5/9/02

LC020509

VAL>> ON LIFE AND TIMES TONIGHT --

JESS>> IT WAS PLANNED TO BE A MAJOR TOURIST ATTRACTION, BUT CRITICS SAY THE AQUARIUM OF THE PACIFIC WILL GO BELLY UP WITHOUT A BAILOUT.

NORM RYAN>> THE BILL OF GOODS WAS THAT YOU'LL HAVE A WORLD-CLASS AQUARIUM IN LONG BEACH THAT WOULD ATTRACT GOBS OF TOURISTS AND THAT IT WOULD PAY FOR ITSELF. THESE WERE BASED ON WHAT I CONSIDER TO BE PIE IN THE SKY PROJECTIONS.

VAL>> A MUSLIM-AMERICAN PHYSICIAN FROM ANAHEIM IS BEHIND BARS IN TEL AVIV. ISRAELI OFFICIALS CLAIM HE MAY HAVE TIES TO PALESTINIAN TERRORISTS, BUT THE DOCTOR SAYS HE WAS SIMPLY ON A MISSION OF MERCY. TONIGHT WE'LL HEAR MORE FROM A LOCAL MUSLIM LEADER.

JESS>> ALSO, HAVE A CRAVING FOR SOME TORTS? PATT MORRISON SAYS CALL YOUR FAVORITE LAWYER.

PATT MORRISON>> SUITS TO THE SWEET. CHOCOLATE GOES TO COURT -- ON TONIGHT'S INFINITELY MORRISON.

VAL>> ALSO, A VISIT TO L.A. NOIR. WE'LL LOOK AT THE ART AND ALLURE OF MYSTERY NOVELS SET IN THE CITY OF ANGELS, TALES OF EVIL, TREACHERY AND MAYHEM TOLD IN THE WORDS OF BEST-SELLING AUTHOR, MICHAEL CONNELLY.

JESS>> THESE STORIES COMING UP NEXT ON LIFE AND TIMES.

LIFE AND TIMES TONIGHT IS MADE POSSIBLE BY THE FOLLOWING FOUNDATIONS:

THE L.K. WHITTIER FOUNDATION
DEDICATED TO IMPROVING THE QUALITY OF LIFE BY SUPPORTING INNOVATIVE ENDEAVORS IN THE FIELDS OF MEDICINE, HEALTH, SCIENCE AND EDUCATION.

AND THE CALIFORNIA ENDOWMENT
THE STATE'S LARGEST HEALTH FOUNDATION SUPPORTING ORGANIZATIONS THAT DIRECTLY IMPROVE THE HEALTH AND WELL-BEING OF CALIFORNIA'S DIVERSE COMMUNITIES. THE CALIFORNIA ENDOWMENT, A PARTNER FOR HEALTHIER COMMUNITIES.

VAL>> GOOD EVENING, I'M VAL ZAVALA.

JESS>> AND I'M JESS MARLOW.

IT MAY BE THE ULTIMATE FISH STORY, BUT WHEN IT COMES TO TOURISM, IT'S THE ONE THAT GOT AWAY. WE'RE TALKING ABOUT THE AQUARIUM OF THE PACIFIC. SPECTACULAR, BUT IT'S NEVER QUITE LIVED UP TO ITS PROMISE.

VAL>> THE CITY OF LONG BEACH HAD HOPED THE AQUARIUM WOULD DRAW BIG CROWDS AND MAKE LOTS OF MONEY, BUT NEITHER HAS HAPPENED, AND NOW THE AQUARIUM IS BEING FORCED TO ASK FOR TAXPAYER DOLLARS JUST TO STAY IN BUSINESS. HERE'S MORE FROM PHILIP BRUCE.

PHILIP BRUCE>> IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA, IT'S ONE OF A KIND AND YOU'D THINK THE AQUARIUM OF THE PACIFIC WOULD HAVE NO PROBLEM DRAWING A CROWD, BUT CROWDS ARE THE ONE THING THEY GENERALLY DON'T HAVE HERE. SHOW UP IN THE AFTERNOON AFTER THE SCHOOL TOURS HAVE ENDED AND YOU CAN PROBABLY WALK RIGHT IN, NO WAITING, BUT TALK TO THE FEW SOULS WHO DO SHOW UP AND THEY SEEM MORE THAN SATISFIED.

>> IT'S JUST WONDERFUL. IT HAS A GREAT VARIETY OF FISH AND SEA LIFE AND WE LOVE COMING HERE.

>> THIS IS OUR FIRST TIME HERE. IT'S EDUCATIONAL AND -- WHAT DID WE LIKE BEST? WE LIKED THE OTTERS.

>> I NEVER WOULD HAVE THOUGHT IN L.A. THEY COULD PRODUCE SUCH A WONDERFUL COMPLETE SETUP. YOU KNOW, EVEN OUTSIDE IT LOOKS LIKE A LITTLE TOURIST VILLAGE.

PHILIP BRUCE>> THE AQUARIUM IS ACTUALLY IN LONG BEACH. IT OPENED FOUR YEARS AGO AS THE SHINING EXAMPLE OF THAT CITY'S EFFORT TO TRANSFORM ITSELF INTO A MAJOR TOURIST DESTINATION, BUT THE AQUARIUM HAS BATTLED FINANCIAL PROBLEMS ALMOST FROM THE BEGINNING. EARLY ON, THE OPERATORS VOWED THEY'D BE SELF-SUFFICIENT AND PAY THE BILLS WITHOUT CALLING FOR AN INFUSION OF PUBLIC MONEY, BUT IT HASN'T TURNED OUT THAT WAY. LAST WEEK THE CITY OF LONG BEACH HAD TO STEP IN WITH $700,000 TO HELP THE AQUARIUM MEET ITS BOND PAYMENT.

JAMES HANKLA>> THAT'S NOT A LOT OF MONEY FOR A MILLION VISITORS A YEAR AND THERE ARE LOTS OF THINGS THAT MONEY IS SPENT ON IN A VARIETY OF MUNICIPALITIES THAT HAVEN'T GOT NEAR THE VISITOR APPEAL THAT THIS AQUARIUM HAS NOR THE EDUCATIONAL POTENTIAL.

PHILIP BRUCE>> JAMES HANKLA IS THE AQUARIUM'S CHAIRMAN OF THE BOARD.

JAMES HANKLA>> AT SOME POINT IN TIME, THERE'S NO DOUBT IN MY MIND THAT THE OTHER CONTRIBUTIONS WILL BE MADE, BUT THAT WAS ALWAYS PART OF THE GAME. THE CITY COUNCIL COMPLETELY UNDERSTOOD THAT WHEN THEY UNDERTOOK THE ORIGINAL FINANCING FOR THIS FACILITY.

PHILIP BRUCE>> HANKLA OUGHT TO KNOW WHAT HE'S TALKING ABOUT. AT THE TIME THE AQUARIUM OPENED, HE WAS THE CITY MANAGER OF LONG BEACH. BUT CRITICS SUCH AS NORM RYAN, A LOCAL BOND SPECIALIST AND CANDIDATE FOR LONG BEACH MAYOR, CLAIMED THAT TAXPAYERS HERE WERE SOLD A BILL OF GOODS.

NORM RYAN>> THE BILL OF GOODS WAS THAT YOU'LL HAVE A WORLD-CLASS AQUARIUM IN LONG BEACH THAT WOULD ATTRACT GOBS OF TOURISTS AND THAT IT WOULD PAY FOR ITSELF. THESE WERE BASED ON WHAT I CONSIDER TO BE PIE IN THE SKY PROJECTIONS.

PHILIP BRUCE>> TODAY, HENRY TABOADA IS THE CITY MANAGER OF LONG BEACH. HE CLAIMS THOSE EARLY PROJECTIONS ABOUT ATTENDANCE AT THE AQUARIUM WERE WAY OFF THE MARK.

HENRY TABOADA>> THE FACTORS THAT THEY USED IN THIS WERE NOT REALISTIC BECAUSE THE TIME FRAME IN WHICH THIS AQUARIUM WAS DEVELOPED WAS VERY, VERY SHORT. SO THOSE STUDIES WERE BEING DONE BEFORE THE ACTUAL PLANS FOR THE CONSTRUCTION OF THE AQUARIUM WERE EVEN ON THE DRAWING BOARD.

PHILIP BRUCE>> THE CITY ONCE EXPECTED THAT OVER TWO MILLION VISITORS A YEAR WOULD COME TO THE AQUARIUM, BUT AFTER THE SITE OPENED, OFFICIALS REALIZED THAT THE FACILITY WAS TOO SMALL TO ACCOMMODATE THOSE NUMBERS AND, AFTER THE FIRST YEAR, ATTENDANCE FELL OFF DRAMATICALLY.

NORM RYAN>> OBVIOUSLY, PEOPLE BACK WHEN EITHER DIDN'T DO THEIR HOMEWORK OR KNEW THAT IT WASN'T GOING TO WORK, BUT FIGURED, WELL, LET'S JUST PUSH IT THROUGH AND SEE WHAT HAPPENS. WELL, THAT'S A GREAT GAMBLE, BUT NOT ON TAXPAYER DOLLARS.

PHILIP BRUCE>> WITH THE CROWDS FALLING FAR BELOW EXPECTATIONS, REVENUE WAS OFF AS WELL, BUT TWO YEARS AGO WHEN WE TALKED TO LONG BEACH'S FINANCIAL MANAGER, ROBERT TORRES, HE STILL EXPECTED THE AQUARIUM WOULD BE RESPONSIBLE FOR ITS OWN DEBTS.

HENRY TORRES>> THEY HAVE TO STAND ALONE. THAT'S THE WAY THE AQUARIUM WAS DESIGNED AND THAT IS OUR OBJECTIVE, TO BE A STAND-ALONE ENTERPRISE.

PHILIP BRUCE>> THIS IS NOT A SITUATION WHERE YOU'RE GOING TO HAVE TO GO BACK TO THE WELL AND COME UP WITH MORE CITY MONEY?

HENRY TORRES>> NO, I DON'T BELIEVE WE'RE GOING TO NEED TO DO THAT.

PHILIP BRUCE>> TODAY, TWO YEARS LATER, ALL THAT HAS CLEARLY CHANGED. STILL, JAMES HANKLA ARGUES THAT LONG BEACH TAXPAYERS SHOULD REGARD THE AQUARIUM THE SAME WAY THEY WOULD A MUSEUM, AS AN INSTITUTION THAT ENRICHES THE LIFE OF THE CITY. HE CLAIMS THERE'S NO EVIDENCE THE PUBLIC HERE IS ANGRY ABOUT THE BAILOUT. NO ONE IS GRIPING, HE SAYS, EXCEPT NORM RYAN, THE CANDIDATE FOR MAYOR.

JAMES HANKLA>> I KNOW HIM AND I KNOW THAT, WHEN YOU'RE RUNNING FOR OFFICE AND YOU'RE NOT HOLDING OFFICE, IT'S IMPORTANT TO FIND THINGS TO CRITICIZE. THAT'S ALL I CARE TO SAY ON THE SUBJECT.

NORM RYAN>> WHEN YOU RUN FOR MAYOR, YOU CAN IMMEDIATELY LOSE CREDIBILITY BECAUSE, ANYTIME YOU'RE CRITICAL OF ANYTHING, YOU'RE JUST GRANDSTANDING. THE DIFFERENCE IS, I'VE BEEN CRITICAL FROM THE START AND I HAVE TAKEN GREAT PAINS OVER AND OVER AGAIN TO SAY, LOOK, I LIKE THE AQUARIUM. I REALLY DO, BUT THAT DOESN'T MEAN THAT I'M JUST GOING TO CLOSE MY EYES TO WHAT I CONSIDER TO BE FINANCIAL MALFEASANCE.

PHILIP BRUCE>> HANKLA SAYS THAT LONG BEACH HAS EVERY REASON TO BE OPTIMISTIC ABOUT THE AQUARIUM. AFTER YEARS OF DELAYS, GROUND IS ABOUT TO BE BROKEN ON A BIG NEW RETAIL AND ENTERTAINMENT COMPLEX NEXT DOOR, AND WORK IS ALREADY WELL UNDERWAY FOR A MAJOR NEW EXHIBIT TO OPEN HERE NEXT MONTH. SHARK LAGOON WILL FEATURE OVER 150 SHARKS. VISITORS CAN EVEN TOUCH SOME OF THEM.

JAMES HANKLA>> I THINK, ON BALANCE, YOU KNOW, SOME PEOPLE SAY WHY AN AQUARIUM IN LONG BEACH? MY POINT IS, WHY NOT?

JESS>> PHIL JOINS US NOW. CLEARLY IT IS, AS YOU SAID, A SPECTACULAR AQUARIUM AND THE PRIDE OF LONG BEACH. IS THE PUBLIC COMPLAINING?

PHILIP BRUCE>> WELL, THERE'S NOT BEEN A GREAT PUBLIC OUTCRY YET, BUT THIS $700,000 PAYMENT HAS JUST RECENTLY BEEN MADE. THE REALITY OF THAT SITUATION IS THAT THERE'S LIKELY TO BE MORE MONEY COMING FROM THE CITY TO KEEP THOSE BOND PAYMENTS CURRENT. THE CITY'S MADE IT PRETTY CLEAR, IN FACT, THAT IF THE AQUARIUM NEEDS MORE MONEY, MORE OF THESE $700,000 KIND OF PAYMENTS, THEY'LL COME FORTH WITH THAT CASH.

VAL>> IS THERE ANY PARTICULAR PLAN TO MAKE IT SELF-SUFFICIENT?

PHILIP BRUCE>> WELL, YOU KNOW, WHAT THEY'RE TRYING TO DO IS MAKE IT MORE ATTRACTIVE TO VISITORS AND IT IS A GREAT ATTRACTION. I THINK THAT'S SOMETHING THAT EVERYONE AGREES UPON. IT IS A GOOD PLACE. YOU KNOW, IF ANYONE HAS EVER BEEN TO THE MONTEREY AQUARIUM, IT WAS BELIEVED TO BE THAT KIND OF ATTRACTION. EVERYBODY BEHIND THIS THOUGHT IT WOULD BE THAT KIND OF VENUE. IT HASN'T TURNED OUT TO BE THE CASE.

JESS>> THE MONTEREY AQUARIUM IS IN FISHERMAN'S WHARF, WHICH IS A MAJOR TOURIST CENTER, AND THERE ARE PLANS IN LONG BEACH TO CREATE ADDITIONAL TOURIST ATTRACTIONS AROUND THE AQUARIUM, ARE THERE NOT?

PHILIP BRUCE>> WELL, THAT'S BEEN PART OF THE PROBLEM, JESS. IN FACT, THE AQUARIUM HAS KIND OF BEEN THE LONE RANGER DOWN THERE FOR A LONG TIME. THERE WAS A GRAND PLAN TO MAKE IT PART OF SOME SORT OF ENTERTAINMENT COMPLEX. THAT'S FINALLY GOING TO HAPPEN. THEY'RE GOING TO BUILD SOME SHOPS AND RESTAURANTS NEXT DOOR.

JESS>> THEATERS.

PHILIP BRUCE>> THAT COULD HAPPEN AND THAT COULD DRIVE SOME PEOPLE INTO THE AQUARIUM. NO GUARANTEE OF THAT BECAUSE SOME OF THE CRITICS POINT OUT THAT IT STILL COSTS $17 TO GET IN IF YOU'RE AN ADULT AND PEOPLE HAVE COMPLAINED ABOUT THAT PRICE TAG.

VAL>> SO SHOPS AND SHARKS IS THEIR STRATEGY. THANK YOU SO MUCH, PHIL.

TOMORROW ON LIFE AND TIMES, CALIFORNIA NEEDS NURSES BY THE THOUSANDS, SO WHY DON'T WE JUST TRAIN MORE? AS USUAL, IT ALWAYS COMES DOWN TO MONEY.

GAY YEE>> STATE AND COMMUNITY COLLEGES ARE TURNING AWAY PROSPECTIVE NURSES IN DROVES BECAUSE THEIR PROGRAMS ARE PACKED AND THEY CAN'T AFFORD TO EXPAND THEM.

>> CALIFORNIA IS IN THE MIDST OF A VERY CRITICAL SHORTAGE. IT'S A PUBLIC HEALTH CRISIS AND IT'S ONLY GOING TO GET WORSE BEFORE IT GETS BETTER.

JESS>> HE SAID HE WENT TO THE MIDDLE EAST TO SERVE AS A MEDICAL RELIEF WORKER, BUT A MUSLIM-AMERICAN DOCTOR FROM ANAHEIM LOOKED SUSPICIOUS TO AUTHORITIES IN TEL AVIV AND THAT'S WHY THE ISRAELIS ARRESTED HIM ON GROUNDS THAT HE WAS LINKED TO PALESTINIAN TERRORISTS.

VAL>> DR. RIAD ABDELKARIM REMAINS IN CUSTODY WHILE THE ISRAELIS CHECK OUT HIS STORY. THE DOCTOR CLAIMS HE WAS TRYING TO HELP PALESTINIAN REFUGEES AFTER ISRAELI FORCES POUNDED THEIR CAMP IN JENIN. HE IS THE SAME PHYSICIAN WHO WAS QUESTIONED BY THE FBI IN ORANGE COUNTY FOR BELONGING TO THE HOLY LAND FOUNDATION. U.S. AUTHORITIES SAID THAT THAT ISLAMIC CHARITY WAS RAISING MONEY FOR THE TERRORIST GROUP HAMAS.

DR. RIAD ABDELKARIM>> I TOLD THEM THAT THE HOLY LAND FOUNDATION IS THE MOST SUCCESSFUL AMERICAN-MUSLIM CHARITY IN THE RELIEF OF PALESTINIAN REFUGEES AND THAT MY INVOLVEMENT WITH THEM GOES BACK SEVERAL YEARS WHEN I WOULD GO ON MEDICAL RELIEF TRIPS AS A PHYSICIAN AND TAKE CARE OF -- WORK IN CLINICS AND HOSPITALS THAT WERE IN THE WEST BANK.

JESS>> THAT WAS AFTER HIS INTERVIEW WITH THE FBI IN ORANGE COUNTY. JOINING US NOW IS DR. MAHER HATHOUT. HE IS THE SENIOR ADVISER OF THE MUSLIM PUBLIC AFFAIRS COUNCIL AND A SPOKESPERSON FOR THE ISLAMIC CENTER OF SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA.

WHAT DO YOU MAKE OF THIS? HERE'S A SANTA MONICA-BORN AMERICAN CITIZEN BEING HELD IN ISRAEL, AS YET NOT BEEN ABLE TO SEE AN ATTORNEY?

DR. MAHER HATHOUT>> AS FAR AS WE KNOW, THERE IS AN ISRAELI ATTORNEY, A HUMAN RIGHTS ATTORNEY, WHO IS GOING TO TAKE ON HIS CASE AND SHE HAS NOT BEEN ABLE TO MEET WITH DR. ABDELKARIM UP UNTIL NOW. ABOUT THIS HOLY LAND FOUNDATION, THE FBI COMPLETELY CLEARED HIM, SO IT IS --

JESS>> -- THEY CLEARED HIM, BUT NOT THE ORGANIZATION.

DR. MAHER HATHOUT>> THE ORGANIZATION DID NOT HAVE ITS DAY IN COURT YET, BUT NONETHELESS NOBODY, AFTER IT'S ANNOUNCED IT'S DEFUNCT, NOBODY DEALS WITH THE ORGANIZATION.

JESS>> THE BUSH ADMINISTRATION HAS FROZEN ALL THE FUNDS OF THE ORGANIZATION BECAUSE THEY BELIEVE THEY ARE TIED TO SUPPORTING HAMAS.

DR. MAHER HATHOUT>> THEN WE HAVE TO WAIT TO SEE WHAT THE COURTS WILL SAY.

VAL>> TELL US EVERYTHING YOU KNOW ABOUT WHAT HE DID WHEN HE WENT THERE. THERE WERE SOME E-MAILS HE SENT, THERE'S BEEN CONVERSATIONS HE HAD. TELL US EVERYTHING YOU KNOW ABOUT WHAT HE DID WHEN HE GOT THERE.

DR. MAHER HATHOUT>> YEAH. HE SENT AN E-MAIL DESCRIBING THE SITUATION IN JENIN WHICH, OF COURSE, IS 180 DEGREES DIFFERENT FROM THE STORY THAT WE HEAR FROM THE ISRAELI OFFICIALS.

VAL>> JENIN, OF COURSE, WAS THE SITE OF THE ISRAELI CRACKDOWN.

DR. MAHER HATHOUT>> WAS THE SITE OF THE ISRAELI ACTION THAT RESULTED IN THE DESTRUCTION OF THE REFUGEE CAMP. THE ISRAELI GOVERNMENT SAYS THAT THERE IS AN EXAGGERATION OF THE CASUALTIES, BUT AT THE SAME TIME, THEY NEVER ALLOWED THE FACT-FINDING MISSION TO GO IN. WHEN A FACT-FINDING MISSION IS NOT IN, IT MEANS THE FACTS ARE NOT OUT.

VAL>> SO DR. ABDELKARIM WAS ABLE TO GET IN?

DR. MAHER HATHOUT>> HE WAS ABLE TO GET IN. HE WAS ABLE TO DISTRIBUTE SOME WATER AND SOME FOOD. HE VISITED THE AREA SEVERAL TIMES BEFORE. THIS TIME, ON HIS WAY BACK TO LOS ANGELES, AT THE AIRPORT HE WAS ARRESTED. UP UNTIL NOW, THERE IS NO INDICTMENT. WE DON'T KNOW WHAT HE'S ACCUSED OF. HE HAS BEEN IN CUSTODY --

VAL>> -- NO OFFICIAL CHARGES?

DR. MAHER HATHOUT>> NO OFFICIAL CHARGE UP UNTIL THIS MOMENT. ALL OF WHAT YOU HEAR ARE RUMORS, BUT NO OFFICIAL CHARGE. IT IS AN INTIMIDATION TACTIC TO ANY AMERICAN WHO TRIES TO HELP WITH THE PALESTINIANS.

JESS>> THE ACCUSATION IS THAT HE WAS SUPPORTING TERRORISM.

DR. MAHER HATHOUT>> BUT EVEN THIS IS NOT OFFICIAL ACCUSATION. THERE IS NO COURT OR THERE IS NO D.A. WHO ADDRESSED HIM THIS WAY UP UNTIL NOW. BUT, OF COURSE, ANYONE WHO SAYS, FOR EXAMPLE, I AM AGAINST OCCUPATION, I SUPPORT THE RIGHTS OF PALESTINIANS TO BE FREE, CAN BE LABELED IN THE ENVIRONMENT OF HYSTERIA THAT WE LIVE THROUGH AS SUPPORTING TERRORISTS BECAUSE THEY SAY IT IS INCITEMENT. I STILL FAIL TO UNDERSTAND THE WORD.

JESS>> AS AN AMERICAN, WHAT'S THE UNITED STATES GOVERNMENT DOING TO ASSIST HIM?

DR. MAHER HATHOUT>> NOT MUCH. I EXPECT AT LEAST THAT OUR ELECTED OFFICIALS, THE CONGRESSMAN AND THE CONGRESSWOMAN -- BECAUSE THERE IS ANOTHER YOUNG LADY WHO IS ALSO DETAINED, DALELL MOHMED FROM TEXAS -- SO WE EXPECT THAT CONGRESSWOMAN, BERNICE JONES, AND MR. COX SHOULD PRESSURE THE STATE DEPARTMENT TO TAKE --

JESS>> -- WHAT HAS CONGRESSMAN COX SAID TO YOU ABOUT THIS?

DR. MAHER HATHOUT>> WHAT I HEARD FROM OUR OFFICE IS THAT THEY SAID WE CANNOT PRESSURE THE STATE OF ISRAEL. I AM NOT ASKING THEM TO PRESSURE THE STATE OF ISRAEL. OBVIOUSLY, ISRAEL RIGHT NOW IS ABOVE THE LAW. I AM ASKING THEM TO PRESSURE THE STATE DEPARTMENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA AND TO ISSUE A STATEMENT IN SUPPORT OF THOSE TWO BORN AMERICANS WHO ARE IN CUSTODY NOW AND WE DON'T KNOW WHAT IS HAPPENING TO THEM.

VAL>> WHAT IS ISRAELI LAW? DO THEY HAVE THE SAME PROTECTIONS WE HAVE? THAT CHARGES, FOR EXAMPLE, HAVE TO BE LEVELED AGAINST YOU WITHIN A CERTAIN AMOUNT OF TIME OR YOU HAVE TO BE RELEASED? ARE THERE ANY KINDS OF DEADLINES LIKE THAT?

DR. MAHER HATHOUT>> YOU KNOW, I'M NOT AN EXPERT IN THE ISRAELI LAW. YOU CAN HAVE THE BEST LAWS IN BOOKS, BUT WHEN YOU DETAIN PEOPLE WITHOUT ACCUSATION FOR SEVEN DAYS AND MOST PROBABLY THEY WILL EXTEND IT EIGHT MORE DAYS, THIS IS NOT EXACTLY RESPECTING THE HUMAN RIGHTS.

JESS>> HAS HE HAD AN OPPORTUNITY TO TALK WITH HIS FAMILY IN ANAHEIM? HIS WIFE AND CHILDREN?

DR. MAHER HATHOUT>> NOT THAT I KNOW OF. I DON'T THINK THAT HE COULD TALK TO HIS FAMILY AT ALL. OUR OFFICE TRIED TO CONTACT HIM ALSO, THE MUSLIM PUBLIC AFFAIRS COUNCIL.

JESS>> IS IT FAIR TO SAY, THEN, THAT HE'S BEING HELD INCOMMUNICADO?

DR. MAHER HATHOUT>> EXACTLY. HE IS IN SOLITARY CONFINEMENT. THERE WAS ANOTHER DOCTOR WITH HIM CALLED DR. RUSHDI CADER WHO WAS RELEASED AFTER SEVEN HOURS AND THEY WERE SEPARATED. HE INDICATED TO US THAT HE WAS NOT TREATED VERY KINDLY. HE WAS SHOVED AND PUSHED, AND WE DON'T KNOW WHAT'S HAPPENING BEHIND THE CLOSED DOORS.

VAL>> WHAT WOULD THE POSITION OF THE MUSLIM PUBLIC AFFAIRS COUNCIL BE IF AN INVESTIGATION SHOWED THAT IN FACT THERE WERE SOME LINKS BETWEEN HIM AND ANY KIND OF TERRORIST ORGANIZATION?

DR. MAHER HATHOUT>> LIKE ANY AMERICAN CITIZEN WHO IS ACCUSED OF COMMITTING SOMETHING OVERSEAS SHOULD BE BROUGHT TO AMERICAN LAW, ENJOYING THE PROTECTION OF THE AMERICAN CONSTITUTION, AND IS INNOCENT UNTIL PROVEN GUILTY. THESE ARE THE VALUES WE STAND FOR.

VAL>> SO IN EITHER CASE, YOU WOULD WANT HIM OUT OF THE CUSTODY OF THE ISRAELI OFFICIALS.

DR. MAHER HATHOUT>> OF COURSE. HE IS IN THE DENS OF THE LIONS. WE WANT HIM OUT. WE WANT HIM TO COME TO HIS COUNTRY TO BE PROTECTED BY HIS COUNTRY.

JESS>> THERE ARE THOSE WHO WOULD SAY HE WAS IN THE DENS OF THE LIONS BEING ASSOCIATED WITH THE HOLY LAND FOUNDATION, IF INDEED THEY ARE SUPPORTERS OF HAMAS WHICH IS CLEARLY A TERRORIST ORGANIZATION.

DR. MAHER HATHOUT>> BUT, OBVIOUSLY, WHEN HE WENT TO THE WEST BANK AT THIS TIME, THE HOLY LAND FOUNDATION WAS ALREADY DEFUNCT FOR TWO YEARS. THE ORGANIZATION HE WENT THROUGH IS IMC, THE INTERNATIONAL MEDICAL CORPS, THAT INVITED HIM TO GO THERE. HE IS FORMING A NEW ORGANIZATION CALLED KINDERUSA AND THIS HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH THAT. AS I SAID, IT IS A TACTIC OF INTIMIDATION THAT ANYBODY SHOULD THINK TWICE OR TEN TIMES BEFORE HE OR SHE WILL TRY TO OFFER A HELPING HAND TO THE PALESTINIANS.

VAL>> WE SHOULD ALSO MENTION THAT DR. ABDELKARIM WAS OUTSPOKEN IN THE UNITED STATES. HE WOULD WRITE COLUMNS, IS THAT CORRECT? HE WASN'T JUST A --

DR. MAHER HATHOUT>> -- HE PUBLISHED IN THE NEW YORK TIMES, IN THE L.A. TIMES. HE WAS NOT A HIDING PERSON AT ALL. HE'S A MAN OF HIGH MORAL STANDARDS, HIGH CONVICTIONS AND HE SPEAK OUT HIS MIND AS ALL AMERICANS SHOULD DO.

VAL>> DR. HATHOUT WITH THE MUSLIM PUBLIC AFFAIRS COUNCIL AND THE ISLAMIC CENTER OF SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA, THANK YOU FOR BEING WITH US.

DR. MAHER HATHOUT>> THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR INVITING ME.

LIFEANDTIMES@KCET.ORG
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JESS>> IT ISN'T EXACTLY HEALTH FOOD, BUT IS CHOCOLATE SO BAD THAT WE HAVE TO TAKE IT TO COURT? HERE'S TONIGHT'S INFINITELY MORRISON.

PATT MORRISON>> IT'S NEARLY MOTHER'S DAY, ONE OF THE BIGGEST CANDY-GIVING DAYS OF THE YEAR, AND I'M HERE TO STICK UP FOR CHOCOLATE. THE AMERICAN ENVIRONMENTAL SAFETY INSTITUTE WENT TO COURT IN LOS ANGELES TO SUE THE MAKERS OF HERSHEY'S KISSES, M&M'S AND THE LIKE, CLAIMING THAT CHOCOLATE HAS DANGEROUS LEVELS OF LEAD AND CADMIUM. THE SUIT WANTS CHEMICAL WARNING LABELS ON SUCH CANDY UNDER CALIFORNIA'S PROP 65, THE SAME WARNINGS YOU'D FIND ON GASOLINE AND PESTICIDES. ON WORD OF THE SUIT, HERSHEY'S STOCK DROPPED BY 23 CENTS.

THE ATTORNEY GENERAL ALREADY RULED THAT LEAD IN CHOCOLATE IS PUT THERE BY NATURE, NOT BY HUMANS, AND THE FOOD AND DRUG ADMINISTRATION SAYS THAT CHILDREN WHO EAT LOTS OF CHOCOLATE STILL TAKE IN LESS THAN SEVEN PERCENT OF THE DAILY LEAD AMOUNTS ALLOWED BY LAW. I THINK THAT THE BIGGER RISK IS FAT KIDS WITH BAD TEETH.

CHOCOLATE WAS THE NEW WORLD'S FIRST GIFT TO THE WORLD. THE VERY WORD COMES FROM THE MAYAN WORD "XOCOATL" AND THE AZTEC WORD "ATLE", HENCE CHOCOLATL, CHOCOLATE, MEANING "BITTER WATER". CORTEZ TOOK SOME BACK TO EMPEROR CHARLES THE FIFTH WHO ADDED SUGAR AND CREATED A CRAVING THAT'S LASTED FOR 500 YEARS.

WHEN I WAS IN SPAIN, I MADE A VISIT -- NO, A PILGRIMAGE -- TO THE MONASTERY WHERE THEY FIRST REFINED CHOCOLATE. CASANOVA USED IT AS AN APHRODISIAC, OTHERS USED IT IN COOKING -- LIVER DIPPED IN CHOCOLATE. THANKFULLY, IN THE 19TH CENTURY, THE CANDY FORM WAS PERFECTED AND, SINCE THEN, TRAVEL COMPANIES HAVE OFFERED CHOCOLATE TOURS OF CENTRAL AMERICA. IN POLAND, BACK WHEN CHOCOLATE WAS AVAILABLE ONLY TO CHILDREN, POLICE APPEALED FOR HELP IN FINDING A DRIVER WHO MADE OFF WITH A VAN HAULING FIVE TONS OF CHOCOLATE. GOOD LUCK.

AMERICANS EAT ABOUT TEN POUNDS A YEAR, WHICH IS NOTHING COMPARED TO THE SWISS WHO EAT ALMOST TWICE AS MUCH, BUT PERHAPS THEY'RE SUPPORTING SWITZERLAND'S OTHER FAMOUS PRODUCT, THE ONE THAT DOESN'T TICK. CHOCOLATE GETS MOLDED INTO COMPUTER KEYBOARD SHAPES AND BOARD GAMES AND ASPIRIN. A MOVIE NAMED AFTER IT ALMOST WON THE BEST PICTURE OSCAR. AND THE ULTIMATE INSULT TO BOTH CHOCOLATE AND VODKA IS THE CHOCOLATE MARTINI.

NOW EATING CHOCOLATE CAN DELIVER THE SAME ENDORPHIN HIGH AS BEING IN LOVE AND ITS LATIN NAME IS THEOBROMA CACAO. GIVEN THAT WE ALL HAVE TO GO EVENTUALLY, I'LL NAME AS MY POISON THEOBROMA CACAO, WHICH MEANS "FOOD OF THE GODS".

VAL>> MICHAEL CONNELLY IS A FORMER CRIME REPORTER FOR THE LOS ANGELES TIMES AND NOW A BEST-SELLING MYSTERY AUTHOR. HIS WORKS ARE SET IN THE CITY HE USED TO COVER, A LOS ANGELES FILLED WITH MURDER, TREACHERY AND MAYHEM.

JESS>> CONNELLY IS KNOWN AS THE DEAN OF L.A. CRIME FICTION WRITERS. HE HAS BEEN COMPARED TO RAYMOND CHANDLER. HIS LATEST MYSTERY IS TITLED "CITY OF BONES". WE RECENTLY SPOKE WITH CONNELLY ABOUT THE ART OF CRAFTING A MURDER ON A BLANK PAGE AND HIS DEEP LOVE FOR LOS ANGELES.

MICHAEL CONNELLY>> I THINK WHAT I ENJOY MOST ABOUT WRITING CRIME NOVELS IS THAT, LIKE THE PROTAGONIST, THE DETECTIVES SAY, WHO HAS A BADGE THAT CAN TAKE HIM ANYWHERE HE NEEDS TO GO TO EXPLORE ANY SUBJECT, THE WRITER CAN DO THE SAME THING. I CAN EXPLORE ANYTHING I WANT TO, WHETHER IT'S A SOCIAL ILL, WHETHER IT'S A PARTICULAR TYPE OF CRIME, OR THE DIFFERENT STRATAS OF OUR LOCAL SOCIETY HERE IN LOS ANGELES. JUST LIKE THE INVESTIGATOR WHO KIND OF CAN PIERCE ALL THOSE THINGS, SO CAN I.

EXCERPT FROM "THE POD">> "DEATH IS MY BEAT. I MAKE MY LIVING FROM IT. I FORGE MY PROFESSIONAL REPUTATION ON IT. I TREAT IT WITH THE PASSION AND PRECISION OF AN UNDERTAKER, SOMBER AND SYMPATHETIC ABOUT IT WHEN I'M WITH THE BEREAVED, SKILLED CRAFTSMAN WITH IT WHEN I'M ALONE. I'VE ALWAYS THOUGHT THE SECRET TO DEALING WITH DEATH WAS TO KEEP IT AT ARM'S LENGTH. THAT'S THE RULE. DON'T LET IT BREATH IN YOUR FACE."

MICHAEL CONNELLY>> THE MYSTERY NOVEL, ONE OF ITS ATTRACTIONS, ONE OF THE FULFILLMENTS THAT READERS GET, AS WELL AS WRITERS, IS THAT YOU START WITH DISORDER, A SENSE OF DISORDER OR CHAOS. AND THEN THROUGH THE PAGES, THROUGH THE PROGRESSION OF THE BOOK, YOU BRING ORDER TO THAT SITUATION, AND THAT HAS A VERY, MAYBE SUBLIMINAL, BUT THERE IS A SENSE OF FULFILLMENT FROM THAT THAT YOU GET WHETHER YOU'RE READING IT OR WRITING IT. SO I ENJOY, YOU KNOW, FIGURING OUT THE PLOTS AND SO FORTH AND MAKING SURE ALL THE PIECES FIT TOGETHER BY THE END OF THE NARRATIVE.

EXCERPT FROM "BLACK ICE">> "NATIONWIDE, THE VAST MAJORITY OF MURDER VICTIMS KNOW THEIR KILLER. THEY ARE THE PEOPLE THEY EAT WITH, DRINK WITH, SLEEP WITH, LIVE WITH, BUT HOLLYWOOD WAS DIFFERENT. THERE WERE NO NORMS. THERE WERE ONLY DEVIATIONS, ABERRATIONS. STRANGERS KILLED STRANGERS HERE. REASONS WERE NOT A REQUIREMENT. THE BOTTOM LINE WAS THAT, IN HOLLYWOOD, A MONSTER COULD MOVE SMOOTHLY IN THE FLOW OF HUMANITY, JUST ONE MORE CAR ON THE CROWDED FREEWAY."

MICHAEL CONNELLY>> I'M REALLY A FREEFORM ENGINEER OF PLOTS. I OFTEN DON'T OUTLINE MY BOOKS. I OFTEN JUST START WITH THE CRIME, POINT A, AND I KNOW THE OUTCOME, POINT Z, AND ALL THE LETTERS IN BETWEEN I KIND OF GO WITH AS I'M WRITING. IT MAKES IT THE MOST PLEASURABLE KIND OF WRITING, SO YOU'RE NOT LIKE, YOU KNOW, TYPING AND LOOKING DOWN AT NOTES AND THEN GOING BACK. IT'S ALL JUST COMING FROM YOU RIGHT INTO THE COMPUTER AND IT'S THE BEST WAY TO WRITE THAT I'VE FOUND.

IT'S ALSO THE MOST DANGEROUS WAY TO WRITE BECAUSE YOU CAN JUST WRITE YOURSELF INTO A CORNER AND YOU END UP THROWING OUT LOTS OF PAGES AND THAT'S THE PRICE YOU PAY. BUT I JUST FIND IT'S MORE INVIGORATING AND SO I'M WILLING TO PAY THAT PRICE. AND I OFTEN PAY THE PRICE. I MEAN, ONE OF MY BOOKS, I THREW OUT MORE THAN 200 PAGES BECAUSE I JUST WENT THE WRONG WAY WITH IT.

EXCERPT FROM "ANGELS FLIGHT">> "BOSCH WAS QUIETLY SEETHING. IT WAS THE FIRST TIME HE HAD THOUGHT OF IRVING AS A HYPOCRITE. THE DEPUTY CHIEF HAD ALWAYS BEEN A HARD-ASS, BUT ULTIMATELY A FAIR MAN. THIS MOVE WAS DIFFERENT. HE WAS MANEUVERING TO PROTECT THE DEPARTMENT WHEN THE ROT THEY WERE SEEKING MIGHT BE INSIDE. BUT WHAT IRVING DIDN'T KNOW WAS THAT BOSCH HAD ACCOMPLISHED EVERYTHING IN HIS LIFE BY CHANNELING NEGATIVES INTO MOTIVATION. HE VOWED TO HIMSELF THAT HE WOULD CLEAR THE CASE IN SPITE OF IRVING'S MANEUVERS AND THE CHIPS WOULD FALL WHERE THEY WOULD FALL."

MICHAEL CONNELLY>> IDEAS FROM MY BOOKS COME FROM USING MANY, MANY DIFFERENT CORRIDORS. ONE OF THE THINGS THAT DEFINITELY INSPIRES ME IS THE CITY ITSELF. I WILL SEE A PLACE THAT INTERESTS ME AND I WILL REPEATEDLY GO BACK THERE AND JUST HANG OUT. ALTHOUGH I WAS A REPORTER FOR MANY YEARS, I'M NOT THE TYPE OF PERSON WHO KNOCKS ON DOORS AND STARTS GATHERING FACTS ABOUT A PLACE. I CALL IT RESEARCH BY OSMOSIS. I'D RATHER JUST HANG OUT OR, YOU KNOW, GO TO GRAND CENTRAL MARKET AND JUST GET COFFEE OR A COKE AND SIT AT A TABLE AND JUST KIND OF WATCH THE WORLD GO BY. THAT'S HOW I KIND OF, HOPEFULLY, GET AN ACCURATE SENSE FOR THESE PLACES.

EXCERPT>> "HE LOVED THE CITY MOST AT NIGHT. THERE WAS A RANDOM FEEL TO THE DARK. THE QUIRKINESS OF CHANCE PLAYED OUT IN THE BLUE NEON NIGHT. SO MANY WAYS TO LIVE AND TO DIE. YOU COULD BE RIDING IN THE BACK OF A STUDIO'S BLACK LIMO OR, JUST AS EASILY, THE BACK OF A CORONER'S BLUE VAN. THE SOUND OF APPLAUSE WAS THE SAME AS THE BUZZ OF A BULLET SPINNING PAST YOUR EAR IN THE DARK. THAT RANDOMNESS. THAT WAS L.A."

JESS>> THE TITLE OF CONNELLY'S LATEST BOOK, AGAIN, IS "CITY OF BONES".

VAL>> AND A REMINDER THAT YOU CAN LISTEN TO RECENT PROGRAMS OF LIFE AND TIMES ON OUR WEBSITE WITH STEAMING -- STREAMING -- AUDIO AT KCET.ORG. STEAMING AUDIO? THAT SOUNDS MORE INTERESTING. (LAUGHTER)

JESS>> OCCASIONALLY SCREAMING AUDIO TOO. (LAUGHTER)

VAL>> AND YOU CAN ALSO CHECK OUT THE WEBSITE THAT PERTAINS TO OUR "ETHICS" SERIES. IT'S A WONDERFUL WEBSITE, SO TAKE A LOOK.

JESS>> NOW FOR ALL OF US HERE AT LIFE AND TIMES, HAVE A GREAT EVENING.

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