5/24/02

LC020524

JESS MARLOW>> ON LIFE AND TIMES TONIGHT --

WE'VE ALWAYS KNOWN THEY WERE WILY, BUT NOW SOME OF THEM ARE GETTING DOWNRIGHT BOLD.

PHILIP BRUCE>> COYOTES HAVE BEEN INCREASINGLY TURNING UP AS UNINVITED HOUSE GUESTS IN OUR BACK YARDS AND ON HIKING TRAILS IN GRIFFITH PARK WHERE A SUBSTANTIAL NUMBER OF THEM LIVE.

KARENA HIGGINS>> AND THEY JUST CAME OUT OF NOWHERE, A WHOLE BUNCH OF THEM LIKE PACKS. THEY RUN LIKE LITTLE THREES, TWOS AND THREES, PRETTY BIG. ONE OF THEM I ACTUALLY THOUGHT LOOKED LIKE A WOLF. I GOT SCARED. I HAD TO RUN DOWN AND SING LIKE JINGLE BELLS AND MAKE A LOT OF NOISE SO THAT THEY WOULDN'T ATTACK.

JESS>> IT COULD TURN OUT TO BE THE MOST EXPENSIVE DIVORCE IN HISTORY. THE QUESTION IS, WHAT WILL LOS ANGELES BE LIKE IF THE BREAKUP ACTUALLY OCCURS? AND CAN THE VALLEY AFFORD THE ALIMONY? TONIGHT THE PASSIONS FOR AND AGAINST SECESSION.

PLUS, A CONVERSATION WITH SPIDERMAN, BUT NOT THE ONE FROM THE MOVIE. WE'RE TALKING ABOUT A MAN WHO COLLECTS REAL SPIDERS AND HE WANTS YOUR HELP.

THOSE STORIES AND MORE STRAIGHT AHEAD ON TONIGHT'S LIFE AND TIMES.

LIFE AND TIMES TONIGHT IS MADE POSSIBLE BY THE FOLLOWING FOUNDATIONS:

THE L.K. WHITTIER FOUNDATION
DEDICATED TO IMPROVING THE QUALITY OF LIFE BY SUPPORTING INNOVATIVE ENDEAVORS IN THE FIELDS OF MEDICINE, HEALTH, SCIENCE AND EDUCATION.

AND THE CALIFORNIA ENDOWMENT
THE STATE'S LARGEST HEALTH FOUNDATION SUPPORTING ORGANIZATIONS THAT DIRECTLY IMPROVE THE HEALTH AND WELL-BEING OF CALIFORNIA'S DIVERSE COMMUNITIES. THE CALIFORNIA ENDOWMENT, A PARTNER FOR HEALTHIER COMMUNITIES.

JESS>> GOOD EVENING, I'M JESS MARLOW. VAL HAS THE NIGHT OFF.

IF YOU'VE LIVED IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA FOR ANY LENGTH OF TIME, YOU'VE PROBABLY SEEN A COYOTE AT LEAST ONCE OR TWICE. TYPICALLY THOSE ANIMALS ARE SHY AND THEY TRY TO AVOID PEOPLE, BUT LATELY THERE'VE BEEN REPORTS OF COYOTE ATTACKS, SOMETHING THAT'S GENERALLY UNHEARD OF. THE ANIMALS ARE COMING INTO NEIGHBORHOODS IN SEARCH OF FOOD AND WATER AND, AS PHILIP BRUCE REPORTS, MANY OF THEM DON'T HAVE TO GO VERY FAR SINCE CIVILIZATION HAS STARTED CLOSING IN ON THEIR HABITAT.

PHILIP BRUCE>> THE COYOTE. HE'S BOTH BOLD AND CAUTIOUS, A PRAGMATIC OPPORTUNIST AND A FOOLISH ADVENTURER, AND IT'S SAID THAT NO OTHER PREDATOR HAS A KEENER INSTINCT FOR SURVIVAL.

JENNIFER WOLCH>> THEY'RE VERY BRIGHT. THEY'RE MUCH SMARTER THAN DOMESTIC DOGS.

PHILIP BRUCE>> JENNIFER WOLCH IS A PROFESSOR OF GEOGRAPHY AT USC, AN EXPERT IN THE RELATIONSHIP BETWEEN PEOPLE AND ANIMALS. SHE SAYS NO ONE KNOWS HOW MANY COYOTES EXIST NATIONWIDE AND IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA. SOME ESTIMATE FROM A MILLION TO TENS OF MILLIONS, BUT FOR SURE, THERE ARE MORE OF THEM THAN EVER BEFORE.

JENNIFER WOLCH>> WE'VE URBANIZED NATURAL HABITAT AT A VERY FAST RATE AND THAT MEANS THAT, INEVITABLY AS THE URBAN EDGE EXPANDS, THERE IS MORE AND MORE POTENTIAL FOR PEOPLE TO BE IN CONTACT WITH COYOTES AND OTHER KINDS OF WILDLIFE.

PHILIP BRUCE>> THE COYOTE HAS BECOME ONE OF THE REGION'S TOP PREDATORS WHERE SMALL PETS HAVE BECOME HUNTED PREY. CAPTAIN LOUIS DEDEAUX IS A WILDLIFE SPECIALIST AT THE NORTH CENTRAL ANIMAL SHELTER IN LOS ANGELES.

CAPTAIN LOUIS DEDEAUX>> THEY EAT CATS, THEY EAT SMALL DOGS, THEY'LL EAT POULTRY. IF PEOPLE HAVE RABBITS AND CHICKENS, THEY SHOULD BE REAL CAREFUL.

JENNIFER WOLCH>> YOU SHOULD BE VERY CAREFUL ABOUT LEAVING DOG FOOD OUT, WATER OUT, THAT MAY BE PUT OUT FOR PETS THAT COYOTES MIGHT BE ATTRACTED TO IN PERIODS WHERE THERE ISN'T MUCH WATER AVAILABLE TO THEM. AND ALSO BE CAREFUL ABOUT HOW YOU STORE GARBAGE.

PHILIP BRUCE>> COYOTES HAVE BEEN INCREASINGLY TURNING UP AS UNINVITED HOUSE GUESTS IN OUR BACK YARDS AND ON HIKING TRAILS IN GRIFFITH PARK WHERE A SUBSTANTIAL NUMBER OF THEM LIVE.

JAMES GEORGE>> NO, I HAVE NEVER FELT THREATENED.

PHILIP BRUCE>> JAMES GEORGE, A HIKER FOR SEVENTEEN YEARS, HAS A CAT THAT WAS EATEN BY A COYOTE, BUT THAT HASN'T STOPPED HIM AND OTHER HIKERS FROM THEIR DAILY DOSE OF EXERCISE.

JAMES GEORGE>> WHEN YOU SEE THEM, THEY'RE SLIGHTLY AGITATED AND VERY NERVOUS AND VERY WARY. THEY'RE LOOKING AROUND AND, IF ANYTHING, THEY MOVE AWAY FROM YOU.

KARENA HIGGINS>> AND THEY JUST CAME OUT OF NOWHERE, A WHOLE BUNCH OF THEM LIKE PACKS. THEY RUN LIKE LITTLE THREES, TWOS AND THREES, PRETTY BIG. ONE OF THEM I ACTUALLY THOUGHT LOOKED LIKE A WOLF. I GOT SCARED. I HAD TO RUN DOWN AND SING LIKE JINGLE BELLS TO MAKE A LOT OF NOISE SO THAT THEY WOULDN'T ATTACK.

PHILIP BRUCE>> HISTORICALLY, COYOTES HAVE BEEN PERSECUTED BY HUMANS. THEY WERE TRAPPED AND KILLED TO REDUCE THEIR NUMBERS. NOW TRAPPING IS ILLEGAL. IT ONLY HAPPENS IN THE MOST EXTREME CIRCUMSTANCES.

CAPTAIN LOUIS DEDEAUX>> WHEN THERE IS A COYOTE TRAPPED FOR PUBLIC HEALTH AND SAFETY, IT'S BROUGHT BACK TO THE DISTRICT AND THE COYOTE IS EUTHANIZED. THAT'S PROBABLY HAPPENED ONCE IN THE LAST FIVE YEARS.

PHILIP BRUCE>> ALTHOUGH THE L.A. ANIMAL SERVICES DEPARTMENT RECEIVES AN INCREASE IN CALLS DURING SUMMER WHEN COYOTES BREED, THE THREAT TO PUBLIC SAFETY IS MINIMAL.

JENNIFER WOLCH>> THE RISK TO PEOPLE IS VERY, VERY LOW. COYOTES ARE BASICALLY FEARFUL OF PEOPLE. THEY'RE NOT GOING TO ATTACK PEOPLE. AND THE NUMBER OF NEGATIVE HUMAN INTERACTIONS WITH COYOTES IN TERMS OF ANY KIND OF INJURY IS VANISHINGLY SMALL.

PHILIP BRUCE>> ANOTHER REASON WHY COYOTES KEEP APPEARING COULD BE BECAUSE THEY CAN TRIPLE THEIR NUMBERS EVERY YEAR. ON TOP OF THAT, THEY'VE ADAPTED EXTREMELY WELL TO THE HUMAN ENVIRONMENT.

CAPTAIN LOUIS DEDEAUX>> COYOTES ARE VERY ADAPTABLE. THEY'RE SURVIVORS AND THEY'LL LIVE RIGHT AMONG MAN.

JENNIFER WOLCH>> STUDIES OF COYOTE DIETS IN LOS ANGELES, FOR INSTANCE, INDICATE THAT IN SOME AREAS COYOTES EAT A LOT OF BACK YARD FRUIT, AVOCADOS, WHATEVER HAPPENS TO BE GROWING. THEY'RE OMNIVORES AND SO THEY DO FIND A VARIETY OF THINGS TO EAT IN BUILT-UP AREAS.

PHILIP BRUCE>> THIS EXCELLENT HUNTER DOES PLAY AN IMPORTANT ROLE IN MAINTAINING THE BALANCE OF OUR ECOSYSTEM.

CAPTAIN LOUIS DEDEAUX>> ACTUALLY, IF WE DIDN'T HAVE COYOTES, WE'D BE OVER-POPULATED WITH RATS AND MICE, SO WE NEED THEM.

PHILIP BRUCE>> BUT THE BIGGER QUESTION REMAINS. CAN MAN AND ANIMAL COEXIST TOGETHER IN PEACE?

JAMES GEORGE>> CERTAINLY, IF WE CAN'T LIVE WITH OTHER SPECIES, I THINK WE'RE DOOMED. MAYBE NOT NEXT WEEK OR NEXT YEAR, BUT EVENTUALLY, AND I THINK COEXISTENCE WITH THE SPECIES IS EXTREMELY IMPORTANT AND BENEFICIAL FOR HUMANS. THE IDEA OF EXCLUDING EVERYBODY ELSE BUT HUMANS IS PATENTLY OBSCENE AND ABSURD.

PHILIP BRUCE>> IF THERE'S ONE LESSON WE'VE LEARNED FROM THE COYOTE, IT'S THAT NATURE AND WILDERNESS ARE INTIMATELY RELATED TO PEOPLE AND CITIES. NATURE ISN'T SOMETHING THAT'S JUST YELLOWSTONE OR YOSEMITE, BUT THE HILLS AND LANDSCAPES IN OUR OWN BACK YARDS AS WELL. I'M PHILIP BRUCE FOR LIFE AND TIMES TONIGHT.

JESS>> JERRY GREENWALT JOINS US NOW. HE IS GENERAL MANAGER OF THE LOS ANGELES DEPARTMENT OF ANIMAL SERVICES. THANKS FOR JOINING US.

JERRY GREENWALT>> GOOD EVENING.

JESS>> YOU MUST GET CALLS THIS TIME OF YEAR WHEN THERE'S BEEN A RECENT ATTACK ON A CHILD BY COYOTES.

JERRY GREENWALT>> WE'VE GOTTEN MANY, MANY CALLS IN THE LAST FEW MONTHS. THE CRESCENDO IS UP AS THE WHELPING SEASON COMES INTO THIS TIME OF YEAR. WE GET A LOT MORE CALLS.

JESS>> AND PUPS ARE BEING BORN NOW?

JERRY GREENWALT>> YES. IN THE SPRINGTIME AND THE SUMMER, THE PEOPLE, ESPECIALLY IN THE NORTH VALLEY AND THE SANTA MONICA MOUNTAINS NEAR GRIFFITH PARK, ARE ALL EXPERIENCING AN INCREASE IN THE NUMBER OF COYOTES THAT THEY'VE SIGHTED ON THEIR STREETS OR IN THEIR BACK YARDS OR IN THE FOOTHILLS.

JESS>> THEY WANT YOU TO COME GET THEM?

JERRY GREENWALT>> YES, THEY DO.

JESS>> AND WHAT DO YOU TELL THEM?

JERRY GREENWALT>> WE TELL THEM, FIRST OF ALL, THAT WE DON'T HAVE PEOPLE TO DO THAT. SECOND OF ALL, WE SUGGEST THAT THEY CALL THE DEPARTMENT OF FISH AND GAME. HOWEVER, THEY ARE CONSTITUENTS FOR THE CITY OF LOS ANGELES AND, AS THE ANIMAL SERVICES DEPARTMENT FOR THE CITY, WE FEEL THAT WE ARE OBLIGATED TO RESPOND IN SOME WAY.

JESS>> BUT YOU REASSURE PEOPLE THAT THEY DON'T GENERALLY POSE A THREAT TO HUMANS?

JERRY GREENWALT>> YES. WHAT WE'RE TRYING TO DO RIGHT NOW IS PUT TOGETHER AN INFORMATIONAL AND EDUCATIONAL PROGRAM SO THAT PEOPLE ARE AWARE THAT THE COYOTES ARE NOT THE AGGRESSIVE WILD BEAST THAT SO MANY PEOPLE SEEM TO THINK THEY MIGHT BE. THOSE TYPES OF PEOPLE WANT THEIR NEIGHBORHOODS CLEANED TOTALLY OF COYOTES.

JESS>> PARTICULARLY THOSE PEOPLE WHO HAVE CATS AND DOGS. WHAT DO YOU TELL THEM?

JERRY GREENWALT>> WE SUGGEST THAT THEY KEEP ALL THEIR DOG FOOD AND THEIR WATER IN THE HOUSE. IF THE ANIMALS ARE SMALL, THAT THEY KEEP THEM IN THE HOUSE AS WELL. THAT THEY CLEAN UP THEIR BACK YARD FROM FRUIT AND MAKE SURE THAT THE BRUSH IN THEIR BACK YARD IS NOT OVERGROWN AND PROVIDES PLACES FOR THE COYOTES TO PUT THEIR DENS AND TO HAVE THEIR LITTERS.

JESS>> THEY CLEARLY ARE SURVIVORS, TOO. CIVILIZATION HASN'T MADE A DENT IN THE COYOTE POPULATION. (LAUGHTER)

JERRY GREENWALT>> NOT A DENT IN IT. IN FACT, THERE ARE PLACES IN THE UNITED STATES WHERE THE AUTHORITIES HAVE TRIED TO ANNIHILATE THE COYOTE POPULATION AND IT JUST HASN'T WORKED.

JESS>> ARE THEY CARRIERS OF RABIES?

JERRY GREENWALT>> I BELIEVE THEY ARE SUSPECTED OF CARRYING RABIES, BUT I DON'T THINK THAT WE'VE HAD ANY CASE OF RABIES IN CALIFORNIA FROM COYOTES. WE VERY SELDOM HAVE COYOTES THAT WE ACTUALLY TAKE INTO THE SHELTER UNLESS THEY'RE INJURED OR THEY'RE SICK OR THEY'VE BEEN VERY AGGRESSIVE TOWARDS A HUMAN.

JESS>> EVEN THOSE WHO -- OF COURSE, THE CHILD WHO WAS ATTACKED RECENTLY BY A COYOTE, WOULD YOU SUSPECT THAT THAT MIGHT HAVE BEEN A RABID ANIMAL?

JERRY GREENWALT>> NO, IT WAS PROBABLY JUST --

JESS>> -- A HUNGRY ANIMAL.

JERRY GREENWALT>> HUNGRY AND IT SAW A SMALL CHILD AND THOUGHT IT WAS A VERY OPPORTUNE TIME. EVEN THOUGH THERE WAS AN ADULT HANDY, I THINK THE COYOTE SAW THAT AS AN OPPORTUNITY.

JESS>> JERRY GREENWALT, THANKS VERY MUCH FOR JOINING US AND THANKS FOR THE INFORMATION.

JERRY GREENWALT>> MY PLEASURE.

JESS>> MONDAY ON LIFE AND TIMES, WE'LL TAKE A TRIP TO THE NEVADA DESERT. THE GOVERNMENT WANTS TO STORE ALL OUR RADIOACTIVE WASTE THERE, BUT THE CRITICS SAY THE PROJECT COULD BECOME A NUCLEAR NIGHTMARE.

>> THE FACT THAT IT LOOKS LIKE A REMOTE AREA IS A LITTLE BIT MISLEADING BECAUSE DOWN GRADIENTS AT THE WATER TABLE IS A FARMING REGION THAT USES WELL WATER AND IT USES THAT WELL WATER TO IRRIGATE CROPS, ALFALFA, PRIMARILY, THAT'S FED TO COWS AT A LOCAL DAIRY THAT PRODUCE ABOUT 30,000 GALLONS OF MILK A DAY THAT GOES TO LOS ANGELES.

JESS>> LOS ANGELES HAS SEEN ITS SHARE OF EXPENSIVE DIVORCES, BUT NONE COMPARES TO THE ONE THAT MIGHT OCCUR THIS FALL. THAT'S WHEN VOTERS WILL DECIDE WHETHER THE SAN FERNANDO VALLEY CAN BREAK AWAY FROM LOS ANGELES AND FORM ITS OWN CITY. THE VALLEY SECESSION MEASURE WILL APPEAR ON THE NOVEMBER 5 BALLOT AND IT'S JUST ONE OF THREE BREAK-AWAY MEASURES THAT MAY BE PUT TO A VOTE.

JOINING US NOW IS RICHARD CLOSE, HEAD OF THE SECESSION GROUP KNOWN AS VALLEY VOTE. AND FROM THE OPPOSING CAMP, JEFF DAAR, CO-CHAIR OF ONE LOS ANGELES. ALSO WITH US IS KERMAN MADDOX. KERMAN?

KERMAN MADDOX>> THANK YOU, JESS. WELL, MR. CLOSE, I'M GOING TO START WITH YOU BECAUSE YOUR GROUP, VALLEY VOTE, HAS GENERATED MOST OF THE PUBLICITY. I WAS AT A MEETING THE OTHER NIGHT IN THE CRENSHAW COMMUNITY. IT WAS A GROUP OF AFRICAN-AMERICAN ACTIVISTS AND PROFESSIONALS. IT'S A GROUP CALLED BEYOND 2000. THEY WERE EXPRESSING SOME RESERVATIONS ABOUT VALLEY SECESSION.

THE ARGUMENT THEY MADE IS THAT THEY'RE NOT CONVINCED THAT, IF THE VALLEY BREAKS AWAY, THAT IS GOOD FOR OTHER PARTS OF THE CITY. WHAT I'D LIKE YOU TO DO IS MAKE THE STRONGEST ARGUMENT YOU CAN THAT VALLEY SECESSION IS GOOD FOR OTHER PARTS OF THE CITY OTHER THAN THE SAN FERNANDO VALLEY.

RICHARD CLOSE>> FOR THE LAST SIX YEARS, WE'VE BEEN GOING OUT IN THE COMMUNITIES, PRINCIPALLY IN THE SAN FERNANDO VALLEY, TO EXPLAIN TO THEM WHY IT'S GOOD FOR THE SAN FERNANDO VALLEY. NOW WE'RE FOCUSING THROUGHOUT LOS ANGELES. ONE OF THE PROBLEMS WITH LOS ANGELES IS, IT'S TOO BIG, IT'S DYSFUNCTIONAL, IT'S INEFFICIENT. WE HAVE CITY COUNCIL DISTRICTS OF 245,000 REPRESENTATIVES. IF THE VALLEY BECOMES A SEPARATE CITY, THAT WILL SHRINK TO 135,000.

WHAT'S HAPPENING NOW IS THAT THE CITY COUNCIL IS MORE CONCERNED ABOUT BUILDING FOOTBALL STADIUMS AND SPENDING $299 MILLION DOLLARS TO REMODEL CITY HALL. IF YOU WERE TO HAVE A HEART ATTACK RIGHT NOW HERE IN HOLLYWOOD, IT WOULD TAKE OVER SEVEN MINUTES TO GET THE AMBULANCE HERE. THE SURROUNDING COMMUNITIES HAVE A RESPONSE TIME OF A LITTLE OVER THREE MINUTES. WHAT WE WANT TO DO THROUGHOUT THE COMMUNITIES, THROUGHOUT LOS ANGELES, IS SHOW THEM WHY A SMALLER L.A., A REORGANIZED LOS ANGELES, IS BETTER FOR THE VALLEY AND BETTER FOR EVERYONE AND THIS IS OUR ONE CHANCE. THE STATUS QUO IS JUST NOT ACCEPTABLE.

JESS>> JEFF DAAR, WHAT IS ONE LOS ANGELES'S RESPONSE TO THAT?

JEFF DAAR>> VERY SIMPLE. ONE, THE CITY OF LOS ANGELES IS WORKABLE. IN FACT, I THINK MOST PEOPLE WOULD SAY IT'S THE CITY THAT YOU CAN WORK IN AND IMPROVE AND, IF THERE ARE PROBLEMS, YOU CAN ADDRESS THEM. THE REAL KEY IS, WHO DO YOU ELECT? IF YOU ELECT GOOD CITY COUNCIL MEMBERS, THEY WILL ADDRESS THESE PROBLEMS. IF YOU HAVE A SMALLER VALLEY CITY -- WELL, IT'S NOT GOING TO BE SMALL. IT'S GOING TO BE THE SIXTH LARGEST CITY IN THE COUNTRY. IT'S GOING TO BE BIGGER THAN PHILADELPHIA WITHOUT THE CHEESE STEAKS. IT'S GOING TO BE BIGGER THAN MIAMI. IT'S GOING TO BE BIGGER THAN, YOU KNOW, MOST CITIES.

SIXTH LARGEST CITY, ANOTHER HUGE BUREAUCRACY, AND WILL IT BE ANY DIFFERENT THAN THE EXISTING CITY OF LOS ANGELES, WHICH IS THE SECOND LARGEST CITY? I WOULD SUBMIT TO YOU THAT YOU'RE NOT REALLY CHANGING MUCH. AND IF THE ANSWER IS SMALLER COUNCIL DISTRICTS, WHY WOULD YOU WANT TO DO SOMETHING AS RADICAL AS BREAK UP THE CITY AND GO ON THIS HOPE THAT THINGS MAY GET BETTER FOR BOTH SIDES, THE VALLEY SIDE AND THE REMAINING CITY SIDE, WHEN ALL YOU COULD DO IS SIMPLY MAKE THE COUNCIL DISTRICTS SMALLER AND HAVE MORE COUNCIL DISTRICTS IN THE CITY OF LOS ANGELES?

JESS>> WE'VE TALKED ABOUT THE DIVORCE AND HOW COSTLY IT COULD BE AND THE ALIMONY THAT WOULD BE PAID. VALLEY CITY WOULD HAVE TO PAY THE CITY OF LOS ANGELES WELL OVER A HUNDRED MILLION DOLLARS FOR A PERIOD OF, WHAT, TWENTY YEARS?

RICHARD CLOSE>> IT'S $128 MILLION DOLLARS DECREASED FIVE PERCENT PER YEAR FOR THE TWENTY-YEAR PERIOD. WE'RE WILLING TO DO THAT. THAT'S THE COST OF THE REORGANIZATION OF LOS ANGELES. BUT WE WILL, IN THE VALLEY, HAVE A RESERVE OF OVER $140 MILLION DOLLARS AFTER OVER THREE YEARS. WHAT WE'RE SEEING IS THAT WE'RE GOING TO BE ABLE TO HAVE MORE POLICE OFFICERS, MORE PARAMEDICS AND A MORE EFFICIENT AND EFFECTIVE AND CLEANER CITY.

THE STATUS QUO IS NOT ACCEPTABLE. PEOPLE ARE LEAVING, BUSINESSES ARE LEAVING. PEOPLE ARE LEAVING THE CITY. THEY'RE GOING TO THE SURROUNDING AREAS AND WHY? BECAUSE THE CITY COUNCIL AND THE MAYOR ARE MORE CONCERNED ABOUT MAINTAINING THEIR POWER AND BUILDING EDIFICES, OF STADIUMS, OF CITY HALL REMODELS, RATHER THAN BRINGING BASIC SERVICES.

KERMAN MADDOX>> LET ME ASK MR. DAAR THIS QUESTION. IF IN FACT THE STATUS QUO IS SO EFFICIENT, WHY DOES THE VALLEY WANT TO BREAK AWAY? SAN PEDRO WANT TO BREAK AWAY? HOLLYWOOD WANT TO BREAK AWAY? OBVIOUSLY, SOMETHING IS WRONG WITH LOCAL GOVERNMENT IN THIS REGION.

JEFF DAAR>> OH, I'M NOT TELLING YOU I'M DEFENDING THE CITY THAT CAN'T BE BETTERED. I THINK IT CAN BE AND I THINK ONE OF THE THINGS THAT VALLEY VOTE HAS DONE, THE PROPONENTS OF SECESSION, IS TO DRAW ATTENTION TO ITEMS OF NEED IN THE VALLEY. I THINK THAT'S A GOOD THING. IN FACT, I THINK THE CITY'S BEEN RESPONDING, ADDRESSING OVER THE LAST TWO YEARS IN PARTICULAR, THE INADEQUACIES OF VALLEY SERVICES, AND VALLEY SERVICES ARE BEING INCREASED. MY POINT IS THAT YOU CAN ACCOMPLISH ALL OF THAT WITHOUT DOING SOMETHING RADICAL, WHICH IS WHAT IS BEING SUGGESTED, AND DOING THINGS WHERE YOU DON'T KNOW WHAT THE RESULTS WILL BE.

KERMAN MADDOX>> AND YOUR IMMEDIATE RESPONSE TO THAT WOULD BE WHAT? IF IT'S NOT VALLEY SECESSION, IF IT'S NOT THE BOROUGH SYSTEM, WHAT CAN WE DO OVERNIGHT TO CONVINCE PEOPLE IN THE VALLEY AND SAN PEDRO AND OTHER PLACES THAT LOS ANGELES REALLY CAN GOVERN EFFECTIVELY?

JEFF DAAR>> WELL, I THINK, FIRST OF ALL, IF YOU LOOK, IS THERE A GROUNDSWELL OF PEOPLE IN SUPPORT OF THIS? I WOULD SUBMIT TO YOU THAT THERE IS A VERY SMALL VOCAL MINORITY. WHY DO I SAY THAT? IF YOU LOOK AT YESTERDAY'S LAFCO HEARING WHICH IS WHEN LAFCO, THE LOCAL AGENCY FORMATION COMMISSION, PUT THIS ON THE BALLOT, THE PROPONENTS OF SECESSION, RIGHTLY SO, TRIED TO HAVE THE ROOM PACKED. IT WAS AT THE COUNTY HALL OF ADMINISTRATION WHERE THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS MEET. THE ROOM WAS TYPICALLY, LIKE EVERYTHING IN THIS MOVEMENT, IT WAS RELATIVELY EMPTY. IT WASN'T EVEN HALF FULL. IT WASN'T EVEN A THIRD FULL --

RICHARD CLOSE>> -- EXCEPT YOU LOOK AT THE L.A. TIMES POLL, 55 PERCENT OF THE VALLEY SUPPORTS THE VALLEY CITYHOOD AND --

JESS>> -- DO THEY SUPPORT CITYHOOD OR DO THEY SUPPORT THE VOTE?

RICHARD CLOSE>> NO, THEY SUPPORT THE CITYHOOD. CITYWIDE IT WAS 46 TO 34. PEOPLE ARE SICK AND TIRED WITH THE STATUS QUO. WHY DON'T WE HAVE THE SAME LEVEL OF POLICE AND FIRE PROTECTION THAT OTHER CITIES DO? WHY IS THE MAYOR MORE CONCERNED ABOUT PROTECTING HIS EMPIRE THAN GIVING BASIC SERVICES? WHY DO WE HAVE MORE POTHOLES? YOU LOOK AT NORTH HOLLYWOOD VERSUS BURBANK. TWO ADJACENT CITIES. ONE'S CLEAN AND SAFE. IN NORTH HOLLYWOOD, THEY HAVE POTHOLES, GRAFFITI. I MEAN, IT'S JUST NOT FAIR TO THE RESIDENTS, IT'S NOT FAIR TO THE BUSINESSES.

WE'RE GOING TO END UP WITH TWO OR FOUR STRONG CITIES, AND THAT'S WHAT THIS IS ALL ABOUT. A SENSE OF COMMUNITY, ELECTED OFFICIALS WHO LIVE IN THE COMMUNITY WHO KNOW THE COMMUNITY'S PROBLEMS, WHETHER IT'S IN SOUTH CENTRAL, IN SAN PEDRO, THROUGHOUT. I MEAN, THIS IS A MOVEMENT MUCH LIKE PROP 13 WHICH STARTED IN THE SAN FERNANDO VALLEY. THIS IS GOING TO SPREAD THROUGHOUT THE COUNTRY. THIS IS THE DEFINITION OF LOCAL CONTROL, LOCAL CITY GOVERNMENT. FOUR MILLION PEOPLE --

JESS>> -- WE'LL SEE THAT IN CHICAGO, DETROIT AND NEW YORK? WE'RE GOING TO SEE THAT BREAK-AWAY TOO?

RICHARD CLOSE>> WELL, THOSE AREAS AT LEAST HAVE SMALLER CITY COUNCIL DISTRICTS. 246,000 PEOPLE PER CITY COUNCIL DISTRICT IN L.A. NO CITY IN THE COUNTRY IS ANYWHERE NEAR THAT. MOST PEOPLE NEVER EVEN SEE THEIR COUNCIL MEMBER --

JESS>> -- EVERY TIME WE'VE TRIED TO EXPAND THE CITY COUNCIL, THOUGH, THE VOTERS HAVE TURNED IT DOWN FLATLY.

JEFF DAAR>> ABSOLUTELY, TWO TO ONE.

RICHARD CLOSE>> LAST TIME, BECAUSE THEY PUT IT OFF TO THE SIDE. THEY HAD TWO MEASURES. ONE FOR 21 COUNCIL MEMBERS AND ONE FOR 25 COUNCIL MEMBERS. THIRTY PERCENT VOTED FOR ONE, FORTY PERCENT VOTED THE OTHER, AND BOTH OF THEM WENT DOWN IN DEFEAT.

KERMAN MADDOX>> LET ME ASK YOU A QUICK QUESTION, THOUGH, IN RESPONSE TO WHAT HE SAID. STEVE LOPEZ OF THE L.A. TIMES WROTE AN ARTICLE THE OTHER DAY. HE MADE A MENTION OF IT. A LOT OF PEOPLE SAY THERE'S A SMALL SEGMENT OF ACTIVISTS LIKE YOURSELF WHO ARE INTERESTED, BUT MOST PEOPLE IN THE VALLEY DON'T EVEN THINK THIS IS AN IMPORTANT ISSUE. WHAT'S YOUR RESPONSE TO THAT?

RICHARD CLOSE>> WELL, FIRST OF ALL, THE L.A. TIMES POLLS SHOW THAT A MAJORITY WANT IT TO HAPPEN. NUMBER TWO, 202,000 PEOPLE SIGNED PETITIONS FOR THE PROCESS TO BEGIN. THAT IS THE HIGHEST NUMBER OF REGISTERED VOTERS OF ANY OTHER PETITION PROCESS IN THE COUNTRY. WHAT'S WE'RE SEEING, OUR PHONES ARE RINGING OFF THE HOOK. PEOPLE WANT TO GET INVOLVED. THIS IS PROP 13. THIS IS LOCAL GOVERNMENT. THIS IS REINVENTING HOW TO DELIVER LOCAL SERVICES.

JESS>> IT'S GOING TO BE INTERESTING BETWEEN NOW AND NOVEMBER. WE THANK YOU BOTH FOR JOINING US. THANKS TO RICHARD CLOSE FROM VALLEY VOTE AND JEFF DAAR FROM ONE LOS ANGELES AND, AS ALWAYS, THANKS TO KERMAN.

KERMAN MADDOX>> THANK YOU, JESS.

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JESS>> YOU MAY WANT TO CALL THE KIDS BECAUSE WE'RE ABOUT TO MEET SPIDERMAN. WE'RE NOT TALKING ABOUT THE GUY IN TIGHTS WHO JUMPS AROUND IN THE MOVIES. OUR SPIDERMAN ACTUALLY COLLECTS SPIDERS AND SCORPIONS AND HE WANTS YOUR HELP. IN FACT, HE'S LAUNCHING SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA'S FIRST EVER SPIDER SURVEY AND HIS GOAL IS TO COLLECT 1,000 SPIDERS OVER THE NEXT TWO DAYS.

JOINING US NOW IS SPIDERMAN HIMSELF, BRIAN BROWN. HE'S ASSOCIATE CURATOR OF ENTOMOLOGY AT THE NATURAL HISTORY MUSEUM IN LOS ANGELES. ALSO HERE IS BRENT KARNER. HE'S IN CHARGE OF THE MUSEUM'S INSECT ZOO. THEY BROUGHT SOME EIGHT-LEGGED FRIENDS WITH THEM TONIGHT, BUT FIRST I'M GOING TO HAVE TO ASK WHY THE NEED FOR, WHAT, 1,000 SPIDERS?

BRIAN BROWN>> WELL, LOS ANGELES HAS CHANGED A LOT IN THE LAST FIFTY YEARS. IT'S BECOME MUCH MORE URBANIZED AND THE SPIDER FAUNA, AS THE FAUNA OF LOTS OF OTHER THINGS, HAS CHANGED AS WELL AND NOBODY IS STUDYING THIS. SO WE NEED TO TAKE A SLICE OF TIME AND STUDY THE SPIDERS RIGHT NOW SO WE CAN COMPARE FURTHER CHANGES AND SEE HOW THINGS HAVE CHANGED OVER THE LAST CENTURY OR SO.

JESS>> AND YOU'RE LOOKING FOR LOCAL SPIDERS THEN? INDIGENOUS SPIDERS?

BRIAN BROWN>> THAT'S RIGHT. BUT A LOT OF SPIDERS HAVE BEEN INTRODUCED HERE AND THAT'S ANOTHER ASPECT OF THE THING. THIS IS AN INTERNATIONAL PORT CITY, SO A LOT OF SPIDERS ARE BROUGHT IN AND INTRODUCED ALL THE TIME.

JESS>> THIS ONE IS WHAT?

BRIAN BROWN>> THIS IS A TARANTULA. THIS IS A NATIVE THING. TARANTULAS ARE FOUND IN NATURAL AREAS AROUND LOS ANGELES AND WE DON'T EXPECT TOO MANY OF THEM TO COME INTO THE SPIDER SURVEY.

THIS IS A COMMON ORB WEAVER. THIS IS SOMETHING PEOPLE SEE A LOT IN THEIR BACK YARD. IT WEAVES LARGE WEBS THAT CATCH INSECTS. CATCHES PEOPLE EYES A LOT.

JESS>> THESE ARE THE KINDS YOU'LL EXPECT PEOPLE TO TURN IN.

BRIAN BROWN>> RIGHT. THIS IS A BLACK WIDOW. THIS IS THE ONLY REALLY DANGEROUS SPIDER THAT'S FOUND IN THIS AREA. WE TELL PEOPLE NOT TO HANDLE ANYTHING THAT LOOKS LIKE THIS.

JESS>> BUT OTHER SPIDERS ALSO HAVE VENOM AND DO BITE, DON'T THEY?

BRIAN BROWN>> THEY DO, BUT IT'S VERY UNLIKELY THAT SOMEONE WOULD GET HURT BY THE SPIDER. SPIDERS ARE EXTREMELY NON-AGGRESSIVE, NOT VERY -- THIS IS A SOWBUG KILLER. THIS IS ANOTHER TYPE OF SPIDER THAT'S FOUND IN THE LOS ANGELES AREA.

JESS>> THE NAME WOULD SUGGEST THAT IT EATS SOWBUGS.

BRIAN BROWN>> IT DOES. THAT'S RIGHT. THIS IS A JUMPING SPIDER. THIS IS MY FAVORITE FAMILY OF SPIDERS BECAUSE THEY'RE VERY ACROBATIC AND THEY'RE VERY NON-AGGRESSIVE AND FRIENDLY. YOU CAN PLAY WITH THEM, ACTUALLY. HAVE THEM JUMP FROM YOUR HAND --

JESS>> -- NOW IS THIS A NATIVE SPIDER TOO? THE JUMPING SPIDER?

BRIAN BROWN>> YES, IT IS. THERE'S LOTS OF DIFFERENT SPECIES. THIS IS A CRAB SPIDER. THEY SIT ON FLOWERS WHERE THEY'RE CAMOUFLAGED AND THEY CATCH BEES AND FLIES WHEN THEY COME IN. THEY BITE THEM AND KILL THEM VERY QUICKLY. THIS IS ANOTHER CRAB SPIDER. CRAB SPIDERS CAN ACTUALLY CHANGE THEIR COLOR A LITTLE BIT LIKE A CHAMELEON TO BLEND IN WITH THE FLOWERS.

JESS>> NOW YOU WANT PEOPLE TO COLLECT SPIDERS AND BRING THEM IN, BUT HOW DO YOU CORRAL A SPIDER?

BRIAN BROWN>> WELL, I CAN SHOW YOU THAT. THE MAIN THING TO REMEMBER IS, DON'T TOUCH THEM WITH YOUR BARE HANDS. IT'S UNLIKELY YOU'LL GET HURT, BUT JUST TO BE SAFE. SO HERE'S A FRIENDLY LITTLE SPIDER OF MINE. GET HER TO COME OUT. THERE SHE IS, OKAY. SO THE MAIN THING TO DO IS JUST DROP SOMETHING ON TOP OF HER LIKE THAT. THERE SHE IS. THEN YOU CAN JUST SLIP ANOTHER PIECE OF PAPER UNDERNEATH, TURN HER OVER AND PUT THE LID ON THE CONTAINER.

JESS>> AND BRING IT IN TO YOU?

BRIAN BROWN>> BRING IT IN TO US FOR THE INSECT FAIR OVER THE NEXT COUPLE OF DAYS. THAT'S WHERE WE'RE HAVING OUR KICKOFF.

JESS>> NOW THIS HAS NO AIR HOLES IN IT.

BRIAN BROWN>> SPIDERS CAN LAST A LONG TIME IN A CONTAINER LIKE THIS. THEY'RE VERY TOUGH ANIMALS.

JESS>> ALL RIGHT, LET'S SEE SOME OF THE INSECTS WE'LL SEE AT THE INSECT FAIR.

BRENT KARNER>> SURE. I CAN BRING SOMETHING OUT FOR YOU GUYS. SEEING AS HOW WE'RE DEALING WITH SPIDERS, I'M STICKING WITH A SPIDER THEME. I BROUGHT WITH ME MARIA HERE, A MEXICAN RED KNEE TARANTULA. PART OF WHAT THE INSECT FAIR IS ALL ABOUT IS KIND OF TO INTRODUCE PEOPLE TO THESE ANIMALS NOT TO HAVE THEM LOOK AT THEM AS THESE AWFUL MONSTERS THAT PEOPLE SEEM TO VIEW THEM AS.

JESS>> AND THIS IS NOT NATIVE TO LOS ANGELES?

BRENT KARNER>> NO, THIS IS, IN ITS NAME, MEXICAN RED KNEE. IT COMES FROM MEXICO. IT'S ACTUALLY AN ENDANGERED SPECIES THROUGH HABITAT DESTRUCTION. THE HOMES OF THESE SPIDERS HAVE BEEN PRETTY MUCH DESTROYED AND WE'RE ACTUALLY LUCKY ENOUGH TO STILL HAVE ONE. THEY'RE GREAT SPIDERS, THEY'RE HANDSOME SPIDERS AND THEY'RE VERY EASY TO DEAL WITH. AS YOU CAN SEE, THIS ONE HERE DOESN'T REALLY EVEN WANT TO RUN AWAY LIKE THE ONE BRIAN JUST DUMPED OUT. SHE'S COMPLETELY HANDLE-ABLE. I CAN SHOW HER AROUND, I CAN PUT HER ON MYSELF IF I REALLY WANTED TO. SHE'S AS FUZZY AS A HAMSTER AND AS FRIENDLY AS A LAP CAT.

JESS>> NO BITE?

BRENT KARNER>> NO, NOTHING TO WORRY ABOUT. I GET ASKED THAT QUESTION A LOT. ONE OF THE FIRST THINGS I OFTEN ANSWER TO PEOPLE IS, WELL, I MEAN, I BITE AND YOU'RE NOT SCARED OF ME. (LAUGHTER) YOU HAVE TO UNDERSTAND THE BEHAVIOR OF THESE ANIMALS AND THAT'S PART OF WHAT WE'RE DOING AT THE INSECT FAIR TOO.

JESS>> WHAT ELSE HAVE YOU GOT FOR US HERE?

BRENT KARNER>> I CAN SHOW YOU THAT TOO. AGAIN, STICKING WITH THE SPIDER THEME, ONE THAT CAN BE FOUND RELATIVELY CLOSE. IN ARIZONA YOU CAN COLLECT THESE. THIS OLD LADY HERE -- I CALL HER OLD BECAUSE SHE'S ABOUT 22 YEARS OLD --

JESS>> -- REALLY? HOW LONG DO THEY LIVE?

BRENT KARNER>> WELL, TARANTULAS CAN LIVE UP TO ABOUT THIRTY YEARS AS FEMALES. THE MALES LIVE ONLY -- THEY MATURE IN ABOUT FIVE YEARS AND ONLY LIVE ABOUT A YEAR AFTER, BUT THE FEMALES CAN LIVE A GREAT DEAL OF TIME AFTER THAT. THIS ONE HERE IS ABOUT 22, A TUCSON BLONDE TARANTULA, FOUND IN ARIZONA. AGAIN, VERY FRIENDLY, HANDLE-ABLE, VERY GREAT. YOU SAW A PICTURE OF A NATIVE TARANTULA ON THE SCREEN. I HAVE A NATIVE TARANTULA HERE AS WELL. JUST TO GIVE YOU AN IDEA OF WHAT THEY DO LOOK LIKE.

JESS>> NOT NEARLY AS MENACING AS LEGEND HAS IT.

BRENT KARNER>> THERE SHE IS RIGHT THERE.

JESS>> MUCH SMALLER.

BRENT KARNER>> YEAH. THIS IS A MANHATTAN GRAY TARANTULA YOU FIND, AS BRIAN MENTIONED, IN THE MORE NATIVE AREAS OF LOS ANGELES, ESPECIALLY AT THE OUTSKIRTS. SHE'S VERY NICE AS WELL. YOU CAN PICK HER UP JUST LIKE THAT.

JESS>> NOW IS THAT TYPICAL OF THE SIZE?

BRENT KARNER>> THEY CAN BE A LITTLE BIT LARGER THAN THIS, BUT THAT'S PRETTY TYPICAL OF THE SIZE RIGHT THERE. NOT ALL THAT MONSTROUS COMPARED TO THE OTHER ONES I DID BRING OUT. JUST TO GIVE PEOPLE AN INDICATION OF WHERE SPIDERS FIT, I ALSO BROUGHT ANOTHER FRIEND HERE TOO. THIS IS AN EMPEROR SCORPION FROM AFRICA. SCORPIONS ALSO HAVE A VERY BAD NAME AND PROBABLY A LITTLE BIT UNDESERVED FOR THE MOST CASES. THIS ONE HERE, A CLOSE RELATIVE OF THE SPIDERS.

SCORPIONS AND SPIDERS ARE ARACHNIDS. IN FACT, EVEN IN BRIAN'S SPIDER SURVEY RIGHT NOW, HE'S GETTING A FEW OTHER SPIDER RELATIVES IN AS PEOPLE ARE BRINGING THEM IN. THINGS LIKE SUN SPIDERS ARE COMING IN. I DON'T HAVE AN EXAMPLE OF ONE OF THOSE, BUT THEY'RE ALL ARACHNIDS AND WE LOVE THEM ALL. YOU CAN SEE A HOST OF THESE THINGS AT THE INSECT FAIR THIS COMING WEEKEND AT THE NATURAL HISTORY MUSEUM, MAY 25 AND 26.

JESS>> AND, CHILDREN, WE'RE NOT TALKING "ITSY BITSY SPIDER" HERE. (LAUGHTER) THANK YOU BOTH FOR COMING. BRIAN BROWN, BRENT KARNER, THANK YOU. THE INSECT FAIR AND SPIDER SURVEY IS THIS WEEKEND AT THE NATURAL HISTORY MUSEUM. FOR INFORMATION ABOUT THE FAIR AND HOW TO COLLECT SPIDERS, CHECK THEIR WEBSITE AT WWW.NHM.ORG/SPIDERS.

[213-763-3552]

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