERCEDE EITHER WAY, TO STOP THE CHIEF FROM BEING LET GO OR TO SAVE THE CHIEF FROM BEING FORCED OUT.

JESS>> IS THAT LIKELY TO HAPPEN? CAN THEY GET TEN VOTES?

JILL STEWART>> WELL, NOBODY KNOWS. THERE'S A LOT OF VOTE-COUNTING GOING ON. I THINK A LOT OF CITY COUNCIL MEMBERS ARE GOING TO WAIT AND SEE. A LOT OF PEOPLE WOULD LIKE TO KNOW, FOR EXAMPLE, WHAT THE MOST RECENT REPORTS WILL SAY FROM THE FEDERAL CONSENT DECREE MONITOR. IF THE MONITOR IS HAPPY AND ALL THESE MEETINGS THAT ARE HAPPENING WITH THE CONSENT DECREE WORKING GROUP ARE GOING AS WELL AS I'VE HEARD, THEN I THINK THE MAYOR IS GOING TO HAVE TO EXPLAIN WHAT ARE YOU SO UNHAPPY ABOUT? WHAT'S YOUR PROBLEM?

VAL>> JOE, FINAL WORD. NEXT THIRTY DAYS, IT LOOKS LIKE THEY MAY FAST-TRACK THIS, IS IT GOING TO GET UGLY?

JOE DOMANICK>> I CAN'T SEE HOW IT'S NOT GOING TO GET UGLY. WHEN YOU INJECT RACE INTO A VOLATILE ISSUE LIKE THIS, IT'S GOING TO BE VERY UGLY.

VAL>> BAD TO SEE, BUT WE'LL BE FOLLOWING IT VERY CLOSELY. JILL STEWART, AND JOE DOMANICK FROM USC, THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR COMING IN.

JILL STEWART> THANK YOU.

VAL>> TOMORROW ON LIFE AND TIMES, BIG SPENDERS ARE FILLING THE AIRWAVES WITH CAMPAIGN ADS IN THE CALIFORNIA GOVERNOR'S RACE, BUT WHO'S COMING UP WITH ALL THAT CASH AND ARE THE VOTERS BUYING IT?

>> I DON'T LIKE MUDSLINGING IN ANY CAMPAIGN, SO, YOU KNOW, I'M NOT TOO CRAZY ABOUT THAT. I'D RATHER THEY ADDRESS THE ISSUES RATHER THAN TAKING SHOTS AT EACH OTHER.

JESS>> WE'RE TOLD THAT, IF SOMEONE WROTE A SCRIPT BASED ON THE SCREEN ACTORS GUILD ELECTION, THEY'D HAVE ENOUGH MATERIAL FOR A MINI-SERIES. IT'S ALL ABOUT THE BITTER FIGHT BETWEEN TWO FAMILIAR FACES, ACTORS VALERIE HARPER OF "RHODA" FAME AND MELISSA GILBERT, KNOWN TO MANY FROM HER CHILDHOOD ROLE ON "LITTLE HOUSE ON THE PRAIRIE". LAST NOVEMBER, GILBERT WON THE FIRST RACE FOR THE UNION PRESIDENCY, BUT THE ELECTION RESULTS WERE SCRAPPED OVER A TECHNICALITY AND THAT HAS SET THE STAGE FOR A REMATCH.

VAL>> WITH US NOW IS ACTOR, MIKE FARRELL. HE IS HERE TO HELP SORT THINGS OUT. HE WAS ELECTED FIRST VICE PRESIDENT OF SAG ON THE SAME SLATE AS MELISSA GILBERT, WE SHOULD SAY. WELCOME, MIKE, TO LIFE AND TIMES.

MIKE FARRELL>> THANK YOU. NICE TO BE HERE.

JESS>> MIKE, WE'RE TOLD THE ISSUE IS REALLY BETWEEN AGGRESSIVE ACTIVISTS AND MODERATE PRAGMATISTS. (LAUGHTER) WHAT DOES THIS MEAN?

MIKE FARRELL>> OH, I THINK THEY'RE TRYING TO COLOR IT IN A WAY THAT SUGGESTS THAT THERE'S A LEGITIMATE REASON FOR A RE-ELECTION. THERE IS NO LEGITIMATE REASON FOR RE-RUNNING THIS ELECTION. IT IS REALLY A KIND OF PATHETIC DISPLAY OF POWER POLITICS.

JESS>> BUT MISTAKES WERE MADE IN THE BALLOTS, WEREN'T THERE?

MIKE FARRELL>> TWO MINOR TECHNICAL MISTAKES WERE CAUGHT AND THEY CAN -- WHAT THEY SHOULD HAVE DONE, WHAT THIS ELECTION COMMITTEE SHOULD HAVE DONE, WAS SAID THERE WERE TWO MINOR TECHNICAL MISTAKES THAT MADE NO DIFFERENCE IN THE OUTCOME OF THE ELECTION. THE ELECTION SHOULD BE CERTIFIED. WE SHOULD MOVE ON AND THE NEXT TIME WE HAVE AN ELECTION, IF THOSE PROBLEMS ARE PROBLEMS, WE CAN FIX THEM. BUT, I MEAN, IT'S TRULY NONSENSICAL THAT WE'RE HAVING THIS. WE'RE WASTING BETWEEN $100,000 AND $200,000 DOING IT.

VAL>> NOW, YOU'RE OBVIOUSLY SUPPORTIVE OF MELISSA GILBERT, BUT WHAT IS IT ABOUT THE VALERIE HARPER FACTION THAT MAKES THEM SO DETERMINED TO HAVE ANOTHER ELECTION? WHAT IS THE ISSUE THAT THEY'RE SO CONCERNED ABOUT?

MIKE FARRELL>> WELL, THERE ARE A NUMBER OF ISSUES THEY CLAIM TO BE CONCERNED ABOUT, BUT, YOU KNOW, THERE'S REALLY NOT A DIME'S WORTH OF DIFFERENCE IN TERMS OF WHAT WE WANT AS OPPOSED TO WHAT THEY WANT OR WHAT ONE WANTS AS OPPOSED TO WHAT THE OTHER WANTS.

VAL>> IN ALL THE MAJOR ISSUES LIKE RUNAWAY PRODUCTION AND SO FORTH?

MIKE FARRELL>> RUNAWAY PRODUCTION, WE WANT TO END. THE GLOBAL RULE ONE, WE WELL WANT TO SUPPORT. THE IDEA OF NOT HAVING OUR AGENTS BE OUR EMPLOYERS IS ONE THAT'S BEATEN TO DEATH.

JESS>> GLOBAL RULE ONE, EXPLAIN.

MIKE FARRELL>> PART OF THE SCREEN ACTORS GUILD RULES IS THAT WE ARE MEMBERS OF A UNION AND WE SHOULD NOT ONLY BE MEMBERS OF A UNION WHEN WE WORK IN THE UNITED STATES, BUT WE SHOULD BE MEMBERS OF THE SAME UNION WHEN WE GO OUT OF THE COUNTRY.

VAL>> OH, INTERESTING.

MIKE FARRELL>> THAT'S ONE WAY TO STOP RUNAWAY PRODUCTION. ONE OF THE THINGS THAT COSTS SO MUCH TO ACTORS IS, WHEN YOU GO OUT OF THE COUNTRY AND WORK, YOU LOSE YOUR RIGHT TO RESIDUALS, YOU LOSE YOUR PENSION AND WELFARE PAYMENTS, YOU LOSE ALL OF THE THINGS THAT UNION PROTECTIONS GIVE YOU. BUT WE HAVE TO DO AN EDUCATION PROGRAM WITH THE MEMBERS.

JESS>> BUT THEY BOTH SUPPORT THAT?

MIKE FARRELL>> BOTH SUPPORT THAT, SURE.

VAL>> SO WHY THIS DIFFERENCE? WHY THE --

MIKE FARRELL>> -- WELL, THE FACT IS, THERE ARE SOME SORE LOSERS HERE WHO SIMPLY WERE IN CONTROL OF THE COMMITTEE THAT MADE THE DECISION AND DIDN'T WANT MELISSA GILBERT TO BE ELECTED. IT IS REALLY AN OUTRAGEOUS DECISION AND IT IS ONE THAT'S SCANDALOUS AS FAR AS I'M CONCERNED. IT'S GOING TO REALLY CAUSE REPERCUSSIONS IN THE UNION AND IT MAKES US LOOK SO STUPID, YOU KNOW? (LAUGHTER) IT'S JUST SO EMBARRASSING. (LAUGHTER)

JESS>> IS THERE ANY HOLLYWOOD VERSUS NEW YORK ISSUE?

MIKE FARRELL>> NOT BETWEEN MELISSA AND VALERIE, NO.

JESS>> THEY'RE BOTH FROM HOLLYWOOD.

MIKE FARRELL>> THEY'RE BOTH FROM HOLLYWOOD. NO, THERE HAS BEEN SOME TENSION BETWEEN THE GROUP THAT TOOK OVER CONTROL OF THE HOLLYWOOD BOARD AND THE NEW YORK PEOPLE, BUT THAT'S -- YOU KNOW, ONE OF THE THINGS THAT WE WANTED TO DO WHEN MELISSA WAS ELECTED AND I WAS ELECTED WAS TO TRY AND REACH OUT AND KIND OF BRING DOWN THESE HIGH LEVELS OF RHETORIC AND UGLINESS AND PASSION AND GET PEOPLE TO REALIZE THAT IT'S REALLY ABOUT ACTORS WORKING TOGETHER TO MAKE A UNION THE KIND OF EFFECTIVE INSTRUMENT IT USED TO BE INSTEAD OF THIS KIND OF INDULGING POLEMICS.

VAL>> WELL, NOW, IF A SECOND ELECTION DOES HAPPEN, I MEAN --

MIKE FARRELL>> -- IT WILL HAPPEN. IT WILL HAPPEN. WE HAVE NO CHOICE.

VAL>> MELISSA GILBERT DID WIN BY, I THINK, A SOMEWHAT COMFORTABLE MARGIN. SHE DIDN'T SQUEEZE BY.

MIKE FARRELL>> SIX PERCENT OF THE ELECTION. I THINK IN THE NATIONAL ELECTIONS, YOU CONSIDER THAT A SUBSTANTIAL ELECTION, YEAH.

VAL>> RIGHT. SO THERE'S EVERY EXPECTATION THAT I WOULD IMAGINE SHE WOULD ENJOY A VICTORY.

MIKE FARRELL>> ONE WOULD HOPE. YOU KNOW, THERE'S A LOT OF MONEY THAT IS BEING SPENT ON TRYING TO UNDERMINE MELISSA'S ELECTION, TRYING TO UNDERMINE MELISSA'S CREDIBILITY. IT'S VERY SAD.

JESS>> IS THERE THE SUGGESTION THAT SHE'S BEEN WORKING IN NON-UNION PRODUCTIONS?

MIKE FARRELL>> OH, THERE ARE ALL KINDS OF SUGGESTIONS. YOU KNOW, SHE MADE A MISTAKE ONE TIME, SHE WAS BROUGHT UP BEFORE THE UNION. SHE DID HER PENANCE, AS IT WERE. YOU KNOW, IT'S LIKE HOLDING SOMEBODY'S PLACE OF BIRTH AGAINST THEM. WHEN SOMETHING IS BEHIND YOU, IT'S BEHIND YOU. WHAT SHE'S DEMONSTRATED IS HER COMMITMENT TO THE UNION. SHE'S WORKED IN THE UNION. SHE'S BEEN A MEMBER OF THE BOARD. SHE'S WORKED FOR CHILD ACTORS, WHICH IS SOMETHING SHE KNOWS SOMETHING ABOUT. AND SHE HAS TAKEN HOLD OF THE REINS OF THE UNION SINCE SHE'S BEEN IN OFFICE AND DONE A TERRIFIC JOB. SO IT'S JUST REALLY ABOUT PEOPLE THAT DON'T LIKE THE FACT THAT THE ELECTION ENDED UP THE WAY IT DID AND THEY WANT TO SEE IF THEY CAN'T GET ANOTHER BITE OF THE APPLE.

VAL>> NOW, OF COURSE, A LOT OF PEOPLE IN LOS ANGELES ARE INTERESTED IN THIS BECAUSE A LOT OF THEM ARE ACTORS OR CONNECTED SOMEHOW TO SAG. BUT FOR THE AVERAGE PERSON, YOU KNOW, IT'S GOTTEN A LOT OF HEADLINES, WHY SHOULD THEY CARE OR SHOULD THEY?

MIKE FARRELL>> WELL, --

JESS>> -- YOU KNOW, SOME FAMILIAR NAMES --

VAL>> -- YEAH, IT'S FUN TO SEE ACTORS SQUABBLE, BUT --

MIKE FARRELL>> -- IT'S ALL THIS CRAZINESS ABOUT CELEBRITY THAT GETS INVOLVED IN IT. BUT, YOU KNOW, NOBODY WANTS TO SEE A FAIR ELECTION BE OVERTURNED. I THINK PEOPLE GENERALLY REACT TO THAT IN A RESENTFUL MANNER AND I THINK THEY SHOULD.

JESS>> WHAT'S THE STATUS OF REFORM OF THE BOARD FROM REDUCING THE WELL MORE THAN A HUNDRED MEMBERS OF THE BOARD DOWN TO, WHAT, --

MIKE FARRELL>> -- 107 DOWN TO 66, I BELIEVE IT IS, AND THAT'S A PROGRAM THAT MELISSA GOT PASSED IN THE LAST NATIONAL BOARD MEETING.

VAL>> SHRINKING THE BOARD?

MIKE FARRELL>> SHRINKING THE BOARD, YEAH. THE GOVERNANCE PLAN, AS IT WAS CALLED. IT WAS BITTERLY DEBATED AND THE STRUGGLES WERE ABOUT THE POWER CENTER, WHETHER LOS ANGELES WAS GOING TO MAKE ALL THE DECISIONS IN THE WORLD OR WHETHER NEW YORK AND THE BRANCHES WERE GOING TO HAVE AN EQUAL SAY. THESE ARE THE KINDS OF ISSUES THAT HAVE TO BE THRASHED OUT AND WERE. BUT THERE ARE SOME PEOPLE THAT JUST SIMPLY DON'T WANT TO LET GO. THEY WANT TO SAY, YOU KNOW, I WANT IT MY WAY AND I DON'T WANT ANYBODY TO -- I DON'T WANT THE PREPONDERANCE OF THE VOTES GOING TO THE OTHER SIDE, MAKING A DIFFERENCE. I STILL WANT IT MY WAY.

VAL>> INTERESTING. WELL, THE SECOND ELECTION SHOULD BE FINISHED, I THINK, MARCH 8, IS IT?

MIKE FARRELL>> THAT'S CORRECT. MARCH 10 OR 11, SOMETHING LIKE THAT.

VAL>> PERHAPS A REAL RESOLUTION THEN.

MIKE FARRELL>> WON'T IT BE NICE. (LAUGHTER)

VAL>> MIKE FARRELL, THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR COMING IN AND EXPLAINING YOUR SIDE OF THE ISSUE. WE WILL, BY THE WAY, HEAR THE OTHER SIDE OF THE DISPUTE NEXT THURSDAY. THAT'S WHEN WE WILL BE JOINED BY SAG TREASURER, KENT MCCORD. HE RAN ON VALERIE HARPER'S TICKET.

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JESS>> MUCH HAS BEEN SAID AND WRITTEN ABOUT THE GREATEST GENERATION, BUT WE HAVEN'T HEARD MUCH ABOUT THE PART OF IT THAT FOUGHT WORLD WAR II ON FOUR LEGS.

VAL>> TONIGHT YOU'LL LEARN MORE ABOUT THE CANINE HEROES WHO TOOK TO THE BATTLEFIELD ALONGSIDE AMERICA'S SOLDIERS. AND YOU'LL MEET ONE OF THOSE FIGHTING MEN, RETIRED MARINE CAPTAIN, WILLIAM PUTNEY. HE'S WRITTEN A MEMOIR ABOUT COMBAT DOGS. IT'S CALLED "ALWAYS FAITHFUL" AND HE TALKED ABOUT IT WITH OUR OWN PATT MORRISON.

PATT>> DR. PUTNEY, THANK YOU FOR JOINING US.

WILLIAM PUTNEY>> GLAD TO BE HERE.

PATT>> WHEN THE WAR STARTED, YOU WERE OUT OF VETERINARY SCHOOL AND SOON FOUND YOURSELF RUNNING A BOOT CAMP FOR DOGS IN CAMP PENDLETON.

WILLIAM PUTNEY>> WELL, CAMP LEJEUNE, NORTH CAROLINA --

PATT>> -- AND EVENTUALLY CAMP PENDLETON.

WILLIAM PUTNEY>> YES. I WENT INTO THE MARINE CORPS AS AN INFANTRY OFFICER, NOT AS A VETERINARIAN. IT JUST HAPPENED I WAS A VETERINARIAN AND, AFTER I GOT TO THE MARINE CORPS, THEY HAD STARTED THE WAR DOG TRAINING SCHOOL AND MY CARD CAME FLIPPING UP AND THEY SAID, WELL, WE NEED AN OFFICER AND YOU'RE IT. SO I WENT TO THE WAR DOG TRAINING SCHOOL.

PATT>> AND IT WAS JUST HAPPENSTANCE THAT YOU WERE A VETERINARIAN?

WILLIAM PUTNEY>> JUST HAPPENSTANCE.

PATT>> ISN'T THAT THE WAY THE MILITARY ALWAYS DOES THINGS? (LAUGHTER)

WILLIAM PUTNEY>> (LAUGHTER) WELL, IN THIS CASE, IT WORKED OUT VERY WELL BECAUSE, ALTHOUGH I WAS A MILITARY OFFICER IN TRAINING THESE MEN AND THE DOGS, WHEN WE LEFT CAMP LEJEUNE WE DIDN'T HAVE ANY HOSPITAL FOR THEM OR NO MEDICAL SUPPLIES AND THAT WAS TAKEN CARE OF AT CAMP PENDLETON. SO FOR THE REST OF THE WAR OVERSEAS, I ACTED BOTH AS A VETERINARIAN AND AS THE CO OF THE SECOND AND THIRD WAR DOG PLATOONS.

PATT>> DOGS HAVE ALWAYS BEEN USED AS LONG AS THERE HAS BEEN WARFARE. WE'VE GOT THE LINE FROM SHAKESPEARE, YOU KNOW, "CRY HAVOC AND LET'S SLIP THE DOGS OF WAR." THERE'S CERTAINLY A PRESENCE IN THE CIVIL WAR, DEFINITELY IN WORLD WAR I AND, IN WORLD WAR II, THE MARINES HAD THE DEVIL DOGS. BUT THEY WEREN'T ALL DOBERMAN PINSCHERS, DEVIL DOGS. YOU HAD YOUR HANDS FULL WITH ALL KINDS OF DOGS IN CAMP PENDLETON.

WILLIAM PUTNEY>> WELL, MOSTLY OUR DOGS WERE DOBERMANS. THE DOBERMAN PINSCHER CLUB SAID THEY WOULD RECRUIT ALL THE DOGS WE NEEDED. THEN WE HAD SOME DOGS THAT WE'D GOTTEN FROM THE ARMY IN THE BEGINNING, THE NUCLEUS, AND THOSE DOGS WERE DIFFERENT BREEDS. THEN WE CONTINUED TO RECRUIT FROM INDIVIDUAL OWNERS FOR THEIR DOGS, MOSTLY GERMAN SHEPHERDS.

PATT>> WE HAVE PICTURES OF YOU AT YOUR POST ALL READY TO DO YOUR DUTY BY YOUR CANINES. THERE WE GO, AND YOU'RE OPEN FOR BUSINESS.

WILLIAM PUTNEY>> YEAH, THAT WAS AT GUAM, THAT HOSPITAL. THIS PICTURE HERE WAS FROM GUADALCANAL.

PATT>> NOW YOU PUT DOGS THROUGH ALL KINDS OF PACES IN DOG BOOT CAMP. THEY WERE MESSENGER DOGS, THEY WERE MINE-SNIFFING DOGS, THEY DID ALL MANNER OF THINGS. WHAT WAS TRAINING LIKE FOR THEM?

WILLIAM PUTNEY>> WELL, IT WAS VERY MUCH LIKE CIVILIAN OBEDIENCE TRAINING UP TO A POINT. WE DID --

PATT>> -- THEY DIDN'T COMPLAIN ABOUT THE FOOD, THOUGH? (LAUGHTER)

WILLIAM PUTNEY>> THEY NEVER COMPLAINED ABOUT ANYTHING. THEY WERE THE ONLY MARINES THAT DIDN'T BITCH. EVERYBODY ELSE DID, BUT THE DOGS DIDN'T. NEVER.

PATT>> SO WHAT WAS TRAINING LIKE FOR THEM? WHAT KINDS OF THINGS DID THEY HAVE TO DO? THERE WE SEE A LITTLE BIT OF IT.

WILLIAM PUTNEY>> TRAINING BEGAN HEELING, SITTING, MARCHING, HEELING NEXT TO THE HANDLER AS HE WALKED, STAYING DOWN OR WHATEVER POSITION THEY PUT THEM IN TO STAY, AND TO CRAWL. THAT WAS SOMETHING THEY DON'T TEACH CIVILIAN DOGS, BUT IT WAS NECESSARY FOR US BECAUSE THERE WERE MANY TIMES WE HAD TO CRAWL TO GET UNDERNEATH ENEMY FIRE.

PATT>> AND YOU DID GO TO GUAM WITH THESE DOGS, YOU DID GO TO GUADALCANAL. ALL OF THEM PERFORMED HEROICALLY, DOGS LIKE MISSY AND PEPPY. OTHERS OF YOUR FAVORITES, OTHER STORIES THAT YOU HAVE ABOUT THEM?

WILLIAM PUTNEY>> WELL, MISSY WAS ONE OF THE ORIGINAL DOGS THAT WE GOT FROM THE ARMY AND SHE WENT WITH US AS A MESSENGER DOG, PROBABLY THE BEST MESSENGER DOG THERE EVER WAS. SHE WAS ONE OF THE DOGS THAT WAS KILLED IN GUAM AND MISSY IS IN THE WAR DOG CEMETERY THERE.

PATT>> AND THIS IS THE MONUMENT?

WILLIAM PUTNEY>> THE MONUMENT CAME ABOUT BECAUSE, IN 1989, 45 YEARS AFTER THE WAR, I RETURNED TO GUAM AND COULD NOT FIND THE CEMETERY WHERE I HAD PUT IT IN 1944. THROUGH THE HELP OF SOME OF THE PEOPLE IN THE ANIMAL SHELTER, THEY TOLD ME WHERE TO FIND IT. WHEN I DID, I WAS JUST COMPLETELY DEVASTATED. THE VINES HAD GROWN OVER IT, ALL THE LITTLE MARKERS WERE TOSSED ABOUT, WEEDS UP TO YOUR WAIST, AND I GOT REALLY DEPRESSED ABOUT THAT. I KEPT THINKING I AM GOING TO GET THAT CEMETERY MOVED TO A PLACE WHERE THE GOVERNMENT CAN TAKE CARE OF IT IN HONOR OF THOSE DOGS LIKE THEY DO OTHER MEN THAT ARE KILLED IN THE SERVICE.

PATT>> AND HERE'S THE MARKER AND IT'S AT QUANTICO, THE ORIGINAL?

WILLIAM PUTNEY>> THE ORIGINAL ONE WAS PUT AT GUAM.

PATT>> IN GUAM.

WILLIAM PUTNEY>> AND THEN THERE WAS ANOTHER PUT AT THE UNIVERSITY OF TENNESSEE AT THE ENTRANCE TO THE VETERINARY SCHOOL. JUST THIS LAST OCTOBER, THE MARINES HAD ANOTHER ONE PUT AT THE MARINE UNIVERSITY AT QUANTICO.

PATT>> NOW, WAS IT HARD KNOWING -- THE TITLE OF YOUR BOOK IS "ALWAYS FAITHFUL", SEMPER FI, THE MARINE MOTTO. THE DOGS DIDN'T HAVE A CHOICE. THEY GOT DRAFTED. DID IT BOTHER YOU THAT THEY DIDN'T KNOW? THEY COULDN'T ASSESS THE RISKS GOING INTO A MINEFIELD. HOW HARD IS IT BEING A VETERINARIAN AND ANIMAL LOVER TO WORK THEM, KNOWING THAT THEY STOOD A CHANCE OF NOT COMING BACK?

WILLIAM PUTNEY>> WELL, WHEN YOU THINK THAT THERE'S A CHANCE THE HANDLERS WEREN'T GOING TO COME BACK TOO, IT MADE IT MUCH EASIER. WE WEREN'T JUST SENDING THEM OUT THERE TO BE KILLED. WE TRIED TO TRAIN THEM AS BEST WE COULD AND THEIR HANDLERS. THEIR HANDLERS WERE THE BEST-TRAINED SCOUTS WE HAD IN THE MARINE CORPS IN WORLD WAR II.

PATT>> NOW, WHEN THESE DOGS CAME BACK, SOME OF THEM WERE KILLED WITHOUT EVEN GETTING A CHANCE TO BE REHABILITATED AS CIVILIANS. HAS THAT CHANGED?

WILLIAM PUTNEY>> IT WAS CHANGED IN THE MARINE CORPS AS SOON AS I GOT BACK.

PATT>> (LAUGHTER) YOU HAD A HAND IN THAT, I GATHER.

WILLIAM PUTNEY>> I TOLD THEM I WOULD NEVER SIGN -- A VETERINARIAN HAS TO SIGN THE DEATH CERTIFICATE -- I SAID I WOULD NEVER SIGN ONE UNLESS THE DOG HAS HAD AN OPPORTUNITY TO BE DETRAINED AND AVAILABLE TO GO BACK TO CIVILIAN LIFE. I NEVER DID SIGN ONE AND NEVER HAD TO SIGN ONE.

PATT>> DR. WILLIAM PUTNEY, A VET AND A VET, A VETERINARIAN AND A VETERAN, YOUR BOOK "ALWAYS FAITHFUL: A MEMOIR OF THE MARINE DOGS OF WORLD WAR II", VERY MOVING. THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR COMING IN.

WILLIAM PUTNEY>> THANK YOU FOR HAVING ME.

JESS>> THE TITLE OF THE BOOK, AGAIN, "ALWAYS FAITHFUL: A MEMOIR OF THE MARINE DOGS OF WORLD WAR II" BY RETIRED MARINE CAPTAIN, WILLIAM W. PUTNEY.

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