ADRIANNE MOORE>> FAMILIES ARE NO LONGER TYPICAL FAMILIES. WE'RE NOT, YOU KNOW, "LEAVE IT TO BEAVER" TYPE SITUATIONS. A LOT OF US ARE SINGLE WOMEN OR CAREER WOMEN AND OUR HOURS NEED TO BE FLEXIBLE.

VAL>> WAS IT MURDER? TWO DOGS MAULED A SAN FRANCISCO WOMAN TO DEATH AT THE DOOR OF HER APARTMENT. NOW THE DOG OWNERS ARE ON TRIAL IN A CASE SO EMOTIONALLY CHARGED THAT IT'S BEEN MOVED TO LOS ANGELES. WE'LL TALK WITH A JOURNALIST COVERING THE TRIAL FOR THE SAN FRANCISCO CHRONICLE.

JESS>> YOU'VE HEARD OF SKELETONS IN THE CLOSET. PATT MORRISON HAS THE LOWDOWN ON SOMETHING ELSE YOU'LL FIND BURIED IN L.A.'S NEW CATHEDRAL.

PATT>> TALES FROM THE LORD'S CRYPT, ON TONIGHT'S INFINITELY MORRISON.

VAL>> AND IN HIS PLAYING YEARS, ERNIE BARNES WAS AN ARTIST ON THE GRIDIRON, BUT HIS TRUE TALENT LAY ELSEWHERE. TONIGHT YOU'LL MEET THIS NFL ATHLETE TURNED PAINTER AND HEAR HOW HE WENT FROM FOOTBALL PADS TO ARTIST PALETTES.

JESS>> THESE STORIES COMING UP NEXT ON LIFE AND TIMES TONIGHT.

LIFE AND TIMES TONIGHT IS MADE POSSIBLE BY THE FOLLOWING FOUNDATIONS:

THE L.K. WHITTIER FOUNDATION
DEDICATED TO IMPROVING THE QUALITY OF LIFE BY SUPPORTING INNOVATIVE ENDEAVORS IN THE FIELDS OF MEDICINE, HEALTH, SCIENCE AND EDUCATION.

THE CALIFORNIA ENDOWMENT
THE STATE'S LARGEST HEALTH FOUNDATION SUPPORTING ORGANIZATIONS THAT DIRECTLY IMPROVE THE HEALTH AND WELL-BEING OF CALIFORNIA'S DIVERSE COMMUNITIES. THE CALIFORNIA ENDOWMENT, A PARTNER FOR HEALTHIER COMMUNITIES.

VAL>> GOOD EVENING, I'M VAL ZAVALA.

JESS>> AND I'M JESS MARLOW.

FOR MOST AMERICAN FAMILIES, THE ERA OF STAY-AT-HOME MOMS IS LONG SINCE GONE. THESE DAYS, IT OFTEN TAKES TWO INCOMES JUST TO MAKE ENDS MEET AND THAT MEANS CHILDREN WIND UP IN DAYCARE WHILE PARENTS ARE AT WORK.

VAL>> BUT WHAT HAPPENS WHEN THE JOB IS AT NIGHT, MAYBE EVEN OVERNIGHT, AND THERE'S NO PLACE TO LEAVE THE KIDS? IT'S A COMMON SITUATION FOR A GROWING NUMBER OF FAMILIES AND TONIGHT GAY YEE LOOKS AT THE SOLUTION: DAYCARE THAT'S OPEN AROUND THE CLOCK.

GAY>> STEPHANIE JOHNSON IS PICKING UP HER KIDS AFTER WORK. IT'S PAST EIGHT P.M. WHILE MANY KIDS ARE ALREADY HOME IN BED, JOHNSON IS PREPARING HER KIDS FOR THE TRIP HOME. JOHNSON SAYS SHE'D PREFER NOT WORKING LATE HOURS, BUT IF SHE DIDN'T, SHE WOULDN'T GET PAID. SO FOR HER, CHILDCARE IS A MUST.

STEPHANIE JOHNSON>> IF I DIDN'T HAVE CHILDCARE, HONESTLY, I WOULDN'T BE ABLE TO MAKE A GOOD LIVING. YOU KNOW, THE QUALITY LIFESTYLE THAT YOU'D WANT TO LIVE INSTEAD OF LIVING OFF THE COUNTY.

GAY>> CHILDCARE PROVIDER, ADRIANNE MOORE, KNOWS THIS WELL.

ADRIANNE MOORE>> FAMILIES ARE NO LONGER TYPICAL FAMILIES. WE'RE NOT, YOU KNOW, "LEAVE IT TO BEAVER" TYPE SITUATIONS. A LOT OF US ARE SINGLE WOMEN OR CAREER WOMEN AND OUR HOURS NEED TO BE FLEXIBLE AND WE NEED TO KNOW IF THERE IS SOMEONE THERE TO ACCOMMODATE US.

GAY>> MOORE WAS THERE HERSELF ONCE, A SINGLE MOM WITH FOUR KIDS, TWO OF THEM WITH SPECIAL NEEDS. YEARS AGO, SHE TRIED TO GET A JOB, BUT SHE SAYS SHE COULDN'T FIND CHILDCARE THAT WOULD PICK UP HER KIDS FROM SCHOOL. SHE WOUND UP ON WELFARE, BUT SHE ALSO GOT AN IDEA.

ADRIANNE MOORE>> IT ENCOURAGED ME TO START A FAMILY DAYCARE HOME THAT WOULD ACCOMMODATE PEOPLE LIKE MYSELF.

GAY>> ADRIANNE NOW PROVIDES LICENSED FAMILY CHILDCARE IN HER HOUSE IN JEFFERSON PARK AND SHE'S MADE IT A POINT TO OFFER FREE PICKUP SERVICE FOR PARENTS.

ADRIANNE MOORE>> OKAY, HAND ME YOUR BACKPACKS.

GAY>> MANY OF THE CHILDREN ARE FROM LOW-INCOME FAMILIES. THEIR PARENTS ARE IN THE WELFARE TO WORK PROGRAM, WORKING IN ENTRY LEVEL JOBS WITH NON-TRADITIONAL HOURS. IT'S FAST-PACED AND HARD WORK, SO BELTING OUT TUNES IN THE CAR BETWEEN PICKUPS IS A GREAT STRESS RELIEVER. ADRIANNE BRINGS THEM BACK TO HER HOUSE FOR A HOME-COOKED MEAL.

ADRIANNE MOORE>> MISS FELICIA?

FELICIA>> YES, MA'AM?

ADRIANNE MOORE>> CAN YOU PLEASE HAVE THEM START CLEARING THE TABLE?

GAY>> WHEN IT COMES TO AVAILABLE CHILDCARE, L.A. COUNTY RANKS 56 OUT OF 58 COUNTIES IN CALIFORNIA. HALF THE KIDS LIVING IN L.A. COUNTY HAVE WORKING PARENTS, SO THE DEMAND FOR LICENSED CHILDCARE FAR EXCEEDS THE SUPPLY AND PLACES WITH NON-TRADITIONAL HOURS AND SERVICES ARE EVEN HARDER TO COME BY, EVEN THOUGH IT'S WHAT PARENTS NEED MOST.

ADRIANNE MOORE>> WE HAVE A LOT OF WOMEN THAT ARE WORKING AS BUS DRIVERS, SECURITY GUARDS, A LOT OF WHAT WE WOULD CALL NON-TRADITIONAL WORK FOR WOMEN, THAT'S WHAT THEY'RE DOING AND IT'S ANY TYPE OF HOURS YOU CAN POSSIBLY THINK OF.

GAY>> WHEN NIGHT FALLS, ADRIANNE HAS A FULL HOUSE. IT'S SIX O'CLOCK. MOST CHILDCARE FACILITIES ARE CLOSING UP FOR THE NIGHT, BUT INSTEAD, HERE THE KIDS ARE PULLING OUT COTS AND MATS IN PREPARATION OF SPENDING THE NIGHT. MANY OF THE KIDS EVEN HAVE THEIR OWN TOOTHBRUSHES LABELED AND ON A SHELF IN THE BATHROOM. THEY BEGIN THEIR NIGHT'S REST HERE WAITING FOR THEIR PARENTS TO GET OFF WORK.

ADRIANNE MOORE>> IT IS SAD. IT'S SAD. I HATE TO SEE CHILDREN HAVE TO BE COMPROMISED LIKE THAT, OR FAMILY STRUCTURES, NOT CHILDREN, BECAUSE MOMMY IS WORKING, DADDY IS WORKING, BECAUSE THEY HAVE TO. THAT'S THE NATURE OF SOCIETY. YOU HAVE TO WORK.

GAY>> JOHNSON DOESN'T LIKE BEING AWAY FROM HER CHILDREN FOR SUCH LONG HOURS EITHER, BUT SHE DOESN'T FEEL LIKE SHE HAS A CHOICE. THERE ARE BILLS TO PAY. IN LOS ANGELES, GAY YEE FOR LIFE AND TIMES.

JESS>> WE'RE JOINED NOW BY SOMEONE WHO KNOWS VERY WELL THE NEED TO HAVE 'ROUND THE CLOCK DAYCARE AND ABOUT THE IMPACT IT MAY BE HAVING ON THE CHILDREN. HOLLY MITCHELL IS WITH CRYSTAL STAIRS, A GROUP THAT HELPS LOW-INCOME PEOPLE GET CHILDCARE.

THESE ARE THE PARTICULARLY TOUGH CASES, THOSE WHERE THE PARENTS ARE WORKING NIGHTS. THE NEED IS SO GREAT, ARE THESE PEOPLE REGULATED? ARE THEY LICENSED?

HOLLY MITCHELL>> ABSOLUTELY. THE PROVIDER YOU SAW IN YOUR PIECE HERE IS A LICENSED DAYCARE PROVIDER HERE IN LOS ANGELES COUNTY. BUT AS A RESULT OF WELFARE REFORM IN 1996 WHEN HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS OF WOMEN WERE TOLD BASICALLY BY OUR ELECTED OFFICIALS THAT THEY WOULD HAVE TO TRANSITION FROM CASHAID, FROM CALWORKS, INTO THE WORKFORCE, IT WAS VERY CLEAR THAT THE CURRENT NUMBER OF PEOPLE WHO ARE LICENSED IN PROVIDING CHILDCARE, THE NEED WAS GOING TO FAR EXCEED WHAT WAS CURRENTLY AVAILABLE. SO WE DO HAVE SOMETHING CALLED EXEMPT CARE WHERE FAMILY MEMBERS, GRANDMOTHERS, AUNTS AND UNCLES, CAN PROVIDE CARE AS WELL AND RECEIVE SUBSIDIZED PAYMENTS. BUT THE PROVIDER YOU SAW TODAY IS LICENSED.

VAL>> NOW I DO AGREE WITH HER. SHE SAYS THERE'S SOMETHING SAD, JUST KIND OF SAD, ABOUT THE IDEA OF A DAYCARE PROVIDER PUTTING YOUR CHILD TO SLEEP. THAT'S THE TIME WHEN YOU'RE WARM AND FUZZY AND READING STORIES, AND IT'S HAPPENING OUTSIDE THE HOME. DO WE HAVE ANY IDEA HOW IT IMPACTS THE CHILDREN? DO CHILDREN MISS THAT SPECIAL MOMENT WITH THE PARENTS?

HOLLY MITCHELL>> WELL, I THINK THAT'S WHY THE WORK WE DO AT CRYSTAL STAIRS IS SO CRITICAL IN TERMS OF PROVIDING TRAINING TO CHILDCARE PROVIDERS SO THAT THE PROGRAM THAT THEY PRESENT IS REALLY IN THE BEST INTEREST OF THE CHILD, THAT IT'S BASED ON RESEARCH DONE IN EARLY CHILDHOOD DEVELOPMENT. YES, I THINK IT REALLY IS QUITE CONTRARY TO OUR KIND OF SOCIETAL VALUES IN TERMS OF CHILDREN SHOULD BE HOME AND TUCKED IN BY THEIR PARENTS. BUT THESE ARE CHANGING TIMES AND WE'RE TALKING ABOUT PEOPLE ENTERING THE WORKFORCE, IN MANY INSTANCES, FOR THE FIRST TIME --

VAL>> -- WHAT DOES THE RESEARCH SHOW ABOUT THE POSSIBLE IMPACT?

HOLLY MITCHELL>> I DON'T THINK THAT THERE REALLY HAS BEEN ANY RESEARCH THAT TALKS ABOUT THE IMPACT ON CHILDREN WITH REGARD TO AROUND THE CLOCK CARE. THERE HAS BEEN RESEARCH THAT LOOKS AT CHILDREN WHO ARE RAISED IN HOME VERSUS IN FAMILY DAYCARE OR SPECIFICALLY IN CHILDCARE CENTERS, BUT THIS AROUND THE CLOCK CARE, MORE OFTEN THAN NOT, TAKES PLACE IN FAMILY DAYCARE SETTINGS AS OPPOSED TO CHILDCARE CENTERS. SO I DON'T KNOW IF ANY RESEARCH HAS BEEN DONE ON THAT YET.

JESS>> TEACHERS WHO DEAL WITH YOUNGSTERS, PARTICULARLY THE VERY YOUNG, FIRST, SECOND, THIRD GRADE, LIKE THAT, ARE CONCERNED ABOUT CHILDREN COMING TO SCHOOL NOT HAVING HAD BREAKFAST. HAVE THEY ANY PROBLEMS? HOW DO THESE KIDS DO IN SCHOOL? THEY'VE BEEN WRESTLED OUT OF BED. (LAUGHTER)

HOLLY MITCHELL>> IT'S A VERY GOOD QUESTION. I THINK THAT'S WHY THE KIND OF FACILITY YOU SAW TODAY IS REALLY CRITICAL BECAUSE YOU THINK ABOUT THE ALTERNATIVE. IF THAT KIND OF FACILITY, A HOME SETTING WHERE THERE IS SOMEONE MONITORING TEETH BRUSHING AND MAKING SURE THEY HAD A WARM NUTRITIOUS MEAL, WHAT IF A WORKING MOTHER DIDN'T HAVE THAT AS AN OPTION? WHAT ARE HER OPTIONS? TO NOT CONTINUE TO WORK AND GO BACK ON CASHAID ON WELFARE? OR TO LEAVE THE CHILDREN HOME UNATTENDED?

SO I THINK WE HAVE TO REALLY RECOGNIZE THE SITUATION AT HAND. I THINK THEY'RE DOING THE BEST THEY CAN AS WORKING MOTHERS AND I THINK, IN LICENSED DAYCARE FACILITIES WHERE THE PROVIDERS HAVE RECEIVED GOOD EARLY CHILDHOOD DEVELOPMENT TRAINING, WE'RE REALLY MAKING SURE AND WORKING HARD TO MAKE SURE THAT CHILDREN ARE SCHOOL-READY WHEN THE TIME COMES.

VAL>> SO, SO MUCH DEPENDS ON THE QUALITY OF THE CARE.

HOLLY MITCHELL>> ABSOLUTELY.

VAL>> HOLLY MITCHELL FROM CRYSTAL STAIRS, THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR COMING IN AND THANK YOU FOR DOING SUCH GREAT WORK OUT THERE. APPRECIATE IT.

HOLLY MITCHELL>> THANK YOU FOR HAVING ME.

VAL>> TOMORROW, TAKING THE SCHOOL BUS SHOULDN'T BE HAZARDOUS TO YOUR CHILD'S HEALTH, BUT IN SOME CASES, IT'S ENOUGH TO TAKE YOUR BREATH AWAY.

PHILIP BRUCE>> WE ALL KNOW THE YELLOW SCHOOL BUS, BUT WHAT MOST PEOPLE DON'T KNOW IS THE DANGER THOSE BUSES MAY CARRY, NAMELY DIESEL EXHAUST.

>> WELL, I ASSUME IT'S GOT TO BE BAD BECAUSE OF THE WAY IT SMELLS. IT'S JUST HORRIBLE.

JESS>> IT IS SAID THAT LIVING A GOOD LIFE WILL EARN YOU A REWARD IN ETERNITY, BUT IT MAY TAKE A LITTLE MORE TO EARN A CHOICE FINAL RESTING PLACE IN LOS ANGELES, A CHOICE ONE. HERE'S TONIGHT'S INFINITELY MORRISON.

PATT>> AND SO IT CAME TO PASS THAT, IN THE CITY OF ANGELS, THERE WAS RAISED UP A NEW CATHEDRAL AND THE LORD'S ARCHITECT SAW THE SHINING EDIFICE UPON A HILL AND SAID IT WAS GOOD, EVEN THOUGH THE PHARISEE CRITICS DID NOT CHORUS THEIR AGREEMENT. AND THE LORD, OR MORE LIKELY THE LORD'S ACCOUNTING DEPARTMENT, DECREED, "GO THOU AND CARVE OUT A MAUSOLEUM, AN ETERNAL RESTING PLACE, REAL ESTATE AD PERPETUEM. LET THERE BE BURIED BENEATH THE MARBLE FLOOR OF THE APSE -- WHATEVER THAT IS -- THE DEPARTED OF THE LORD'S SERVANTS, SAINT VIBIANA AND THE BISHOPS OF CALIFORNIA.

YET STOP NOT THERE," THE ACCOUNTING DEPARTMENT SURELY DECREED. "MAKE THOU AVAILABLE CRYPTS NUMBERING A THOUSAND AND THREE HUNDRED AND NICHES FOR THE ASHES OF THE DEPARTED NUMBERING FIVE-FOLD ONE THOUSAND. INVITE UNTO THE WAITING LIST FOR THIS MOST AUGUST MAUSOLEUM THE LORD'S SECULAR ELITE, HIS PLATINUM CARD HOST, RUPERT MURDOCH AND BETSY BLOOMINGDALE, ROY DISNEY AND BOB HOPE, PETER O'MALLEY AND MERV GRIFFIN AND SUCH OTHERS AS HAVE GIVEN SOME MAJOR LUCRE FOR THE RAISING UP OF THIS TEMPLE.

IN RETURN FOR THEIR HEFTY ALMS, THEY MAY CHOOSE TO BE INTERRED THEREIN, BUT, YEA, FROM THESE WHO HAVE GIVEN MUCH, LET MORE YET BE TAKEN. BE THOU CERTAIN TO LEVY SOME STIFF PRICES ON THESE SELECT STIFFS FOR THE HONOR OF SPENDING ETERNITY IN THE FIRST-CLASS SECTION. LET THE LOWLY COME ONLY TO GAZE UPON THE RESTING PLACES OF THE VIP'S. VERILY, EVEN AS THE RABBLE IN THE CHEAP SEATS AT THE STAPLES ARENA DO CAST AN ENVIOUS EYE UPWARD TO THE SKYBOXES AND THEIR OWNERS SO CLOSE TO HEAVEN."

AND THIS THE ACCOUNTANTS PROBABLY SAYETH, "LEST THE RIFFRAFF SOMEHOW TRY TO FINAGLE THEIR WAY AMONG THE LATE ELITE, PRICE THOU THESE CRYPTS OUT OF THE REACH OF MERE GENIUS. LET NOT THIS MAUSOLEUM BE FILLED WITH THE BODIES OF POETS OR PAINTERS, NOR WRITERS OR COMPOSERS. LET IT NOT BECOME LIKE PERE LACHAISE, THE ETERNAL ADDRESS OF CHOPIN AND MOLIERE, OR WESTMINSTER ABBEY WHERE RESTS THE BONES OF CHAUCER AND DICKENS, NOR SANTA CROCE, TOMB TO MICHELANGELO AND MACHIAVELLI AND, YES, EVEN GALILEO, HERETIC TO THE CHURCH, LIGHT UNTO THE WORLD, LEST SOME TRAVELER, GOD FORBID, MISTAKE LOS ANGELES FOR PARIS OR LONDON OR FLORENCE. AMEN."

VAL>> WELL, WHETHER OR NOT WE PLAN IT, MANY OF US HAVE MORE THAN ONE CAREER IN OUR LIFETIMES, BUT FEW OF US MAKE SUCH A DRAMATIC TURN AS ERNIE BARNES. BARNES WENT FROM PROFESSIONAL FOOTBALL PLAYER TO PAINTER.

JESS>> NOW IF YOU'RE A CHARGERS OR A BRONCOS FAN, YOU MAY REMEMBER ERNIE BARNES AS A TOUGH 300-POUND LINEMAN. BUT IF YOU'RE AN ART AFICIONADO, YOU MAY KNOW HIS UNIQUE FIGURATIVE PAINTINGS. HE WAS THE OFFICIAL ARTIST FOR THE 1984 SUMMER OLYMPICS HERE IN LOS ANGELES AND HE WAS HONORED THIS MONTH BY THE CALIFORNIA LEGISLATIVE BLACK CAUCUS AS A NATIONAL TREASURE FOR HIS CONTRIBUTION TO AMERICAN CULTURAL EXPRESSION.

VAL>> AND JOINING US NOW IS PROFESSIONAL ATHLETE TURNED ARTIST, ERNIE BARNES. A REAL PLEASURE TO HAVE YOU HERE ON THE SET.

ERNIE BARNES>> I'M DELIGHTED TO BE HERE.

JESS>> WHICH IS TOUGHEST? SACKING QUARTERBACKS OR TACKLING A BLANK CANVAS? (LAUGHTER)

ERNIE BARNES>> (LAUGHTER) YOU KNOW, IN SOME WAYS, THEY'RE EQUALLY DIFFICULT. I ALWAYS GOT TO PROTECT THE QUARTERBACK. JACK KEMP WAS MY QUARTERBACK WHEN I WAS PLAYING WITH THE CHARGERS AND PROTECTING HIM WAS SOMETHING I FOUND THAT I HAD TO DO WITH HIM HAVING THE POLITICAL AMBITIONS THAT HE DID. (LAUGHTER)

VAL>> (LAUGHTER) HE MIGHT BE ABLE TO USE YOU NOW, WHO KNOWS? WE'RE GOING TO TAKE A LOOK AT SOME OF YOUR MOST RECENT PAINTINGS AND PERHAPS YOU CAN TELL US A LITTLE ABOUT THEM. BECAUSE THE THEMES THAT YOU DEAL WITH ON YOUR CANVAS ARE VERY WIDE-RANGING, NOT JUST --

ERNIE BARNES>> -- YES, QUITE BROAD.

VAL>> -- FOOTBALL THEMES.

ERNIE BARNES>> WELL, THIS PAINTING TITLED "IN REMEMBRANCE" WAS UNVEILED AT THE SEATTLE ART MUSEUM ON NOVEMBER 18. IT WAS ONE OF THE FIRST VISUAL RESPONSES BY AN ARTIST TO THE WORLD TRADE CENTER DISASTER. I THINK IT REGISTERS THE PATRIOTIC RESPONSE OF ALL AMERICANS TO THAT TRAGEDY. THE POINT OF VIEW IS THROUGH THE HOMELESS WHO DON'T REALLY HAVE BADGES OF STATUS, SO THEIR PATRIOTISM IS QUITE PURE.

VAL>> THAT'S BEAUTIFUL. IS IT ALMOST ALWAYS ACRYLICS ON CANVAS?

ERNIE BARNES>> MOSTLY, YES.

JESS>> THIS IS TYPICAL OF YOUR FIGURATIVE STYLE WITH THE ELONGATED LIMBS.

ERNIE BARNES>> YES. THIS IS A PAINTING COMMISSIONED BY DR. JERRY BUSS, A PORTRAIT OF OSCAR IN THE RING.

JESS>> PAID IN ADVANCE?

ERNIE BARNES>> BEG PARDON?

JESS>> DID HE PAY YOU IN ADVANCE?

ERNIE BARNES>> OH, YEAH. (LAUGHTER)

VAL>> OSCAR DE LA HOYA, THE LATINO BOXER.

ERNIE BARNES>> YES. THIS IS A PAINTING THAT -- THERE ARE LIMITED EDITIONS OF THIS PIECE TO RAISE FUNDS FOR HIS FOUNDATION.

VAL>> NOW YOU ALSO HAVE DONE NON-ATHLETIC THEMED WORK AND WE'RE GOING TO TAKE A LOOK AT THAT AND MAYBE YOU CAN TELL US A LITTLE BIT ABOUT WHAT YOU WERE THINKING AS YOU PAINTED THESE.

ERNIE BARNES>> SURE. WELL, THIS PARTICULAR PIECE IS TITLED "READING FROM LEFT TO RIGHT", ALTHOUGH THE NAME HAS HAD VARIOUS CHANGES OVER A PERIOD OF TIME. BUT IT HAS TO DO WITH LITERACY. THERE'S THE JOY AND ELATION THAT COMES FROM CHILDREN GRADUATING.

VAL>> THIS IS A BEAUTIFUL ONE.

ERNIE BARNES>> WELL, I'VE ALWAYS HAVE ADMIRED, FOR SOME REASON, WAITRESSES. THEY HAVE A CERTAIN DIGNITY TO ME.

VAL>> REALLY?

JESS>> WELL, THAT ONE CERTAINLY HAS DIGNITY. IT'S ALMOST A MODIGLIANI FACE.

VAL>> NOW HAS YOUR STYLE CHANGED A LOT? DO YOU FIND YOURSELF -- BECAUSE I KNOW SOMETIMES YOUR STYLE IS KIND OF RUSTIC, ALMOST IMPRESSIONISTIC, AND OTHER TIMES, IT'S VERY REFINED.

ERNIE BARNES>> WELL, IT DEPENDS ON WHEN I'M WORKING AT THE TIME. BASICALLY, I'M CALLED A NEOMANNERIST PAINTER, WHICH MAKES THE ELONGATION AND DISTORTION OF CERTAIN BODY PARTS ALWAYS PRESENT BECAUSE I'M TRYING TO REVEAL A CERTAIN TRUTH. SO THE STYLE COULD VARY, DEPENDING ON WHAT THE CALL OF AN ASSIGNMENT IS, WHAT THE NEEDS ARE THERE.

JESS>> YOU'RE OFTEN DESCRIBED AS SELF-TAUGHT.

ERNIE BARNES>> NO, I MAJORED IN ART IN COLLEGE --

JESS>> -- THERE YOU GO.

ERNIE BARNES>> -- BECAUSE --

JESS>> -- BUT YOUR UNIQUE STYLE APPARENTLY CONVINCED PEOPLE THAT THIS WAS ONE OF A KIND.

ERNIE BARNES>> WELL, YOU KNOW, IT'S LIKE YOU GET THE MECHANICS, YOU LEARN THE MECHANICS, AND THEN YOU HAVE TO FORGET THEM AND GO ON TO AN INDIVIDUAL APPROACH. WHATEVER STYLE MIGHT FOLLOW IS THE STYLE THAT FOLLOWS.

JESS>> I WOULD GUESS YOU WERE PROBABLY THE ONLY FOOTBALL PLAYER IN THE ART CLASS.

ERNIE BARNES>> NO, I WASN'T.

VAL>> REALLY?

ERNIE BARNES>> NO, I WASN'T. WHEN I WAS IN COLLEGE, THERE WERE ABOUT FIVE OF US, YES, YES.

JESS>> DID ANY OF THEM GO ON TO BECOME PAINTERS?

ERNIE BARNES>> TWO.

JESS>> YES?

ERNIE BARNES>> YES.

JESS>> KNOCKING THE HECK OUT OF THE STEREOTYPES. (LAUGHTER)

ERNIE BARNES>> AND THERE ARE PEOPLE WHO THINK THAT, WHEN I WAS PLAYING PROFESSIONALLY, THERE WAS A WEIRD EYE CAST AT ME ON OCCASIONS BECAUSE I WANTED TO BE A PAINTER, AND IT WASN'T THAT WAY. THE GUYS REALLY WERE VERY SUPPORTIVE.

VAL>> NOW THERE WAS A CRUCIAL MOMENT IN YOUR CAREER. YOU HAD BEEN ABOUT FOUR OR FIVE YEARS IN THE NFL, YOU WERE ONLY EARNING A LITTLE MORE THAN $13,000 A YEAR, AND YOU HAD A CHANCE TO SHOW YOUR ART TO A PROSPECTIVE SUPPORTER. I UNDERSTAND THAT YOU WERE ACTUALLY CARRYING YOUR CANVASES ON THE NEW YORK SUBWAY TO GET THERE.

ERNIE BARNES>> OH, YES. WELL, MR. WERBLIN, DAVID SONNY WERBLIN, WAS THE OWNER OF THE NEW YORK JETS. HE DISCOVERED MY TALENT AS AN ARTIST THROUGH BARON HILTON WHO WAS THE OWNER OF THE CHARGERS WHEN I WAS PLAYING. MR. WERBLIN HAD ME TO BRING ALL OF MY PAINTINGS TO NEW YORK. THERE WAS EIGHTEEN OF THEM, LIKE YOU SAID. I CHECKED INTO A HOTEL WAITING FOR HIM FOR ABOUT FIVE DAYS AND HE NEVER CALLED ME. I THOUGHT IT WAS OVER, SO I CHECKED OUT OF THE HOTEL BECAUSE THE CRATE WAS TOO BIG IN THAT ROOM.

I MOVED TO ANOTHER HOTEL AFTER ABANDONING THE CRATE AND I HAD TO BRING THE PAINTINGS BACK INTO MANHATTAN VIA SUBWAY. I HAD PEOPLE ON THE SUBWAY HOLDING PAINTINGS. I DIDN'T KNOW IF I'D EVER SEE THEM AGAIN. (LAUGHTER) BUT WHEN I GOT TO THE INCURABLE COLLECTORS GALLERY ON 57TH STREET, HE HAD CRITICS THERE WHO LOOKED AT MY WORK AND THEIR EVALUATION WAS THAT I WAS THE MOST EXPRESSIVE PAINTER ON THE AMERICAN SCENE SINCE GEORGE BELLOWS. MR. WERBLIN TOOK ME ACROSS THE STREET AND HE SAID, "YOU'RE NOT PLAYING ANY MORE FOOTBALL --

JESS>> -- DON'T HURT THOSE HANDS. (LAUGHTER)

VAL>> DON'T HURT THOSE HANDS.

ERNIE BARNES>> HE BECAME MY PATRON FOR ONE YEAR AND THEN PLACED ME INTO GRAND CENTRAL ART GALLERY WHERE I WAS FOR ABOUT TWENTY YEARS.

JESS>> AND WE'VE ALL BENEFITED FROM THAT. ERNIE BARNES, THANK YOU SO MUCH.

ERNIE BARNES>> THANK YOU, JESS.

JESS>> ERNIE BARNES WILL BE AT THE FOX HILLS MALL FOR HIS BOOK SIGNING AND ART SALE THIS SATURDAY AND SUNDAY. FOR MORE INFORMATION, YOU CAN CALL (310) 390-2240.

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JESS>> IT'S A GRUESOME STORY OF HOW A BEAUTIFUL YOUNG WOMAN WAS ATTACKED AND BRUTALLY KILLED BY TWO VICIOUS DOGS. THE ANIMALS WERE HUGE, EACH WEIGHING MORE THAN 125 POUNDS. THEY DEFINITELY OUTWEIGHED THE VICTIM, 33-YEAR-OLD DIANE WHIPPLE, WHO WAS MAULED TO DEATH OUTSIDE HER SAN FRANCISCO APARTMENT. THE HORRIFIC DETAILS OF THAT CASE HAVE BEEN PLAYING OUT IN A LOS ANGELES COURTROOM. THE COUPLE WHO WERE KEEPING THE DOGS ARE NOW ON TRIAL ON CHARGES RANGING FROM MANSLAUGHTER TO SECOND DEGREE MURDER.

VAL>> AND JOINING US NOW IS JAXON VAN DERBEKEN. HE IS A WRITER FOR THE SAN FRANCISCO CHRONICLE AND HE'S BEEN COVERING THIS CASE FROM THE BEGINNING. WELCOME TO LIFE AND TIMES.

JAXON VAN DERBEKEN>> THANK YOU.

JESS>> FROM THE BEST WE CAN FIGURE, THERE HAS NEVER BEEN A CASE WHERE A MURDER CHARGE HAS STUCK AGAINST THE OWNER OF A DOG THAT COMMITTED --

JAXON VAN DERBEKEN>> IN THIS STATE, THAT'S TRUE. THEY HAD ONE IN ANOTHER STATE, BUT THIS STATE -- THEY'VE TRIED IT BEFORE AND USUALLY IT'S RESULTED TWICE IN MANSLAUGHTER CONVICTIONS, NOT MURDER, SO --

JESS>> -- YOUR OBSERVATION? WILL THEY SUCCEED IN GETTING A SECOND DEGREE MURDER CONVICTION IN THIS ONE?

JAXON VAN DERBEKEN>> WELL, IT'S A DIFFERENT KIND OF CASE. WE REALLY DON'T KNOW. I MEAN, IT'S DIFFICULT TO KNOW BECAUSE, IN THE OTHER TWO CASES, THEY INVOLVED PEOPLE WHO LEFT THEIR DOGS UNATTENDED AND THEY MAULED PEOPLE WHO STRAYED ON THEIR PROPERTY, OR CAME ONTO THE PROPERTY ZONE.

THIS IS A CASE WHERE A WOMAN HAD A DOG ON A LEASH AND CARRIED HER DOWN THE HALLWAY AND ATTACKED A WOMAN WHILE THE DOG WAS LEASHED. SO WE JUST DON'T KNOW. I MEAN, IT'S DIFFICULT. THE ISSUE IS WHAT THE DEFENDANTS KNEW ABOUT THE PROPENSITIES OF THESE DOGS AND WHEN DID THEY KNOW IT AND WHAT ACTIONS DID THEY DO TO PREVENT WHAT HAPPENED OR WHAT COULD HAVE HAPPENED. YOU KNOW, THE BOMB SYNDROME THAT COULD GO OFF.

VAL>> BUT, STILL, IF YOU WANT TO PROVE MURDER, DON'T YOU HAVE TO PROVE INTENT? AND IT WOULD BE VERY HARD TO PROVE THAT THIS COUPLE WITH THESE DOGS ACTUALLY INTENDED TO HURT SOMEONE.

JESS>> NOT SECOND DEGREE, DO YOU?

JAXON VAN DERBEKEN>> IT'S A SECOND DEGREE MURDER. WHAT THEY CALL IMPLIED MALICE THEORY, WHICH MEANS THAT THEY WERE SO RECKLESS AND, KNOWING THE RISKS, CHOSE TO TAKE THIS DOG INTO AN URBAN ENVIRONMENT. SO THAT MEANS THAT SORT OF IMPLIES THE INTENT OR THE MALICE THAT NEEDS TO BE REQUIRED FOR THE SECOND DEGREE MURDER.

JESS>> YOU'VE LISTENED TO THE TESTIMONY. THEY APPARENTLY WERE KEEPING THESE DOGS FOR A PRISONER?

JAXON VAN DERBEKEN>> YES, THEY WERE. THEY WERE KEEPING IT ON BEHALF OF A FELLOW BY THE NAME OF "CORNFED" AND HIS CELLMATE, DALE BRETCHES. THERE'S A HUGE DISPUTE. I THINK IT WOULD TAKE A YEAR OR TWO IN COURT JUST TO RESOLVE WHO OWNED THESE DOGS. I MEAN, IT'S EITHER THE INMATES, IT'S EITHER THE TWO DEFENDANTS, MARJORIE KNOLLER AND ROBERT NOEL, OR IT COULD BE A WOMAN NAMED BRENDA STORY WHO PROCURED MONEY FOR THE INMATES AND GAVE THEM MONEY, TO A WOMAN NAMED JANET COUMBS WHO RAISED THE DOGS. SO WE JUST REALLY DON'T KNOW. I MEAN, EVERYBODY SAYS EVERYBODY ELSE OWNED THE DOGS. I MEAN, WE'VE HEARD FOUR OR FIVE DIFFERENT, YOU KNOW, EXPLANATIONS IN THIS CASE ALREADY.

JESS>> THE KEY, I WOULD ASSUME, IS WHO WAS IN CONTROL OF THE DOGS.

JAXON VAN DERBEKEN>> RIGHT. THAT'S WHAT THE LAW IS, ABOUT THE CONTROL OF THE DOGS. AND THERE'S THE QUESTION ABOUT HOW DID JANET COUMBS, THE WOMAN THAT HAD IT UP IN A RURAL FARM UP IN HAYFORK, HOW DID SHE TREAT THE DOGS? AND HOW DID THEY GET INTO THE DEFENDANTS' HANDS? THEY WERE TAKEN AND SUPPOSEDLY RESCUED. SO THE DEFENDANTS RESCUED THE DOGS AFTER GIVING THEM TO SOMEONE ELSE, SO THEN THEY GOT THEM BACK AND THEN THEY KEPT THEM IN AN URBAN ENVIRONMENT. THE CASE IS JUST SHOCKED. BECAUSE OF THE ARYAN BROTHERHOOD, THE PRISON GANG MENTIONED, THERE'S JUST INCREDIBLE PERMUTATIONS IN OUR CITY.

VAL>> INCREDIBLE LAYERS AND LAYERS OF BACK STORIES THAT ARE ALMOST AS STUNNING AS THE ACTUAL MURDER. BUT IN TERMS OF BEING SUCCESSFUL ABOUT GETTING A MURDER CASE IN A DOG ATTACK, IF IT'S SO UNLIKELY THAT THEY WILL GET A MURDER CONVICTION, WHY ARE THEY GOING FOR IT? IS THIS EMOTIONALLY MOTIVATED BECAUSE THE CRIME WAS SO GRUESOME AND THE VICTIM SO SYMPATHETIC?

JAXON VAN DERBEKEN>> WELL, I THINK IT'S KIND OF BOTH IN THE SENSE THAT THEY PUT THIS CASE BEFORE A GRAND JURY AND THE GRAND JURY WAS EITHER EMOTIONALLY OR OTHERWISE CONVINCED THAT MARJORIE -- THE ONLY DEFENDANT WHO FACES SECOND DEGREE MURDER IS MARJORIE KNOLLER. HER HUSBAND, ROBERT NOEL, FACES MANSLAUGHTER.

AFTER HEARING THEM TESTIFY IN A RARE OCCURRENCE IN WHICH AN ACCUSED OR PROSPECTIVE ACCUSED PERSON TESTIFIES BEFORE A GRAND JURY, WAIVES THEIR RIGHTS, YOU KNOW, NOT TO TESTIFY, THEY WERE INVITED TO COME AND THEN ULTIMATELY SUBPOENAED AND THEY SHOWED UP AND THEY TALKED. NOW THOSE WORDS ARE COMING BACK AND IT KEEPS --

JESS>> -- AND BOTH HUSBAND AND WIFE ARE LAWYERS?

JAXON VAN DERBEKEN>> THAT'S CORRECT. THEY ARE BOTH LAWYERS IN SAN FRANCISCO AND WHERE THIS HAPPENED WAS WHERE THEY KEEP THEIR OFFICE. THEY HAD AN OFFICE DOWN THE HALL WHERE THE VICTIM LIVED. MARJORIE KNOLLER WAS JUST TAKING THE DOG FOR A WALK WHEN THIS HAPPENED.

VAL>> WHAT'S HAPPENING IN THE COURTROOM? WHAT'S THE ATMOSPHERE THERE? YOU'RE THERE IN PERSON. WHAT'S IT LIKE?

JAXON VAN DERBEKEN>> WELL, NEDRA RUIZ, WHO REPRESENTS MARJORIE KNOLLER, HAS BEEN JUST INCREDIBLY FORCEFUL, ONE WOULD SAY. OTHER PEOPLE WOULD SAY, YOU KNOW, A LITTLE OUT OF CONTROL.

JESS>> SHE'S THE ONE WE SAW THERE CRAWLING ON HER HANDS AND KNEES?

JAXON VAN DERBEKEN>> THAT'S RIGHT, ON ALL FOURS. SHE BANGED ON THE JURY BOX --

VAL>> -- WHY WAS SHE DOING THAT?

JAXON VAN DERBEKEN>> SHE'S SUPPOSED TO REENACT HOW THE SUSPECT, OR DEFENDANT, WAS TRYING TO SAVE THE LIFE OF THE VICTIM BY GETTING ON TOP OF HER, PUTTING HERSELF IN FRONT OF HARM'S WAY SO THE DOG WOULD NOT ATTACK DIANE WHIPPLE, BUT WOULD STOP. SHE KEPT SAYING, "STOP, STOP", THEN SHE BANGED -- THIS IS NEDRA RUIZ -- SHE BANGED ON THE JURY BOX SEVERAL TIMES TO INDICATE HOW HER DEFENDANT BANGED ON THE DOOR OF A NEIGHBOR TO TRY TO GET HELP. THAT'S THE FIRST THEORY WE'VE EVER HEARD OF THAT BEFORE TOO.

JESS>> BUT THERE WERE NO WITNESSES?

JAXON VAN DERBEKEN>> THERE WAS ONE WOMAN WHO SAW IT THROUGH THE PEEPHOLE OF HER DOOR AND SHE SAW ONLY A LITTLE BIT. SHE WAS SO PETRIFIED. SHE HEARD THE BANGING. SHE THOUGHT IT WAS THE DOG SLAMMING ITS BODY AGAINST HER DOOR. WE'LL NEVER KNOW WHETHER THAT'S TRUE. BUT SHE RETREATED INSIDE, SHE CALLED 911 TWICE, SHE SAID THERE ARE THESE BIG DOGS AND THE OWNER CAN'T CONTROL THEM.

SHE DIDN'T KNOW ABOUT A MAULING TAKING PLACE. THE POLICE ARRIVED, THEN THE AMBULANCE CAME SOME MINUTES LATER. AND NOW NEDRA RUIZ, THE ATTORNEY FOR MARJORIE KNOLLER, MENTIONED THAT THE OFFICERS DIDN'T GIVE THIS VICTIM ANY HELP, SO THEY TOOK PART IN THE DEATH INSTEAD OF THE DOGS OR THE DEFENDANTS OR WHATEVER.

VAL>> IS IT KIND OF A ZOO IN THERE? ARE PEOPLE BEHAVING? ARE THE REPORTERS AND THE SPECTATORS BEHAVING?

JAXON VAN DERBEKEN>> WELL, IT'S LARGELY REPORTERS. THERE'S TWO FULL ROWS OF REPORTERS AND THEN THE FAMILY AND FRIENDS OF BOTH SIDES ARE IN THE FRONT ROW.

VAL>> WOW, WHAT A PLACE TO BE. THAT'S GOING TO BE SOME TRIAL. WELL, THANK YOU SO MUCH, JAXON VAN DERBEKEN, FOR BEING HERE AND GIVING US THAT FIRST-HAND ACCOUNT. APPRECIATE IT.

JESS>> AND THAT'S IT FOR TONIGHT'S BROADCAST. THANK YOU FOR WATCHING. YOU CAN LISTEN TO RECENT PROGRAMS THROUGH OUR WEBSITE, WWW.KCET.ORG.

VAL>> FOR ALL OF US HERE AT LIFE AND TIMES, HAVE A GREAT EVENING.

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