2/19/02

LC020219

VAL>> ON LIFE AND TIMES TONIGHT --

JESS>> IT'S BEEN CALLED ONE OF THE BIGGEST FIASCOS IN THE HISTORY OF LOS ANGELES, A SCHOOL BUILT ATOP A POOL OF DANGEROUS GASES. SO WHY IS THE DISTRICT STILL TALKING ABOUT FINISHING BELMONT?

JOHN SEPICH>> I DO BELIEVE THAT, IF THE MEASURES THEY'RE RECOMMENDING ARE IMPLEMENTED, THE BUILDING WILL BE PERFECTLY SAFE AND MORE THAN SAFE.

VAL>> HE'S A MAJOR BACKER OF CAMPAIGN FINANCE REFORM, SO WHAT DOES CONGRESSMAN RICHARD GEPHARDT THINK ABOUT THE BIG MONEY ENRON GAVE TO GRAY DAVIS?

RICHARD GEPHARDT>> WELL, I HAVEN'T FOLLOWED IT THAT CLOSELY, BUT AS I UNDERSTAND IT, GRAY DAVIS HAS BEEN A CONSTANT AND TOUGH CRITIC OF ENRON AND THE OTHER ENERGY COMPANIES. I REMEMBER, DURING YOUR ENERGY CRISIS OUT HERE, SEEING HIM MAKE VERY TOUGH STATEMENTS ABOUT WHAT ENRON AND OTHERS WERE DOING. I THINK, YOU KNOW --

PHILIP BRUCE>> -- BUT HE DID TAKE THEIR MONEY.

RICHARD GEPHARDT>> WELL, MAYBE THEY DIDN'T GET ANYTHING FOR IT.

JESS>> ALSO, PATT MORRISON IS FAIRLY CERTAIN, IF YOU'RE SEEING THIS PROGRAM, SHE KNOWS WHAT THAT MEANS.

PATT>> RAISE YOUR HAND IF YOU WON THE LOTTERY. I THOUGHT AS MUCH, ON TONIGHT'S INFINITELY MORRISON.

VAL>> AND WHEN IT COMES TO THE ACADEMY AWARDS, HE HAS MORE NOMINATIONS THAN ANY OTHER PERSON ALIVE.

[FILM CLIP]

VAL>> THE MUSIC FOR "HARRY POTTER" IS JUST ONE OF TWO FILM SCORES TO BRING OSCAR RECOGNITION THIS YEAR TO LEGENDARY COMPOSER, JOHN WILLIAMS. TONIGHT THE MAESTRO IS HERE TO TALK ABOUT THAT AND ABOUT SOMETHING COMPLETELY DIFFERENT.

JESS>> THESE STORIES COMING UP NEXT ON LIFE AND TIMES.

LIFE AND TIMES TONIGHT IS MADE POSSIBLE BY THE FOLLOWING FOUNDATIONS:

THE L.K. WHITTIER FOUNDATION
DEDICATED TO IMPROVING THE QUALITY OF LIFE BY SUPPORTING INNOVATIVE ENDEAVORS IN THE FIELDS OF MEDICINE, HEALTH, SCIENCE AND EDUCATION.

THE CALIFORNIA ENDOWMENT
THE STATE'S LARGEST HEALTH FOUNDATION SUPPORTING ORGANIZATIONS THAT DIRECTLY IMPROVE THE HEALTH AND WELL-BEING OF CALIFORNIA'S DIVERSE COMMUNITIES. THE CALIFORNIA ENDOWMENT, A PARTNER FOR HEALTHIER COMMUNITIES.

VAL>> GOOD EVENING, I'M VAL ZAVALA.

JESS>> AND I'M JESS MARLOW.

WHY WOULD ANYONE WANT TO SPEND MORE MONEY ON A DISASTROUS AND ABANDONED PROJECT THAT'S ALREADY COST TAXPAYERS MORE THAN $175 MILLION DOLLARS? THAT'S WHAT CRITICS ARE ASKING AS PART OF THE ONGOING TALKS REGARDING THE BELMONT LEARNING CENTER.

VAL>> L.A. UNIFIED PULLED THE PLUG ON BELMONT AFTER INSPECTORS DISCOVERED THE BUILDING WAS LOCATED ON TOP OF HUGE RESERVES OF POTENTIALLY EXPLOSIVE GAS. BUT NOW SOME EXPERTS SAY THAT PROBLEM IS FIXABLE AND GAY YEE LOOKS AT HOW IT MIGHT BE DONE.

GAY>> THE CONSTRUCTION OF THE BELMONT LEARNING CENTER BROUGHT A SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA PROBLEM TO THE SURFACE. IT CALLED ATTENTION TO DANGERS THAT LURK UNDERGROUND. BELMONT IS ON A FORMER OILFIELD. UNDERNEATH IT, EXPERTS HAVE FOUND EXPLOSIVE METHANE AND HYDROGEN SULFIDE, BUT BELMONT IS NOT ALONE. PLENTY OF PLACES IN THE CITY HAVE SIMILAR PROBLEMS BECAUSE, FOR MUCH OF THIS CENTURY, MUCH OF THE L.A. BASIN WAS DOTTED WITH OIL WELLS.

LLOYD FUKUDA>> THERE ARE METHANE OILFIELDS THROUGHOUT THE LOS ANGELES CITY AREA. WE HAVE METHANE OILFIELDS THAT EXTEND UP THROUGH CHATSWORTH, ALL THE WAY TO VENICE, DOWN TO WILMINGTON AND OUT TO BOYLE HEIGHTS, SO IT PRETTY MUCH COVERS THE PERIMETER OF THE CITY.

GAY>> FIRE INSPECTOR, LLOYD FUKUDA, SAYS PEOPLE KNEW THERE WAS GAS UNDERGROUND, BUT IT TOOK AN EXPLOSION AT 3RD AND FAIRFAX FOURTEEN YEARS AGO TO MAKE THEM REALIZE THEY WERE LIVING AND WORKING ON TOP OF TIME BOMBS. THE ROSS DEPARTMENT STORE WAS BUILT ON TOP OF THE OLD SALT LAKE OILFIELDS. METHANE GAS HAD GOTTEN TRAPPED UNDERNEATH THE BUILDING, GATHERED PRESSURE AND EVENTUALLY EXPLODED.

LLOYD FUKUDA>> WE HAD FLAMES COMING OUT OF THE GROUND THAT WERE AS MUCH AS EIGHTEEN INCHES HIGH.

GAY>> THE ROSS EXPLOSION IN 1985 WAS THE CITY'S WAKE-UP CALL THAT THE METHANE GAS PROBLEM WASN'T CONFINED TO HERE AT 3RD AND FAIRFAX, BUT A PROBLEM IN A LOT OF OTHER PLACES AS WELL. THERE HAD TO BE A WAY TO ALLEVIATE THE METHANE DANGER SO PEOPLE COULD CONTINUE TO LIVE AND WORK. TODAY AT THE ROSS STORE, THERE ARE TUBES UNDERNEATH THE CONCRETE TO DRAW OUT THE METHANE, VENT IT OUT OVER THE PARKING LOT SO PRESSURE DOESN'T BUILD. AND THE AIR INSIDE IS CONSTANTLY MONITORED TO MAKE SURE THE METHANE NEVER GETS TO AN EXPLOSIVE LEVEL. JOHN SEPICH IS THE PRESIDENT OF METHANE SPECIALISTS, WHICH HAS INSTALLED THE MAJORITY OF PROTECTION SYSTEMS IN THE CITY.

JOHN SEPICH>> THE TYPICAL WAY OF MITIGATING NEW CONSTRUCTION FOR METHANE IS TO PUT A SYSTEM OF VENT PIPING AND BARRIERS UNDERNEATH THE NEW BUILDINGS. ALONG WITH THIS PIPE, SOMETHING CALLED A MEMBRANE IS USED AND THAT MEMBRANE WOULD BE PLACED UNDERNEATH THE CONCRETE SLAB OF THE BUILDING, BUT ABOVE THE PIPE, AND THE MEMBRANE WOULD ACT TO DEFLECT GASES INTO THE PIPE AND NOT ALLOW THEM INTO THE BUILDING.

GAY>> SEPICH BELIEVES HIS SYSTEM COULD WORK TO MAKE THE BELMONT LEARNING CENTER SAFE, BUT HIS PLAN WAS REJECTED. THE DISTRICT FELT IT DIDN'T GO FAR ENOUGH EVEN THOUGH IT MEETS ALL CITY REQUIREMENTS.

JOHN SEPICH>> WELL, I BELIEVE THAT THE IMPLEMENTATION OF THE CITY CODE UNDER THOSE BUILDINGS MAKES THE PROJECT PERFECTLY SAFE AND NORMALLY IT WOULD NOT BE NECESSARY TO SPEND ADDITIONAL MONEY OR TO TAKE ADDITIONAL MEASURES. I DO BELIEVE THAT, IF THE MEASURES THEY'RE RECOMMENDING ARE IMPLEMENTED, THE BUILDING WILL BE PERFECTLY SAFE AND MORE THAN SAFE.

DR. BERNARD ENDRES>> THERE IS ABSOLUTELY NO DOUBT WHATSOEVER BELMONT CANNOT BE MADE SAFE.

GAY>> BUT DR. BERNARD ENDRES, WHO WAS A PRIMARY CONSULTANT ON THE ROSS INVESTIGATION, BELIEVES THE CITY CODES DON'T GO FAR ENOUGH BECAUSE THE BELMONT LOCATION IS ON WHAT HE CALLS A GAS OUTCROPPING. ENDRES SAYS THAT BELMONT IS ON TOP OF A SITUATION SIMILAR TO WHAT WE SEE AT THE LA BREA TAR PITS. IT SITS ON TOP OF OIL AND GAS THAT'S MIGRATING TO THE SURFACE.

DR. BERNARD ENDRES>> IT WOULD BE THE EQUIVALENT OF GOING UP TO YELLOWSTONE AND CLAIMING THAT SOMEHOW YOU CAN CONTROL THE "OLD FAITHFUL" WHEN IT RELEASES ITS ENERGY. IT'S A NATURAL FORCE UNDER HERE, UNDER THE SITE, THAT IS SO POWERFUL THERE ISN'T ANY HUMAN CAPABILITY IN ORDER TO CONTROL IT.

JESS>> WITH US NOW IS JOSE HUIZAR. HE'S A MEMBER OF THE LOS ANGELES SCHOOL BOARD AND HE HAS A KEEN INTEREST IN THE FUTURE OF BELMONT. IT'S IN HIS DISTRICT. HE SAYS IT CAN'T BE DONE SAFELY.

JOSE HUIZAR>> NO, I SAY IT CAN BE DONE SAFELY. WHAT WE'VE DONE AT THE SCHOOL DISTRICT IS PUT SOME RATIONALITY AND TAKEN OUT THE POLITICS IN DECIDING WHETHER TO GO FORWARD OR NOT. THE SCHOOL DISTRICT PUT TOGETHER A PANEL OF EXPERTS IN CONSTRUCTION AND ENVIRONMENT AND INSURANCE. THEY ALL TELL US, AND THEY HAVE CONCLUDED, THAT THE SCHOOL CAN BE MADE SAFE USING OFF-THE-SHELF TECHNOLOGY AND THAT IS COMMONLY USED THROUGHOUT CALIFORNIA AND THAT IT CAN BE COMPLETED IN A REASONABLE COST AND TIME. THAT IS SOMETHING THAT THE PEOPLE IN THE BELMONT AREA WERE THRILLED TO HEAR BECAUSE ALL ALONG THEY'VE BEEN SAYING THAT IT CAN BE MADE SAFE.

JESS>> IS $100 MILLION-PLUS A REASONABLE COST?

JOSE HUIZAR>> IT'S A REASONABLE COST WHEN YOU TAKE EVERYTHING ELSE INTO CONSIDERATION. I DO BELIEVE THE SCHOOL BOARD IN 1999 THAT DECIDED NOT TO GO FORWARD WITH THE PROJECT MADE THE RIGHT DECISION BECAUSE, AT THAT TIME, THE SCHOOL DISTRICT DID NOT HAVE PROPER OVERSIGHT OR DO THE PROPER ENVIRONMENTAL REVIEW OF THE SITE, BUT I THINK WE HAVE A STRONG TEAM IN THERE, A STRONG FACILITIES DEPARTMENT THAT KNOWS WHAT IT'S DOING. BETWEEN THE ACTUAL COST THAT OUR EXPERTS ARE TELLING US IS THAT IT WILL COST BETWEEN $60 MILLION TO $80 MILLION DOLLARS TO COMPLETE THE SCHOOL AND HAVE 4,000 ADDITIONAL SEATS FOR AN AREA THAT DESPERATELY NEEDS ADDITIONAL CLASSROOMS.

VAL>> BUT, BOY, THESE MILLIONS ARE ADDING UP. WE HAVE ABOUT $150 MILLION ALREADY SUNK IN AND IT'S GOING TO COST, WHAT, ANOTHER $80 TO $100 MILLION JUST TO DO THE ENVIRONMENTAL MITIGATION AND THEN ANOTHER $80 MILLION TO FINISH THE CONSTRUCTION ITSELF?

JOSE HUIZAR>> NO. TOTAL COMPLETE, IT WILL COST BETWEEN $60 MILLION TO $80 MILLION DOLLARS TO COMPLETE.

VAL>> SO THAT INCLUDES THE ENVIRONMENTAL MITIGATION AND THE FINISHING OF THE CONSTRUCTION?

JOSE HUIZAR>> IT INCLUDES $10 MILLION TO $15 MILLION DOLLARS OF ENVIRONMENTAL TECHNOLOGY TO IMPLEMENT.

VAL>> AND THAT'S KIND OF A MEMBRANE THAT I UNDERSTAND IS GOING TO BE SPREAD ACROSS THE GROUND BASICALLY TO KEEP THE GASES FROM SEEPING --

JOSE HUIZAR>> -- IT INCLUDES A MEMBRANE ACROSS THE ENTIRE FIELD. YOU'VE NEVER SEEN THIS BEFORE. WE ARE TRYING TO MAKE IT AS SAFE AS POSSIBLE. THE ACTUAL -- THERE'S TWO BIDDERS FOR THIS. THE BIDDERS ACTUALLY JUST RECOMMENDED FOR THOSE AREAS IN THE SITE THAT YOU SEE THE GASES, THE METHANE AND HYDROGEN SULFIDE, BUT WE RECOMMENDED ACROSS THE ENTIRE FIELD.

VAL>> THE ENTIRE 34 ACRES.

JOSE HUIZAR>> SO IN TERMS OF COST, IT'S GOING TO COST A TOTAL OF $60 MILLION TO $80 MILLION DOLLARS TO COMPLETE, INCLUDING THE ENVIRONMENTAL MITIGATION.

VAL>> OH, OKAY.

JESS>> THIS, IN SPITE OF THE FACT THAT THE ALLIANCE FOR BETTER COMMUNITIES' BID WAS $98.3 MILLION, COMEX H20'S BID WAS $111 MILLION TO $141 MILLION. NOW SUPERINTENDENT ROMER SAYS THOSE CAN BE BEATEN DOWN.

JOSE HUIZAR>> (LAUGHTER) YES, OUR SUPERINTENDENT AND HIS PANEL OF FINANCIAL EXPERTS TELL US THAT, IF YOU NEGOTIATE WITH A CONTRACTOR, THAT YOU GO FORWARD WITH A GUARANTEED MAXIMUM PRICE, THAT YOU TAKE OFF THE UNCERTAINTIES THAT THESE CONTRACTORS ARE TELLING US THEY'RE ADDING TO REACH $120 MILLION OR $140 MILLION DOLLARS. SO IF YOU TAKE OUT THOSE UNCERTAINTIES, THE CONTRACTORS THEMSELVES WILL BEAR THE RISK INVOLVED FOR $60 MILLION TO $80 MILLION DOLLARS. THAT'S WHAT WE'RE TELLING THEM. THAT'S ALL YOU CAN BILL US FOR AT THE END OF THE DAY WHEN YOU FINISH THE SCHOOL.

JESS>> AND THE DECISION IS MARCH 12.

VAL>> MARCH 12, THE VOTE BY THE SCHOOL BOARD. JOSE HUIZAR, THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR COMING IN. WE'LL BE WATCHING CLOSELY WHAT HAPPENS ON THE 12TH.

JOSE HUIZAR>> THANK YOU FOR HAVING ME.

VAL>> TOMORROW ON LIFE AND TIMES, FITNESS EXPERTS SAY, "USE IT OR LOSE IT". NOW IT SEEMS THE SAME THING APPLIES TO STAYING MENTALLY FIT. WE'LL SEE HOW A NEW MEDICAL STUDY INVOLVING NUNS COULD HELP US ALL BEAT ALZHEIMER'S.

>> I DON'T BELIEVE THOSE MYTHS ABOUT AGING, THAT YOU HAVE TO BE INCAPACITATED OR YOU HAVE TO HAVE DEMENTIA OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT. THAT IS A MYTH. (LAUGHTER)

VAL>> HE'S ONE OF THE TOP DEMOCRATS IN THE COUNTRY AND, BY MOST ACCOUNTS, HE'S INTERESTED IN RUNNING FOR PRESIDENT. THAT MAY BE ONE REASON CONGRESSMAN RICHARD GEPHARDT IS SPENDING TIME IN LOS ANGELES THIS WEEK RAISING MONEY FOR DEMOCRATIC CANDIDATES.

JESS>> GEPHARDT WAS ONE OF THE MAJOR FORCES BEHIND THE CAMPAIGN FINANCE REFORM BILL THAT PASSED THE HOUSE LAST WEEK. HE SAYS IT'S A GOOD STEP TOWARD PREVENTING ANY FUTURE ENRONS, A NAME THAT HAS COME TO SYMBOLIZE WHAT'S WRONG WITH MONEY AND POLITICS. GEPHARDT SAYS THE SCANDAL INVOLVING THE TEXAS ENERGY GIANT AND ITS FORMER CHAIRMAN, KEN LAY, SHOWS THAT HUGE DONATIONS DO BUY ACCESS TO POWER, AND NOT JUST AMONG REPUBLICANS SUCH AS THE BUSH FAMILY. TONIGHT GEPHARDT GOES ONE-ON-ONE WITH OUR PHILIP BRUCE.

PHILIP>> CONGRESSMAN GEPHARDT, THANKS FOR BEING ON LIFE AND TIMES.

RICHARD GEPHARDT>> YOU BET.

PHILIP>> SUNDAY'S WASHINGTON POST POINTED OUT THAT CALIFORNIA IS A MECCA FOR DEMOCRATIC MONEY, BUT MORE IMPORTANTLY, IT'S A VAST POOL OF DEMOCRATIC DELEGATES, MORE THAN ANY PLACE ELSE IN THE COUNTRY. AS WE'VE ALL SEEN RECENTLY, A LOT OF DEMOCRATS ARE TESTING THOSE WATERS FOR A POSSIBLE FUTURE PRESIDENTIAL RUN. CAN WE COUNT YOU AMONG THAT NUMBER FOR THIS VISIT?

RICHARD GEPHARDT>> WELL, THAT'S A DECISION THAT COMES LATER. RIGHT NOW I'M FOCUSED ON WINNING THE HOUSE BACK. I'VE BEEN WORKING AT THAT FOR SEVEN YEARS. WE GOT A GREAT CHANCE IN 2002 AND WE ONLY NEED SIX SEATS TO WIN BACK A MAJORITY IN THE HOUSE, SO THAT'S MY FOCUS. I'LL FIGURE OUT WHAT HAPPENS AFTER THAT, AFTER THAT.

PHILIP>> SEEING A LOT OF DEMOCRATS. WE'RE NOT SEEING AL GORE. WHERE IS HE?

RICHARD GEPHARDT>> WELL, HE'S BEEN MAKING SPEECHES. HE MADE A SPEECH A WEEK AGO, A GOOD ONE, AT THE COUNCIL OF FOREIGN RELATIONS IN NEW YORK. HE'LL BE TALKING A LOT DURING THIS CAMPAIGN. I DON'T KNOW WHAT HIS FUTURE HOLDS, BUT I'M SURE HE'LL HAVE A STRONG ROLE TO PLAY IN OUR POLITICAL LIFE. HE ALWAYS HAS.

PHILIP>> A FEW WEEKS AGO, YOU WERE THE ONE THAT GAVE THE DEMOCRATIC RESPONSE TO THE PRESIDENT'S STATE OF THE UNION. I THINK THAT SPEECH CAME AT A TIME WHEN THE PRESIDENT'S POPULARITY PROBABLY WAS AT ONE OF ITS HIGHEST POINTS. IT HAS NOT GONE DOWN, YET ALL THESE DEMOCRATS ARE OUT LOOKING AT POSSIBLY CHALLENGING HIM. A BIG CHANGE FROM '92 WHEN HIS FATHER WAS PRESIDENT, HAD THE SAME KIND OF NUMBERS AND A LOT OF DEMOCRATS, INCLUDING YOURSELF, THOUGHT TWICE ABOUT RUNNING AGAINST HIM. WHAT'S THE DIFFERENCE NOW AND IN '92? IS GEORGE BUSH BEATABLE?

RICHARD GEPHARDT>> WELL, I DON'T THINK ANYBODY KNOWS THE ANSWER TO THAT. THE TRUTH IS, THINGS CHANGE SO FAST IN POLITICS THAT YOU REALLY CAN'T MAKE THAT KIND OF JUDGMENT. I THINK RIGHT NOW MOST PEOPLE ARE FOCUSED ON 2002. THIS IS A BIG CONGRESSIONAL ELECTION. WE KNOW FROM 2001 THAT EVEN IF THE PRESIDENT IS VERY POPULAR, DEMOCRATS CAN STILL WIN. WE ELECTED A DEMOCRATIC GOVERNOR IN NEW JERSEY AND VIRGINIA WITH GEORGE BUSH AT NINETY IN THE POLLS. THESE ARE LOCAL ELECTIONS, STATE ELECTIONS, AND I THINK THE FOCUS IS GOING TO BE THERE UNTIL WE GET THROUGH 2002.

PHILIP>> THE NIGHT OF THAT STATE OF THE UNION SPEECH WHEN YOU GAVE THE DEMOCRATIC RESPONSE, ONE THING WE DIDN'T HEAR MUCH ABOUT, BUT WE'VE HEARD A LOT ABOUT SINCE, IS THIS SO-CALLED "AXIS OF EVIL" AND THE PRESIDENT POINTING OUT NORTH KOREA, IRAN AND IRAQ BEING PART OF THAT. WAS THAT A MISTAKE?

RICHARD GEPHARDT>> WELL, I THINK THE PRESIDENT'S RIGHT TO SAY THAT COUNTRIES THAT HARBOR AND AID TERRORISTS ARE GOING TO HAVE PROBLEMS WITH THE WORLD COALITION. I THINK THAT NEEDS TO BE SAID AND I THINK HE NEEDS TO KEEP SAYING IT AND WE NEED TO DO THAT. BUT YOU NEED A DIFFERENT POLICY WITH EACH OF THESE COUNTRIES. WHAT WE NEED NOW ARE THE REAL SPECIFICS OF WHAT HE MEANS BY THAT. WHAT ARE WE GOING TO ACTUALLY DO DAY TO DAY IN IRAQ, NORTH KOREA, IRAN? THEY'RE ALL DIFFERENT. THEY HAVE DIFFERENT HISTORIES. THEY HAVE DIFFERENT SITUATIONS. BUT INDEED THEY HAVE CAUSED PROBLEMS AND DIFFICULTIES FOR THE ENTIRE WORLD AND THEY NEED TO BE DEALT WITH. WE JUST NEED TO DO IT IN THE RIGHT WAY. WE'LL BE TRYING TO DEVELOP THAT POLICY WITH THE PRESIDENT.

PHILIP>> YOU BELIEVE THE GROUNDWORK IS BEING LAID NOW FOR SOME SORT OF ACTION AGAINST ANOTHER MEMBER OF THAT SO-CALLED AXIS, IRAQ?

RICHARD GEPHARDT>> I'M NOT SURE. I THINK, FIRST OF ALL, WE NEED TO TRY TO GET THE U.N. INSPECTORS BACK AND I THINK THE WORLD COALITION, AGAIN, NEEDS TO WORK TOGETHER TO GET THAT DONE. IF THAT CAN'T BE DONE, THEN THE WORLD COALITION NEEDS TO TAKE AN ACTION AGAINST IRAQ BECAUSE, IF THEY ARE PREPARING WEAPONS OF MASS DESTRUCTION, IT'S A PROBLEM NOT ONLY FOR US, IT'S A PROBLEM FOR EVERYBODY IN THE WORLD.

PHILIP>> BUT WE MAY HAVE TO GO IT ALONE IF WE GO INTO IRAQ WITH SOME SORT OF MILITARY ACTION. WOULD YOU FAVOR THAT?

RICHARD GEPHARDT>> I THINK YOU NEED TO KEEP THE COALITION TOGETHER. THE PRESIDENT'S DONE A GOOD JOB OF THAT UP UNTIL NOW. WE NEED TO KEEP THAT COALITION TOGETHER AND I THINK WE CAN. YOU ALSO NEED TO LOOK AT THE POSSIBILITY OF DISSENT WITHIN IRAQ. THERE MAY BE GROUPS WITHIN IRAQ THAT WANT TO BRING ABOUT CHANGE, AND WE MIGHT GET HELP FROM SOME OF OUR ALLIES IN THE REGION WHO ARE NOT VERY HAPPY WITH SADDAM HUSSEIN.

PHILIP>> THE BIG NEWS OUT OF CAPITOL HILL, AT LEAST ON THE HOUSE SIDE IN RECENT DAYS, HAS BEEN THE CAMPAIGN FINANCE REFORM BILL WHICH YOU HELPED SHEPHERD THROUGH IN SPITE OF SOME RELUCTANCE ON SOME FOLK'S PART. WHAT'S GOING TO BE THE IMPACT OF THAT? WE'VE HEARD ABOUT THE SO-CALLED END OF SOFT MONEY, THE UNLIMITED CONTRIBUTIONS GOING TO THE PARTIES, BUT CRITICS HAVE POINTED OUT THAT, INSTEAD OF GETTING RID OF THE MONEY PROBLEM, IT JUST KIND OF SCATTERS THINGS ABOUT A BIT.

RICHARD GEPHARDT>> I'M NOT SO SURE OF THAT. MAYBE IN TEN OR TWENTY YEARS, WE'LL NEED TO STOP SOME OTHER LOOPHOLE THAT'S BEEN CREATED, BUT RIGHT NOW I THINK THIS IS OUR BEST HOPE TO CREATE A NEW KIND OF POLITICS IN THIS COUNTRY, ONE THAT'S NOT SO FOCUSED ON HIGH-STAKES FUNDRAISING CAMPAIGNS AND LOTS OF TELEVISION ADS, BUT MORE FOCUSED ON GRASSROOTS ORGANIZING AND CITIZEN PARTICIPATION. THE FUTURE OF OUR DEMOCRACY DEPENDS ON KEEPING PEOPLE INVOLVED IN OUR DEMOCRACY AND, WITH SMALLER CONTRIBUTIONS, YOU'RE NOT GOING TO BE ABLE TO DO BIG TV ADS. YOU'RE GOING TO HAVE TO FOCUS ON GRASSROOTS AND THAT, I THINK, IS A GOOD THING FOR EVERYBODY.

PHILIP>> WELL, NOW, ENRON HAS BECOME THE POSTER CHILD FOR HOW BIG CORPORATIONS CAN SPEND BIG MONEY AND BUY INFLUENCE. DOES THIS BILL END THAT?

RICHARD GEPHARDT>> IT ENDS THAT. YOU CAN'T GIVE A CONTRIBUTION TO THE PARTIES OR THE CANDIDATES OF OVER $2,000 PER PERSON PER ELECTION, SO THAT'S A VERY HARD CAP. I'M SURE THAT PEOPLE WILL TRY TO FIND LOOPHOLES, BUT FOR THE NEAR AND DISTANT FUTURE, I THINK THAT WILL GET RID OF THESE LARGE CONTRIBUTIONS WHICH HAVE SO DOMINATED OUR POLITICS. EVEN IF YOU DON'T BELIEVE THAT INFLUENCE IS REALLY BOUGHT, THE PEOPLE IN THE COUNTRY HAVE BECOME CYNICAL ABOUT WHAT'S REALLY DRIVING OUR POLITICS AND THIS IS A VERY IMPORTANT CHANGE.

PHILIP>> LET ME ADDRESS IT WITH ONE POINT AS FAR AS ENRON IS CONCERNED. ONE OF THE BIG ISSUES NOW IS FOR GRAY DAVIS. ONE OF HIS REPUBLICAN CHALLENGERS POINTS OUT HE TOOK OVER $100,000 IN MONEY FROM ENRON. WAS THAT WRONG? DID THAT TAINT GRAY DAVIS? DID THAT MAKE HIM A LESSER DEMOCRAT OR HURT HIM IN ANY WAY?

RICHARD GEPHARDT>> WELL, I HAVEN'T FOLLOWED IT THAT CLOSELY, BUT AS I UNDERSTAND IT, GRAY DAVIS HAS BEEN A CONSTANT AND TOUGH CRITIC OF ENRON AND THE OTHER ENERGY COMPANIES. I REMEMBER, DURING YOUR ENERGY CRISIS OUT HERE, SEEING HIM MAKE VERY TOUGH STATEMENTS ABOUT WHAT ENRON AND OTHERS WERE DOING. I THINK, YOU KNOW --

PHILIP>> -- BUT HE DID TAKE THEIR MONEY.

RICHARD GEPHARDT>> WELL, MAYBE THEY DIDN'T GET ANYTHING FOR IT. MAYBE THEY GOT TOUGH CRITICISM AND, IF THAT'S THE CASE, THEN I THINK GRAY DAVIS IS OPERATING AS HE SHOULD AS A PUBLIC SERVANT LOOKING OUT FOR THE PUBLIC INTEREST, NOT THE INTEREST OF ANY DONOR.

PHILIP>> CONGRESSMAN, WE'LL HAVE TO LEAVE IT THERE. THANKS SO MUCH FOR JOINING US.

RICHARD GEPHARDT>> THANK YOU.

VAL>> AS DEMOCRATIC HOPEFULS CONTINUE TO FLOCK TO CALIFORNIA FOR MONEY AND CONNECTIONS, THERE'S TALK THAT THE STATE MAY MOVE UP THE DATE OF OUR PRESIDENTIAL PRIMARY IN 2004 FROM MARCH TO FEBRUARY. NOW THAT COULD MAKE CALIFORNIA EVEN MORE INFLUENTIAL IN THE RACE FOR THE WHITE HOUSE.

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JESS>> IT SEEMS EVERYONE WANTS A BIGGER SLICE OF THE PIE, BUT PATT MORRISON POINTS OUT THAT, BY CUTTING SMALLER PIECES, YOU COULD SERVE MORE PEOPLE. HERE'S TONIGHT'S INFINITELY MORRISON.

PATT>> DIDN'T WIN THE LOTTERY? YEAH, NEITHER DID I. ONLY THREE OF US GOT A PRIME CUT OF THE SINGLE BIGGEST STATE JACKPOT IN THE CURIOUS HISTORY OF LOTTERIES. BUT LORD KNOWS, WE TRIED. IN THE LAST FRANTIC HOURS BEFORE THE DRAWING, CALIFORNIANS WERE BUYING LOTTERY TICKETS AT THE RATE OF 100,000 A MINUTE. AVERAGED OUT, IT MEANS EVERY CALIFORNIAN BOUGHT FIVE OR SIX TICKETS, AND EVEN THAT'S LOW BECAUSE, LIKE AN X-RATED MOVIE, NO ONE UNDER EIGHTEEN IS ALLOWED INTO LOTTERY LAND.

NOW SINCE THE LOTTERY WAS INSTITUTED ALMOST SEVENTEEN YEARS AGO, ODD STORIES HAVE EMERGED. A MEXICAN ILLEGAL IMMIGRANT WON $2 MILLION, GOT BOOTED OUT OF THE COUNTRY WITH HIS WINNINGS AND SURFACED SEVEN YEARS LATER ARRESTED FOR HEROINE TRAFFICKING. IN SPITE OF HIS $70,000 ANNUAL CHECK, HE ASKED FOR A FREE PUBLIC DEFENDER. THE JUDGE TOLD HIM TO KISS HIS FOOT.

THERE ARE ALWAYS RUMORS OF THE RICH GETTING RICHER WITH THE LOTTERY. THE QUEEN OF ENGLAND WON A PRIZE OF $15.90 SOME YEARS BACK, BUT SHE HAD TO SPLIT IT TWENTY WAYS WITH HER ROYAL RELATIVES. BUT THEY HAD HAD A TOUGH SPELL, WHAT WITH THE BIG FIRE AT THEIR WEEKEND GETAWAY CASTLE AND THE QUEEN HAVING TO PAY TAXES FOR THE FIRST TIME IN A CENTURY.

STILL, THE LOTTERY IS UNQUESTIONABLY REGRESSIVE. THE PEOPLE LEAST ABLE TO AFFORD TICKETS ARE ALWAYS THE PEOPLE WHO BUY THE MOST. SO HERE'S A SUGGESTION. INSTEAD OF MAKING ONE OR TWO OR THREE PEOPLE GLUTTONOUSLY RICH, LET'S BORROW A PRINCIPLE FROM ANOTHER FORM OF GAMBLING: THE STOCK MARKET. IT'S CALLED STOCK SPLITTING. EVERY TIME THE POT REACHES, OH, $10 MILLION -- $10 MILLION BEING A REASONABLE FORTUNE -- ANYTHING ABOVE THAT ROLLS OVER TO A SECOND DRAWING. SO A $15 MILLION POT WOULD CREATE A $10 MILLION DOLLAR JACKPOT AND A $5 MILLION DOLLAR JACKPOT AND AT LEAST TWO NEW MEMBERS OF THE MONEYED CLASS.

LAST WEEK'S FINANCING WOULD HAVE CREATED NOT THREE, BUT TWENTY MILLIONAIRES, AN EXTRA SEVENTEEN MILLIONAIRES PAYING TUITION, DINING OUT, BUYING CARS AND HOUSES, AND SOME SEVENTEEN MORE EKED AMERICANS. AND WHO KNOWS? YOU MIGHT ALREADY HAVE BEEN A WINNER.

VAL>> IF YOU LOVE MOVIES, CHANCES ARE YOU LOVE JOHN WILLIAMS'S WORK. HE COMPOSED THE MUSIC AND SERVED AS MUSIC DIRECTOR FOR NEARLY EIGHTY FILMS, INCLUDING SIX OF THE TOP TEN ALL-TIME BOX OFFICE CHAMPIONS. SMALL FILMS LIKE "STAR WARS", "SCHINDLER'S LIST", "RAIDERS OF THE LOST ARK", "E.T." AND "JAWS", AMONG OTHERS.

JESS>> AND WILLIAMS IS AT IT AGAIN. AMONG HIS RECENT PROJECTS IS THE MUSIC FOR THE "HARRY POTTER" MOVIE.

[FILM CLIP]

JESS>> HE'S UP FOR AN OSCAR FOR THAT MUSIC AND FOR THE SCORE OF ANOTHER FILM, "ARTIFICIAL INTELLIGENCE". BESIDES THAT, WILLIAMS WILL SERVE AS MUSICAL CONDUCTOR FOR THE OSCARS PROGRAM ITSELF AND HE'S ABOUT TO PERFORM IN LOS ANGELES WITH LEGENDARY CELLIST, YO-YO MA.

VAL>> AND JOINING US NOW IS COMPOSER JOHN WILLIAMS. A REAL HONOR TO HAVE YOU HERE. THANK YOU FOR COMING.

JOHN WILLIAMS>> THANK YOU.

JESS>> JOHN WILLIAMS, IF MUSIC WERE AN OLYMPIC CATEGORY, YOU WOULD HAVE EARNED A GOLD AT SALT LAKE CITY, ESPECIALLY FOR THE OLYMPIC THEME, "CALL OF THE CHAMPIONS". LET'S LISTEN TO IT.

[FILM CLIP]

VAL>> A BEAUTIFUL THEME THAT WE'VE HEARING ALL WEEK.

JOHN WILLIAMS>> WELL, THANK YOU VERY MUCH. WHAT A THRILL IT WAS TO DO THAT, TO GO TO SALT LAKE AND TO PERFORM THERE WITH THE UTAH ORCHESTRA, AND THE CHORUS THAT YOU HEAR THERE IS THE MORMON TABERNACLE CHOIR, OF COURSE, ONE OF OUR GREAT CULTURAL TREASURES IN OUR COUNTRY. I'D NEVER CONDUCTED THE CHORUS BEFORE, SO IT WAS A GREAT THRILL FOR ME TO BE THERE. IT WAS COLD OUT THERE. (LAUGHTER)

VAL>> I WOULD IMAGINE.

JOHN WILLIAMS>> WE ALL HAD OUR LITTLE HATS ON AND SCARVES, BUT IT WAS A GREAT THRILL, I MUST SAY.

VAL>> WHAT IS THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN WRITING, SAY, FOR AN EVENT LIKE THE OLYMPICS AND THEN A MOVIE? BECAUSE I UNDERSTAND WHEN YOU WRITE FOR A MOVIE, THE MUSIC HAS TO BE SUBSERVIENT TO THE IMAGE. BUT IN THE OLYMPICS, CAN YOU SHOW OFF? (LAUGHTER)

JOHN WILLIAMS>> (LAUGHTER) SHOW OFF A LITTLE BIT. THE THING ABOUT MOVIE MUSIC IS THAT THE PARAMETERS ARE VERY PRECISELY DESCRIBED AND THERE'S RIGOROUS DISCIPLINE IN EVERY SCENE. WE CAN PLAY FOR FIFTEEN SECONDS AND THEN WE HAVE TO SHIFT TO ANOTHER MOOD FOR ANOTHER TWELVE SECONDS, AND THEN MOVE ELSEWHERE AS THE SCENE PROGRESSES. THE THEME LIKE "CALL OF THE CHAMPIONS", OLYMPIC OR ANY SORT OF CEREMONIAL PIECE, ONE IS SORT OF FREE TO WAVE THE FLAG AND BE AN EXTROVERT FOR A FULL THREE OR FOUR OR FIVE MINUTES, YOU KNOW, COMPLETELY.

JESS>> AND PARTICULARLY FOR A SPORTING EVENT LIKE THAT, WE WANT LOTS OF FANFARES TOO, DON'T WE?

JOHN WILLIAMS>> WELL, THE RUFFLES AND FLOURISHES AND HERALDS OF ALL THE TRUMPETS AND DRUMS AND SO ON SEEM APPROPRIATE, PART OF OUR TRADITION.

VAL>> NOW THIS IS A VIDEO OF THE PROCESS OF PUTTING MUSIC TO THE "HARRY POTTER" FILM, CORRECT?

JOHN WILLIAMS>> RIGHT.

VAL>> ARE WE SEEING THE MOVIE RUNNING ON THE BIG MONITOR?

JOHN WILLIAMS>> UP ON THE SCREEN, YOU'LL SEE THE MOVIE AND I'M CONDUCTING TO IT. YOU SEE THOSE WHITE LINES?

VAL>> YES.

JOHN WILLIAMS>> THOSE ARE CUES FOR ME, WHICH WILL BE THE BEGINNING OF A PARTICULAR MEASURE, LET'S SAY. I'LL KNOW EXACTLY WHAT TIMING THAT IS IN THE SCRIPT, SO I CAN FOLLOW THOSE AS CUES. IT'S A VERY MATHEMATICALLY PRECISE DISCIPLINE. IF WE GET IT RIGHT, THE AUDIENCE WON'T NOTICE IT BECAUSE IT WILL BE SEAMLESS. IF IT'S WRONG AND BUMPY, WE'LL FEEL SOMETHING IS WRONG, SO IT REQUIRES A LOT OF PRECISION TO DO IT WELL.

JESS>> WELL, YOU HAVE NOW BECOME OSCAR'S MOST NOMINATED LIVING PERSON. (LAUGHTER)

VAL>> YOU HAVE 41 NOMINATIONS, FIVE WINS --

JOHN WILLIAMS>> -- YES. I DON'T KNOW HOW MANY LOSSES THAT AMOUNTS TO, BUT IT'S AMAZING --

JESS>> -- NOBODY LOSES. A NOMINATION IS AS IMPORTANT AS A WIN, THEY ALWAYS TELL US.

JOHN WILLIAMS>> IT IS TRUE. AND PEOPLE SAY, WELL, DO YOU GET BLASÉ AFTER 41 NOMINATIONS? NOT AT ALL. I MEAN, IF YOU DO SOMETHING IN OUR HUMANITY THAT WE ALL SHARE, WHEN WE'RE APPRECIATED, WE NEVER RUN OUT OF THE SENSE OF BEING GRATEFUL FOR THAT AND BEING HAPPY ABOUT IT. SO EVERY TIME IT'S BEEN A THRILL. IT'S JUST AMAZING TO ME, AS I SAID EARLIER TO YOU, JESS, THAT HOW DID WE GET THAT OLD THAT QUICKLY? (LAUGHTER) I DON'T KNOW HOW MANY YEARS WENT BY TO GET THAT, BUT IT'S BEEN A WONDERFUL WORKING LIFE FOR ME IN FILMS.

VAL>> HAS MOVIE MUSIC CHANGED? HAS IT GONE THROUGH STAGES?

JOHN WILLIAMS>> I THINK IT DOES GO THROUGH STAGES. IN THE EARLY 30'S AND 40'S WHEN WE WERE JUST BEGINNING TO PUT SOUND, WE HAD EUROPEAN ART MUSIC AS OUR MODELS. OUR GREAT PRACTITIONERS WERE MAX STEINER AND ERIC WOLFGANG [INAUDIBLE], BUT BECAUSE OF MEDIA AND PEOPLE LIKE YOU IN TELEVISION AND ALL OF THE RECORDING INDUSTRY THAT'S GROWN UP IN THE DECADES, SOME ASPECTS OF THE TASTE SENSIBILITIES THAT ARE INVOLVED IN WHAT WE DO HAVE CHANGED.

THE ORCHESTRA ITSELF IS STILL AN IMPORTANT MEDIUM FOR THE SOUND, AND THE TECHNOLOGY, OF COURSE, HAS CHANGED GREATLY. WE HAVE NOW SYNTHESIZED MUSIC THAT WE CAN PRODUCE AND WE USE COMPUTERS TO ACCOMPLISH A LOT OF THE SOUNDS. AS YOU CAN SEE THERE IN "HARRY POTTER", THAT WAS THE LONDON SYMPHONY ORCHESTRA. SO THE ORCHESTRA STILL REMAINS A GREAT TOOL FOR THIS MEDIUM.

JESS>> IS THAT TRUE EVEN WITH THE POPULARITY OF THE ANIMATED MOVIES?

JOHN WILLIAMS>> I THINK VERY MUCH SO. YOU REMEMBER THE OLD "TOM & JERRY" CARTOONS WHERE THE MUSIC -- THEY HAD LITTLE SMALL ORCHESTRAS, BUT THE MUSIC PERFORMED FEATS ALL THE TIME FOR EVERY CAT MAKING A JUMP OR MOUSE HIDING --

JESS>> -- AND "FANTASIA" WAS A MUSICAL PERFORMANCE.

JOHN WILLIAMS>> AND "FANTASIA" WAS A CARTOON WITH A SYMPHONY ORCHESTRA WITH GREAT CLASSICS BEING APPLIED TO MUSIC. SO I THINK THAT ONE OF THE PERENNIAL THINGS THAT WILL BE ALWAYS WITH US IS THE ORCHESTRA ITSELF AS A MEDIUM AND A TOOL FOR EXPRESSION FOR FILM COMPOSITION, I BELIEVE.

VAL>> DO YOU EVER AT TIMES WHEN, YOU KNOW, YOU'RE DOING, I GUESS, THE "STAR WARS" SEQUEL, DO YOU EVER JUST SAY TO YOURSELF, "OH, HEAVENS, IT'S THE SAME THING. JUST USE THE MUSIC FROM LAST TIME" (LAUGHTER) OR IS EVERY MOVIE UNIQUE AND DIFFERENT?

JOHN WILLIAMS>> WELL, THE EXPERIENCE IS ALWAYS --

JESS>> -- HE GETS PAID BY THE NOTES. (LAUGHTER)

JOHN WILLIAMS>> (LAUGHTER) EVERY EXPERIENCE, OF COURSE, IS DIFFERENT AND IT'S A CHALLENGE, YOU KNOW, BECAUSE EVERY TIME WE SIT DOWN TO WRITE ANYTHING, WE THINK, WELL, CAN WE COME UP TO WHAT WE DID THE LAST TIME AND WILL WE BE AS GOOD AS WE WERE BEFORE? THE CHALLENGE IS ALWAYS FRESH AND THAT'S, I GUESS, THE FUN OF IT ALSO. THE "STAR WARS" FILMS ARE A LITTLE BIT UNIQUE IN THE SENSE THAT THERE IS THEMATIC CONTINUITY FROM FILM TO FILM.

VAL>> PRECISELY.

JOHN WILLIAMS>> THEY'VE ALREADY DONE FIVE OF THEM, SO THERE'S A PRINCES LEA THEME AND A DARTH VADER THEME AND A LUKE AND LEA THEME AND YODA AND EWOKS, AND ALL THESE LITTLE CHARACTERS HAVE THEIR MELODIC IDENTIFICATION, THEIR PARTICULAR TUNE. SO WE CAN SUGGEST THE PRESENCE OF THEM EVEN WHEN THEY'RE NOT AROUND ON THE FILM. WE CAN SENSE THAT YODA IS COMING BY ADVERTISING HIS THEME.

VAL>> JOHN WILLIAMS, SO SORRY TO CUT YOU OFF, BUT THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR COMING BY. GOOD LUCK.

JOHN WILLIAMS>> THANK YOU BOTH. I ENJOYED BEING WITH YOU BOTH.

JESS>> THANK YOU. IT'S OUR PLEASURE. JOHN WILLIAMS AND YO-YO MA WILL SIGN COPIES OF THEIR NEW CD THIS SATURDAY AT THE COSTCO ON WASHINGTON BOULEVARD IN MARINA DEL REY. THEY'LL BE THERE FROM 2:30 UNTIL 4:30. THE CD, AGAIN, IS ENTITLED "YO-YO MA PLAYS THE MUSIC OF JOHN WILLIAMS".

VAL>> OH, YOU CAN ACTUALLY GO THERE AND MEET THEM. OH, HOW EXCITING. THAT'S OUR PROGRAM FOR THIS EVENING. CHECK OUT OUR TRANSCRIPTS ON OUR WEBSITE, KCET.ORG. TAKE CARE.

JESS>> FROM ALL OF US AT LIFE AND TIMES, HAVE A NICE EVENING.

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