10/8/02

LC02108

VAL ZAVALA>> ON LIFE AND TIMES TONIGHT --

JESS MARLOW>> THE HOMELESS MAY HAVE TO LOOK FOR A FREE LUNCH IN SOME OTHER ZIP CODE. SANTA MONICA IS GETTING FED UP.

STEVE MELTZER>> BECAUSE WE HAVE NOW A HUGE POPULATION, MANY OF WHOM ARE UNABLE TO TAKE CARE OF THEMSELVES AND REALLY SUFFER FROM MENTAL ILLNESS, THOSE FOLKS ARE BEING PUSHED ASIDE BY A LOT OF OTHER PEOPLE OF VERY NORMAL INTELLIGENCE WHO HAVE SIMPLY DISCOVERED THAT THIS IS AN AREA WHERE THEY CAN ACHIEVE URBAN CAMPING ON A LONG-TERM BASIS.

VAL>> BILL SIMON SAYS IT STINKS.

>> “DIOXIN IS A TOXIC CHEMICAL THAT CAUSES CANCER AND BIRTH DEFECTS. THE GRAY DAVIS BOARD STOPPED A BIG OIL COMPANY, TOSCO, FROM DUMPING MORE DIOXIN INTO OUR WATER, BUT THE VERY NEXT DAY...”

VAL>> BUT HOW VALID ARE HIS CLAIMS ABOUT GRAY DAVIS’S TIES TO A MAJOR OIL COMPANY? WE’LL PUT THE SIMON AD TO THE TEST IN TONIGHT’S “REALITY CHECK”.

JESS>> PRESIDENT BUSH SAYS HE HAS HAD ENOUGH. NOW THE DEADLOCK AT THE DOCKS APPEARS TO BE COMING TO AN END. TONIGHT WE’LL LOOK AT THE WINNERS AND LOSERS OF THIS PROLONGED LABOR FEUD AND WE’LL FIND OUT HOW LONG IT MAY BE BEFORE THE FREIGHT STARTS MOVING AGAIN.

VAL>> THESE STORIES COMING UP NEXT ON LIFE AND TIMES TONIGHT.

LIFE AND TIMES TONIGHT IS MADE POSSIBLE BY THE FOLLOWING FOUNDATIONS:

THE L.K. WHITTIER FOUNDATION
DEDICATED TO IMPROVING THE QUALITY OF LIFE BY SUPPORTING INNOVATIVE ENDEAVORS IN THE FIELDS OF MEDICINE, HEALTH, SCIENCE AND EDUCATION.

AND THE CALIFORNIA ENDOWMENT
THE STATE'S LARGEST HEALTH FOUNDATION SUPPORTING ORGANIZATIONS THAT DIRECTLY IMPROVE THE HEALTH AND WELL-BEING OF CALIFORNIA'S DIVERSE COMMUNITIES. THE CALIFORNIA ENDOWMENT, A PARTNER FOR HEALTHIER COMMUNITIES.

VAL>> GOOD EVENING, I’M VAL ZAVALA.

JESS>> AND I’M JESS MARLOW. SANTA MONICA HAS ALWAYS BEEN A PLACE WHERE THE HOMELESS COULD COUNT ON THE KINDNESS OF STRANGERS, BUT MAYBE NOT AFTER TONIGHT. AT THIS VERY HOUR, THE SANTA MONICA CITY COUNCIL IS HOSTING A LIVELY DEBATE ON WHERE TO DRAW THE LINE.

VAL>> THE COUNCIL IS CONSIDERING TWO MEASURES. ONE WOULD STOP THE HOMELESS FROM SETTING UP CAMP IN DOWNTOWN DOORWAYS. THE OTHER WOULD PUT NEW RESTRICTIONS ON CHARITABLE GROUPS THAT GIVE STREET PEOPLE FREE FOOD. AS GAY YEE REPORTS, THE CONTROVERSY GOES TO THE VERY HEART OF SANTA MONICA’S IDENTITY.

GAY YEE>> IT’S A WEEKLY RITUAL HERE IN SANTA MONICA’S REED PARK. THE COFFEE’S ON AND THE FOOD LINE BEGINS. EVERY FRIDAY MORNING, BREAKFAST IS SERVED THIS WAY TO A GROUP OF UP TO SEVENTY HOMELESS PEOPLE IN THE PARK. ALL THE REGULARS TAKE THEIR PLACES IN LINE. THE LADY AND HER PET RAT, THE FOLKS WITH THE CAT ON A LEASH, THERE’S EVEN A RESIDENT COMEDIAN.

>> FIRST OF ALL, I’D LIKE TO THANK MY PARENTS FOR GIVING ME THE OPPORTUNITY TO BE HOMELESS.

KATHERINE LOCKE>> SOMETIMES I LOOK AT THIS AS BEING A PICNIC, YOU KNOW? WE’RE JUST HAVING A PICNIC OUT HERE AND ANYONE CAN COME HERE AND HAVE A PICNIC AND SERVE COFFEE TO THEIR FAMILY AND THAT’S WHAT I FEEL THAT WE’RE DOING. IT JUST HAPPENS TO BE A DIFFERENT LOOK TO OUR FAMILY.

GAY YEE>> KATHERINE LOCKE AND HER FRIENDS HAVE BEEN FEEDING THE HOMELESS IN THIS PARK FOR THE PAST FIVE YEARS. THEY PAY FOR IT OUT OF THEIR OWN POCKETS AND LOOK FORWARD TO IT EVERY WEEK.

JUDY KEHR>> I MAKE BOLOGNA SANDWICHES AND WE KIND OF HAVE A PARTY ON THURSDAY NIGHT MAKING THE BOLOGNA SANDWICHES WITH TWO OTHER WOMEN.

ANDY DUNBAR>> WE ALL FUND IT OURSELVES. THERE’S A GROUP OF BETWEEN FIVE AND EIGHT OF US THAT JUST COME OUT EVERY FRIDAY. WE SUPPLY THE MONEY OURSELVES.

GAY YEE>> BUT SOME PEOPLE SAY THESE WELL-MEANING CITIZENS AND THEIR WARM GENEROSITY ARE TURNING SANTA MONICA INTO A MAGNET FOR THE HOMELESS, SO THE SANTA MONICA CITY COUNCIL IS CONSIDERING TWO ORDINANCES. ONE WOULD MAKE IT ILLEGAL TO SIT OR SLEEP IN DOWNTOWN DOORWAYS OVERNIGHT. THE OTHER WOULD LIMIT FREE OUTDOOR MEALS. CHARITABLE GROUPS WOULD HAVE TO FOLLOW COMMUNITY EVENT LAWS AND COUNTY HEALTH STANDARDS WHICH REQUIRE SPECIAL PERMITS. SOME CHARITIES SAY THEY COULD NO LONGER AFFORD TO FEED THE HOMELESS.

KATHERINE LOCKE>> YOU KNOW, THERE’S THAT POSSIBILITY, BUT, YOU KNOW, WE’LL CROSS THAT BRIDGE WHEN WE GET TO IT.

GAY YEE>> SOME SAY THIS HAS BEEN A LONG TIME COMING. THIS IS THE FIRST CRACK-DOWN ON THE HOMELESS IN TEN YEARS. THEY SAY IT’S BEEN ALLOWED TO GO ON TOO LONG AND THERE ARE TOO MANY AND EVERYONE KNOWS THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS A FREE LUNCH. STEVE MELTZER OWNS “PUPPETOLIO”, A PUPPET THEATER AND MUSEUM ON SECOND STREET IN SANTA MONICA. HIS BUSINESS CATERS TO CHILDREN.

STEVE MELTZER>> VERY, VERY ROUGH TO CONVINCE PEOPLE TO HAVE A CHILDREN’S PARTY WHEN THEY WOULD WALK UP AND THERE WOULD BE, YOU KNOW, A TRANSIENT RIGHT THERE AROUND THE CLOCK.

GAY YEE>> AS A DOWNTOWN BUSINESSMAN AND RESIDENT, MELTZER HAS NIGHTMARE STORIES OF DEALING WITH DERANGED HOMELESS PEOPLE OUTSIDE HIS DOORSTEP.

STEVE MELTZER>> THE FACT THAT A PSYCHOTIC WOMAN WAS HERE ONE NIGHT AND SMEARED FECES EVERYWHERE AND I HAD THREE HOURS OF CLEAN-UP, THAT’S NOT EVEN THE REASON THAT I’M CONSIDERING IT A PROBLEM.

GAY YEE>> MELTZER SAYS SANTA MONICA HAS A REPUTATION FOR BEING LIBERAL AND CHARITABLE TO THE HOMELESS, BUT HE SAYS IT’S NOT HELPING PEOPLE. IT’S ENABLING THEM, AND TURNING ONE OF THE MOST DESIRABLE CITIES IN LOS ANGELES COUNTY INTO AN URBAN CAMPGROUND.

STEVE MELTZER>> BECAUSE WE HAVE NOW A HUGE POPULATION, MANY OF WHOM ARE UNABLE TO TAKE CARE OF THEMSELVES AND REALLY SUFFER FROM MENTAL ILLNESS, THOSE FOLKS ARE BEING PUSHED ASIDE BY A LOT OF OTHER PEOPLE OF VERY NORMAL INTELLIGENCE WHO HAVE SIMPLY DISCOVERED THAT THIS IS AN AREA WHERE THEY CAN ACHIEVE URBAN CAMPING ON A LONG-TERM BASIS.

GAY YEE>> BUT MELTZER SAYS MANY OF THE BIGGEST ENABLERS ARE OUTSIDERS, CHURCH GROUPS FROM OTHER CITIES THAT COME TO SANTA MONICA TO FEED THE HOMELESS.

STEVE MELTZER>> ALL THEY NEED TO DO IS LOAD UP THE VAN AND MAKE SOME SANDWICHES AND THEY CAN COME HERE AND PASS THEM OUT AND GET A SLICE OF LIFE AND THEN THEY CAN DRIVE BACK TO LA CANADA (LAUGHTER) OR WHEREVER IT IS THEY COME FROM. THAT IS NOT THE SOLUTION.

GAY YEE>> SOME OF THE HOMELESS ADMIT SANTA MONICA IS MORE HOSPITABLE THAN OTHER COMMUNITIES, BUT THEY SAY TAKING AWAY THEIR FOOD IS NOT THE SOLUTION.

>> IT’S NOT REALLY TOO MANY HOMELESS. IT’S BECAUSE THERE’S NOT ENOUGH HOUSING.

>> ALL I WANT OUT OF THIS WHOLE DEAL IS THAT ME AND MY WIFE CAN HAVE A HOME AND I CAN WORK, BUT BEING HOMELESS AND NO ADDRESS, I CAN’T DO THAT.

GAY YEE>> KATHERINE LOCKE IS OPTIMISTIC THAT A COMPROMISE CAN BE WORKED OUT WITH THE CITY, BUT EVEN IF A COMPROMISE FAILS, SHE AND HER FRIENDS SAY THEY’LL CONTINUE TO SERVE.

KATHERINE LOCKE>> THIS IS A LITTLE FAMILY THAT WE HAVE AND WE KNOW EACH OTHER BY NAME AND WE LOVE SEEING EACH OTHER ON FRIDAYS, SO, YOU KNOW, IF WE’RE NOT GOING TO DO IT IN THIS PARK, IF IT COMES DOWN TO THAT AND WE DON’T DO IT IN THIS PARK, THEN WE’LL FIND ANOTHER SPOT.

>> YEAH, THERE’S ALWAYS THE CURBS.

JESS>> GAY YEE JOINS US NOW. SANTA MONICA HAS DONE THIS FOR A LOT OF YEARS. THESE PROGRAMS HAVE BEEN GOING ON FOR A LONG TIME. HAS IT GOTTEN SO MUCH LARGER? IS THAT THE REASON FOR THE OUTCRY?

GAY YEE>> THEY BELIEVE THAT THERE ARE AS MANY AS A THOUSAND TRANSIENTS IN SANTA MONICA ON ANY GIVEN DAY.

JESS>> ALL CLUSTERED AROUND THE OCEANFRONT AREA?

GAY YEE>> NOT NECESSARILY THE OCEANFRONT AREA. IT COULD BE AT MANY OF THE PARKS. ALL THE PARKS HAVE FOOD GIVEAWAYS. THERE ARE AS MANY AS THIRTY GROUPS IN A MONTH THAT GIVE THESE FOOD GIVEAWAYS NOT NECESSARILY FROM THE COMMUNITY. PEOPLE COME FROM AS FAR AWAY AS OXNARD TO COME DOWN TO HELP OUT.

JESS>> MOTIVATED BY WHAT?

GAY YEE>> A FEELING OF WANTING TO DO SERVICE. BUT THE CONCERN IS THE FACT THAT THEY MAY PROVIDE FOOD FOR THE HOMELESS HERE, BUT THERE’S NO CONNECTION TO ANY OTHER SORT OF RESOURCE. SOME SORT OF RESOURCE SUCH AS ALCOHOLISM PROGRAMS OR A SHELTER. IT’S JUST THE FOOD, SO IT KIND OF PROLONGS THE SITUATION.

VAL>> SO IT BECOMES A MAGNET FOR THE HOMELESS WITHOUT REALLY HELPING THEM SOLVE THEIR BASIC PROBLEMS.

GAY YEE>> THAT IS THE POINT THAT SOME OF THE CITY COUNCIL MEMBERS ARE TRYING TO MAKE.

VAL>> AND WHAT’S HAPPENING TONIGHT?

GAY YEE>> THEY MAY BE VOTING ON IT AS WE SPEAK. IT’S THE POINT THAT THEY ARE WORKING. THE TWO ORDINANCES ARE BEING LOOKED AT BY THE CITY COUNCIL TONIGHT AT THEIR MEETING.

JESS>> AND WHAT ABOUT THOSE WHO HAVE TRADITIONALLY PROVIDED SHELTER FOR THE HOMELESS? THE SALVATION ARMY AND GROUPS SUCH AS THAT.

GAY YEE>> MANY OF THE ORGANIZATIONS DO FEEL THAT THEY ARE TAPPED OUT, THAT THEY CANNOT PROVIDE FOR THE THOUSAND PEOPLE WHO ARE IN THAT COMMUNITY. ONE OF THE POINTS THAT THE CITY MAKES IS THAT, BECAUSE THEY ARE HOSPITABLE, MANY OTHER COMMUNITIES DON’T DO THEIR FAIR SHARE AND DON’T PROVIDE FOR THE HOMELESS.

VAL>> WHO SAY GO TO SANTA MONICA. GAY YEE, THANK YOU SO MUCH. WE’LL BE LOOKING FOR AN UPDATE ON THIS ONE. WE’LL SEE WHAT SANTA MONICA DOES.

TOMORROW ON LIFE AND TIMES, POLITICIANS TALK ABOUT SAVING ENERGY AND PROTECTING THE ENVIRONMENT, BUT IN VENTURA, THEY’RE DOING SOMETHING WITH FIRE STATIONS THAT RUN ON SOLAR CELLS AND CARS THAT RUN ON ELECTRICITY.

>> EVERY TIME A CAR IS DUE TO BE REPLACED, THEN WE SHOULD REPLACE IT WITH A HYBRID UNLESS THERE’S SOME SPECIAL REASON WHY A HYBRID WOULD NOT SERVE THE PARTICULAR FUNCTION THAT THAT CAR WOULD BE USED FOR.

JESS>> ANYONE WHO SAW YESTERDAY’S BIG GUBERNATORIAL DEBATE KNOWS THERE IS NO LOVE LOST BETWEEN GRAY DAVIS AND BILL SIMON. THEY WERE JUST AS COMBATIVE IN PERSON AS THEY’VE BEEN IN THEIR COMMERCIALS. BUT HOW TRUE ARE SOME OF THE CLAIMS THEY’VE BEEN MAKING?

VAL>> WELL, TONIGHT WE’RE PUTTING A BILL SIMON COMMERCIAL TO THE TEST -- WE ALREADY DID A GRAY DAVIS COMMERCIAL -- IT SUGGESTS THAT GRAY DAVIS DID A BIG FAVOR FOR A BIG OIL COMPANY AFTER HE GOT A BIG DONATION. THAT’S TONIGHT’S “REALITY CHECK”. HERE’S CINNY KENNARD.

>> "THIS WHOLE THING STINKS..."

CINNY KENNARD>> BILL SIMON SAYS IT STINKS AND HE'S TALKING ABOUT GRAY DAVIS'S WAY OF DOING THE STATE'S BUSINESS.

>> "THE GRAY DAVIS BOARD STOPPED A BIG OIL COMPANY, TOSCO, FROM DUMPING MORE DIOXIN INTO OUR WATER..."

CINNY KENNARD>> TRUE OR FALSE? ACTUALLY, IT'S NOT THAT SIMPLE. THE BOARD'S VOTE DID HAPPEN ON DAVIS'S WATCH, BUT THREE OF THE FIVE BOARD MEMBERS WERE ORIGINALLY APPOINTED BY PETE WILSON, NOT DAVIS.

>> ..."BUT THE VERY NEXT DAY, TOSCO GAVE MORE THAN $50,000 TO DAVIS'S CAMPAIGN."

CINNY KENNARD>> TRUE. CAMPAIGN RECORDS INDICATE THAT DAVIS DID GET $55,000 FROM TOSCO THE DAY AFTER THE BOARD VOTE AND, AS THE AD CLAIMS, THE BOARD DID TAKE ACTION.

>> "THE DAVIS BOARD QUICKLY REVERSED ITSELF..."

CINNY KENNARD>> TRUE. THE BOARD DID REVERSE ITS DECISION, BUT FOUR MONTHS LATER, AND THIS TIME IT WAS THE DAVIS BOARD FILLED WITH HIS APPOINTEES AND THIS TIME THE DECISION DID FAVOR THE OIL COMPANY.

>> ..."AND ALLOWED TOSCO TO INCREASE CANCER-CAUSING DIOXIN DUMPING - 400 PERCENT."

CINNY KENNARD>> TRUE OR FALSE? WELL, THE STATE WATER BOARD CLAIMS THERE WAS NO INCREASE IN THE AMOUNT OF DIOXIN BEING DUMPED, BUT MANY CRITICS STILL CHALLENGE THAT ASSESSMENT. THE SIMON AD CLAIMS THERE WAS AN ENORMOUS BACKLASH FROM ENVIRONMENTAL GROUPS AGAINST DAVIS.

>> "ENVIRONMENTAL GROUPS ACCUSE DAVIS OF SELLING OUT HUMAN HEALTH."

CINNY KENNARD>> FACT? WELL, THE LAWYER FOR ONE ENVIRONMENTAL GROUP DID ATTACK DAVIS, BUT THE AD SUGGESTS THAT MANY ENVIRONMENTAL GROUPS HAVE COME OUT AGAINST THE DECISION.

>> "AS THE MERCURY NEWS SAYS, THIS WHOLE THING STINKS."

CINNY KENNARD>> BOTTOM LINE, THE SIMON AD IS BASICALLY TRUE, BUT WITH A FEW DISTORTIONS.

JESS>> TODAY A LAW ENFORCEMENT GROUP THAT'S SUPPORTING SIMON TRIED TO TURN UP THE HEAT ON DAVIS BY RELEASING SOME OLD PHOTOGRAPHS. THEY ALLEGEDLY SHOW DAVIS ACCEPTING A $10,000 CHECK FROM AL ANGLE, WHO WAS THEN HEAD OF C.O.P.S., THE CALIFORNIA ORGANIZATION OF POLICE AND SHERIFFS. THE GROUP CLAIMS THAT DAVIS GOT THE CHECK IN HIS STATE CAPITOL OFFICE BACK IN 1998 WHEN HE WAS LIEUTENANT GOVERNOR. THAT WOULD HAVE BEEN A VIOLATION OF THE LAW. OUR POLITICAL AD WATCHER, CINNY KENNARD, JOINS US NOW. ALSO HERE IS REPUBLICAN STRATEGIST, ALAN HOFFENBLUM. WHAT DO YOU THINK, CINNY?

CINNY KENNARD>> WELL, AS WE ALL KNOW, MODERN-DAY POLITICS IS ABSOLUTE COMBAT AND TODAY BOTH SIDES WERE IN THEIR BUNKERS THROWING CHARGES AND COUNTER-CHARGES AND IT GOT --

JESS>> -- HE SAID, HE SAID (LAUGHTER).

CINNY KENNARD>> HE SAID, HE SAID. EXACTLY. AND THE DAVIS CAMPAIGN, IN FACT, VEHEMENTLY DENIED THAT THIS PHOTOGRAPH WAS AUTHENTIC AND SUGGESTED THAT PERHAPS IT MAY HAVE BEEN FABRICATED OR IT MAY HAVE BEEN TOYED WITH IN SOME WAY. THEY DENIED THAT THE GOVERNOR WAS EVEN IN SACRAMENTO THE DAY OF THIS PHOTOGRAPH, THAT IN FACT HE WAS WITH AL GORE AT A CAMPAIGN APPEARANCE IN THE SAN FERNANDO VALLEY. IN FACT, IT GOT SO WILD BY THE END OF THE DAY THAT THE DAVIS CAMPAIGN CHALLENGED THE CAPITOL REPORTERS TO GO TO THE LIEUTENANT GOVERNOR'S OFFICE -- I THINK WE HAVE A PICTURE OF THAT. BASICALLY, THE PRESS SECRETARY OF THE CURRENT LIEUTENANT GOVERNOR IS SHOWING THE MEDIA AROUND THE LIEUTENANT GOVERNOR'S OFFICE TO SEE IF, IN FACT, THE FIRST PHOTOGRAPH OF DAVIS WAS REALLY IN THE LIEUTENANT GOVERNOR'S OFFICE.

VAL>> THIS WAS BASED ON THE BACKGROUND? WHETHER THE BACKGROUNDS MATCH?

CINNY KENNARD>> EXACTLY. EXACTLY, VAL. SO THAT'S THE COMBAT STAGE AT WHICH WE ARE AT RIGHT NOW AND --

VAL>> -- ASSUMING THERE WASN'T ANY REMODELING DONE BETWEEN 1998 AND --

CINNY KENNARD>> -- WELL, EXACTLY, AND I THINK THAT YOU HAVE TO TAKE THAT INTO CONSIDERATION. ONE LAST REMARK OF THE DAY CAME FROM THE DAVIS CAMPAIGN. GARRY SOUTH, THE GOVERNOR'S WELL-KNOWN STRATEGIST, SUGGESTED THAT MAYBE MR. SIMON OUGHT TO DO WHAT SENATOR TORRICELLI DID IN NEW JERSEY AND QUIT THE RACE. SO THAT'S WHERE WE ARE AT THE LAST MOMENT, THE LAST REPORT.

JESS>> ALAN HOFFENBLUM, IS THIS JUST POLITICS AS USUAL?

ALAN HOFFENBLUM>> WELL, LET'S TALK ABOUT WHAT C.O.P.S. SAYS, THE CALIFORNIA ORGANIZATION OF POLICE AND SHERIFFS. FIRST OF ALL, IT'S AN AFL-CIO UNION AND IT'S AN ORGANIZATION THAT, IN THE PAST, HAS BEEN STRONGLY SUPPORTIVE OF DEMOCRATS. IN FACT, AS A REPUBLICAN, --

JESS>> -- INCLUDING GRAY DAVIS.

ALAN HOFFENBLUM>> INCLUDING GRAY DAVIS. AND, BY THE WAY, IN RACES FOR THE STATE LEGISLATURE, THE MOST LIBERAL DEMOCRATS IN THE STATE LEGISLATURE HAVE OFTEN USED C.O.P.S. AS A LAW ENFORCEMENT GROUP THAT WOULD ENDORSE THEM AND SEND OUT LITERALLY THOUSANDS UPON THOUSANDS OF COMPUTER-GENERATED LETTERS ON BEHALF OF THESE CANDIDATES. SO THE GOVERNOR CANNOT CLAIM THIS TO BE SOME RIGHT-WING CONSPIRACY OR SOME RIGHT-WING GROUP THAT'S TRYING TO SMEAR HIM. IS IT THE BIG LIE? I DON'T KNOW, BUT ONE THING IT'S PROVING IS THAT THE GOVERNOR REALLY GETS IN TROUBLE WHEN HE UPSETS THESE UNIONS. THE CALIFORNIA TEACHERS ASSOCIATION, YOU KNOW, HE UPSET THEM, SO WHAT DID THE PRESIDENT, WAYNE JOHNSON, SAY? THAT HE ASKED FOR A MILLION DOLLAR CONTRIBUTION IN HIS OWN OFFICE ONE AFTERNOON.

VAL>> WELL, HOW DID GOVERNOR DAVIS UPSET THIS GROUP, C.O.P.S.?

ALAN HOFFENBLUM>> OBVIOUSLY, IT HAD TO DO WITH LEGISLATION HE DID NOT SIGN. I DON'T KNOW THE SPECIFICS, BUT THERE IS NO DOUBT THERE IS INTENSE, YOU KNOW, ENMITY BETWEEN C.O.P.S. AND THE GOVERNOR. I BELIEVE THE SIMON CAMPAIGN, TO A CERTAIN EXTENT, IS PROBABLY SAYING, WELL, LET'S TAKE ADVANTAGE OF THIS. NOW THE QUESTION IS, IF THAT WAS NOT THE LIEUTENANT GOVERNOR'S OFFICE, WHICH OFFICE WAS IT? WE HAVE A PHOTOGRAPH, WE HAVE A BACKGROUND. DOES IT EXIST SOMEPLACE IN CALIFORNIA? IF IT'S AN OFFICE NOT THE LIEUTENANT GOVERNOR, THEN THE ISSUE IS RESOLVED. THE QUESTION IS, WHOSE OFFICE WAS IT?

JESS>> THE GOVERNOR'S OFFICE HAS CLAIMED THAT IT WAS IN A CAMPAIGN OFFICE.

CINNY KENNARD>> THEY WILL TELL YOU THAT THERE WAS A MEETING THAT OCCURRED BETWEEN C.O.P.S. AND THE THEN LIEUTENANT GOVERNOR ON WILSHIRE BOULEVARD HERE IN LOS ANGELES WHERE THE CAMPAIGN OFFICE WAS AT THE TIME. OF COURSE, IT'S BEEN MOVED TO PICO BOULEVARD NOW IN LOS ANGELES. SO THEY WILL ACKNOWLEDGE A MEETING, BUT AS FAR AS DETAILS, ALAN'S RIGHT. THERE'S BEEN NO EXPLANATION AS TO WHEN THIS MEETING TOOK PLACE. THEY CAN'T REALLY REMEMBER THE DATE. THEY JUST KNOW THERE WAS A MEETING. SO THERE ARE A LOT OF QUESTIONS REMAINING AND THE FACT REMAINS THAT THIS IS A SERIOUS ALLEGATION TO MAKE AGAINST THE GOVERNOR OF CALIFORNIA.

VAL>> WELL, THAT'S WHAT I DON'T GET. WHY SHOULD VOTERS CARE WHAT OFFICE GRAY DAVIS WAS STANDING IN WHEN HE ACCEPTED THIS CHECK?

ALAN HOFFENBLUM>> ONLY IF HE VIOLATED THE LAW. HIS WHOLE CAMPAIGN AGAINST BILL SIMON HAS BEEN THAT HE'S CONSTANTLY GOING TO COURT, THAT ONE JURY ACCUSES THE BUSINESS OF FRAUDULENT BUSINESS PRACTICES. WELL, NOW SIMON COMES BACK WITH YOU MIGHT BE GUILTY OF FRAUDULENT CAMPAIGN RAISING PRACTICES.

VAL>> SO THEY CARE ONLY BECAUSE THE GOVERNOR WOULD BE VIOLATING A CLEAR AND EXPLICIT LAW THAT PREVENTS AN ELECTED OFFICIAL FROM ACCEPTING MONEY IN A PUBLIC OFFICE?

CINNY KENNARD>> EXACTLY. THERE ARE LEGALITIES HERE THAT ARE UNDER QUESTION IF, IN FACT, THIS TOOK PLACE. THE OTHER THING THAT WE NEED TO WATCH PROBABLY OVER THE NEXT COUPLE OF DAYS IS WILL THIS HAVE TRACTION? IN OTHER WORDS, WILL THE VOTERS BE SEEING THIS PHOTOGRAPH IN THE PAPER TOMORROW? AND CERTAINLY THIS HAS GOTTEN THE DESIRED EFFECT, IF THIS IS SIMON'S CAMPAIGN STRATEGY TO RAISE THIS ISSUE, TO GO WITH C.O.P.S. WE'RE TALKING ABOUT IT HERE TONIGHT. THE QUESTION IS, ARE THE VOTERS -- IS IT GOING TO BE SOMETHING THEY'RE TALKING ABOUT OR IS IT GOING TO BE ONE OF THOSE THINGS WHERE THE VOTER SAYS, GEE, SOMETHING'S WRONG THERE WITH DAVIS, IT'S MORE OF THE SAME, I DON'T KNOW EXACTLY WHAT IT IS, BUT I DON'T LIKE IT. SO WE'LL SEE AN OVERNIGHT POLLING THAT THE CAMPAIGN DOES, WHETHER OR NOT IT IS HAVING ANY TRACTION.

JESS>> CONVENTIONAL WISDOM IS THAT THE GOVERNOR IS VERY VULNERABLE BECAUSE OF HIS PRODIGIOUS FUNDRAISING.

CINNY KENNARD>> THERE IS NO QUESTION THAT I THINK THE DAVIS CAMPAIGN WILL ACKNOWLEDGE THAT THEY ARE VULNERABLE ON THIS ISSUE. IN FACT, IT'S BEEN SHOWN IN THEIR OWN POLLING THAT THEY'RE VULNERABLE.

ALAN HOFFENBLUM>> JESS, THE MAN HAS RAISED SO MUCH MONEY OVER THE YEARS FOR THIS GOVERNOR'S RACE, $60 MILLION DOLLARS --

JESS>> -- FIVE TIMES AS MUCH AS HIS OPPONENT.

ALAN HOFFENBLUM>> I WOULDN'T BE A BIT SURPRISED IF HE DOESN'T HAVE THE FOGGIEST IDEA OF MEETING THE GUY, WHEN HE GOT THE CHECK OR WHERE IT MIGHT HAVE BEEN UNLESS, IN FACT, IT WAS IN THE LIEUTENANT GOVERNOR'S OFFICE. LOOK AT THE PHOTO. HE KNOWS WHETHER OR NOT IT WAS IN THE LIEUTENANT GOVERNOR'S OFFICE. BUT THE IMPACT, I THINK, IT'S GOING TO HAVE ON THE RACE? IT'S JUST GOING TO DISILLUSION MORE VOTERS. WE HAVE TWO CANDIDATES RUNNING FOR GOVERNOR, BASED ON ALL OF THE POLLS THAT HAVE BEEN PUBLISHED, THAT ARE UNPOPULAR. THE MAJORITY OF THE VOTERS SAY THEY WOULD PREFER SOMEONE OTHER THAN THE CHOICES THEY NOW HAVE. I THINK WHAT THE SIMON CAMPAIGN MAY BE HOPING IS THAT SOMETHING SUCH AS THIS MIGHT DEPRESS VOTER TURNOUT EVEN MORE. KEEP MORE DEMOCRATS AT HOME, SO MAYBE THE TRUE BLUE REPUBLICANS CAN OUTVOTE THE DEMOCRATS, AND HE HAS AN OUTSIDE CHANCE OF WINNING THIS.

VAL>> NOW THE SIMON AD WE JUST SAW IS ACTUALLY NOT AS TERRIBLY DISTORTING AS SOME PREVIOUS ADS, BUT MIGHT SIMON USE THIS PHOTOGRAPH IN HIS NEXT AD?

CINNY KENNARD>> I'M GLAD YOU RAISED THAT. THE DAVIS CAMPAIGN HAS $24 MILLION DOLLARS LEFT, REPORTED THIS WEEK, WHILE THE SIMON CAMPAIGN HAS MORE $4 MILLION. THE BIG QUESTION THAT COMES IS HOW FAST DO WE SEE THIS ISSUE FROM EITHER SIDE TURNED INTO A TELEVISION AD SO THAT, THAT WAY, THEY CAN GET THE MESSAGE OUT TO THE VOTER? GOOD POINT, VAL.

VAL>> CINNY KENNARD AND ALAN HOFFENBLUM, REPUBLICAN ANALYST, THANK YOU SO MUCH. ALWAYS GREAT TO HAVE YOU GUYS ON.

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JESS>> NO MORE ROTTING MEAT AND SPOILED BANANAS. THAT IS, IF THE COURTS GO ALONG WITH PRESIDENT BUSH'S BID TO STOP THE WEST COAST PORT SHUTDOWN. TODAY THE PRESIDENT INVOKED THE TAFT-HARTLEY ACT. IT WOULD FORCE LONGSHOREMEN BACK TO WORK AND ESTABLISH AN EIGHTY-DAY COOLING OFF PERIOD. THE WHITE HOUSE SAYS THE SHUTDOWN IS ENDANGERING NATIONAL SECURITY.

GEORGE BUSH>> THIS DISPUTE BETWEEN MANAGEMENT AND LABOR CANNOT BE ALLOWED TO FURTHER HARM THE ECONOMY AND FORCE THOUSANDS OF WORKING AMERICANS FROM THEIR JOBS.

VAL>> AND JOINING US NOW IS WALLY BAKER. HE IS A CONSULTANT TO THE PORTS OF LOS ANGELES AND LONG BEACH AND ALSO VICE PRESIDENT OF L.A.'S ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT CORPORATION. WELCOME TO LIFE AND TIMES.

WALLY BAKER>> THANKS.

JESS>> ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT HAS A REAL SHARE IN THIS ISSUE, DON'T THEY?

WALLY BAKER>> IT REALLY DOES. THE FIRST WEEK OF THIS WORK STOPPAGE, WE SAW ABOUT A $1.8 BILLION DOLLAR IMPACT JUST IN CALIFORNIA, SO THESE ARE BIG NUMBERS. THESE TWO PORTS ARE DOING ABOUT $196 BILLION DOLLARS A YEAR THROUGH THESE TWO PORTS.

VAL>> THAT'S JUST THESE TWO. THAT'S NOT THE WHOLE WEST COAST?

WALLY BAKER>> THAT'S NOT THE WEST COAST. WE HAVE SEEN THIS. WE DID A STUDY. IT'S CALLED THE ONTRACK TRADE IMPACT STUDY AND IT LOOKS AT THE DESTINATION OF EVERY PIECE OF CARGO THAT WENT THROUGH LOS ANGELES AND LONG BEACH IN THE YEAR 2000.

JESS>> SO WE'RE NOT JUST TALKING CALIFORNIA AND THE WEST?

WALLY BAKER>> NO. ALL THE WAY TO MAINE. I MEAN, LITERALLY, EVERY STATE. AND, OF COURSE, WE SORTED THIS BY U.S. CONGRESSIONAL DISTRICT TO HELP MAKE THE CASE FOR WHY WE SHOULD BE INVESTING IN THESE CORRIDORS, AND WE SEE IT IN EVERY SINGLE CONGRESSIONAL DISTRICT. WE HAVE THE NAMES OF THE COMPANIES, THE DOLLAR AMOUNTS EACH ONE OF THEM DID, SO THAT WHEN WE SIT DOWN WITH MEMBERS, WE CAN EXPLAIN TO THEM SPECIFICALLY HERE'S WHAT'S GOING ON IN YOUR DISTRICT. I MEAN, EVEN INDIANA, $2.6 BILLION A YEAR. THAT'S BIG.

VAL>> COMING THROUGH LOS ANGELES OR LONG BEACH.

WALLY BAKER>> ABSOLUTELY. NEW YORK IS $16 BILLION DOLLARS A YEAR AND THEY DON'T GO THROUGH THE PORT OF NEW YORK. THEY'RE GOING THROUGH US AND THAT'S BECAUSE WE CONSUME HALF OF EVERYTHING THAT COMES IN THE PORT. SO NATURALLY IT MAKES SENSE, IF YOU WANT TO SEND SOMETHING TO NEW MEXICO OR ILLINOIS, YOU SEND IT TO LOS ANGELES-LONG BEACH. BECAUSE SO MUCH IS ALREADY COMING HERE, WHY NOT JUST SEND THE OTHER STUFF ON ITS WAY?

VAL>> DESPITE THE ECONOMIC IMPACT, THAT IS NOT THE REASONING THAT BUSH EVOKED WHEN HE CALLED FOR TAFT-HARTLEY. HE SAID IT'S A MATTER OF NATIONAL SECURITY, WHICH IS, WHAT, A VERY POWERFUL ARGUMENT? WOULD YOU AGREE WITH THAT?

WALLY BAKER>> YEAH, I WOULD AGREE WITH THAT. I WOULD SAY THAT WE HAVE BEEN -- WE'RE RIGHT NOW STARTING A STUDY WITH THE RAND CORPORATION ON HOMELAND SECURITY AS IT RELATES TO RAIL CORRIDORS, SO WE SEE THIS. THE MILITARY IS SENDING THINGS THROUGH, BUT MOST IMPORTANTLY, I THINK WE REALIZE HOW VITAL THIS CHAIN IS, THAT ONE PART OF THE LINK BEING WEAK OR STOPPED IMPACTS THE REST. I MEAN, IT LITERALLY IMPACTS MAINE WHEN THIS HAPPENS OUT HERE.

JESS>> AND YOUR INTEREST IN CHECKING TO SEE HOW IT IMPACTS OTHER STATES AND THE OTHER CONGRESSIONAL DISTRICTS IS BECAUSE YOU'D LIKE TO SEE FEDERAL AID TO PRODUCE MORE TRACKAGE?

WALLY BAKER>> RIGHT, AND TO REALLY TAKE CARE OF COMMUNITIES WHO ARE GOING TO BE IMPACTED AS WE CONTINUE TO GROW THE SYSTEM. WE REALLY SEE THIS AS BEING ABOUT THIRTY-SIX MILLION CONTAINERS, ABOUT TRIPLE WHAT WE'RE SEEING NOW --

JESS>> -- GOING THROUGH YOUR NEAREST NEIGHBORHOOD.

WALLY BAKER>> THAT'S RIGHT, AND WE FEEL LIKE IF WE DON'T START WORKING ON THIS NOW, WE WILL END UP WITH "NOT IN OUR BACKYARD" IN COMMUNITIES THROUGHOUT SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA, WHICH WILL HAVE A NEGATIVE IMPACT ON THE COUNTRY'S GNP. SO WE'RE TRYING TO BUILD A CASE TO HELP FUND GRADE CROSSINGS AND RAIL LOWERINGS AND PROJECTS THAT REALLY MITIGATE ALL OF THESE TRAINS THAT WE CAN --

JESS>> -- SO YOU LIKE SOMETHING UNDER STREET LEVEL?

WALLY BAKER>> WELL, THERE ARE A COUPLE OF PROJECTS LIKE THAT. THEY HAVE TO BE JUST RIGHT TO MAKE SENSE FINANCIALLY, BUT WE DEFINITELY WANT GRADE CROSSINGS. WE DON'T WANT PEOPLE WAITING ON A HUNDRED OR HUNDRED FIFTY TRAINS A DAY. YOU'LL SPEND YOUR WHOLE DAY WAITING ON TRAINS.

JESS>> HASN'T BEEN A PROBLEM THE LAST SIX OR SEVEN DAYS (LAUGHTER).

WALLY BAKER>> (LAUGHTER) THAT'S RIGHT. THAT HAS DEFINITELY BEEN AN ISSUE AND THE 710 FREEWAY HAS NOT HAD AS MANY TRUCKS ON IT EITHER.

VAL>> THAT'S VERY TRUE. NOW IF THE TAFT-HARTLEY ARGUMENT HOLDS AND THE JUDGE IS GOING TO CONSIDER THAT NEXT WEEK, BUT IN THE MEANTIME, THERE'S A TEMPORARY RESTRAINING ORDER AND DOCKWORKERS COULD BE BACK ON THE JOB AS EARLY AS TOMORROW EVENING. BUT HOW LONG WILL IT TAKE TO CLEAR UP THE BACKLOG AND THE MESS? I HEAR THERE'S, WHAT, MORE THAN A HUNDRED SHIPS WAITING OFFSHORE?

WALLY BAKER>> YEAH, SOMEBODY SAID IS THERE LIKE A LIGHT SHOW GOING ON? AT NIGHT YOU CAN SEE THIS LONG STRING OF LIGHTS GOING OUT IN THE OCEAN. WE'RE SEEING AND WE'RE HEARING IT'S ABOUT THIRTY DAYS AND THAT'S IF WE'RE AT ONE HUNDRED PERCENT PRODUCTIVITY. YOU HAVE TO REMEMBER THERE'S JUST SO MUCH EQUIPMENT, SO MANY PEOPLE. THEY CAN WORK OVERTIME AND SWING SHIFTS AND, YOU KNOW, INCREASE THE FREQUENCY, BUT IT'S STILL GOING TO TAKE THEM THIRTY DAYS.

JESS>> IT'S NOT JUST AT THE DOCKS. THE RAILROADS HAVE ALL BEGUN STORING ALL THOSE FLAT CARS WITH ALL THE CONTAINERS ALL OVER THE WEST.

WALLY BAKER>> ABSOLUTELY, AND GETTING ALL OF THAT ROLLING AGAIN WILL TAKE AT LEAST THIRTY DAYS IN WHAT WE'RE SEEING.

VAL>> SO AN EIGHTY-DAY COOLING OFF PERIOD SOUNDS LIKE A LOT, BUT IN TERMS OF CLEARING OUT THE BACKLOG AND GETTING THINGS BACK TO NORMAL, IT'S NOT ALL THAT LONG?

WALLY BAKER>> IT IS REALLY NOT THAT LONG. IT IS NOT THAT LONG. THIS IS A REALLY BIG SPRING THAT YOU WIND UP AND, WHEN YOU LET IT UNWIND WHICH IS WHAT WE'VE DONE, IT CAN TAKE A WHILE TO BRING IT BACK.

VAL>> BUT IT'S NOT GOOD NEWS FOR THE UNION?

WALLY BAKER>> WELL, I DON'T KNOW. I DON'T THINK IT'S GOOD NEWS FOR THEM. THEY HAVE BEEN EXTREMELY SUCCESSFUL. I MEAN, THEY HAVE GOTTEN THEIR MEMBERS TREMENDOUS SALARIES, TREMENDOUS BENEFITS. SO OVER THE TIME, I THINK THEY'VE BEEN VERY SUCCESSFUL AND, IF ANYTHING, I THINK THEY KIND OF SUFFER FROM THAT SUCCESS BECAUSE IT'S HARD FOR THEM TO REALLY SHOW DRAMATIC CHANGE BECAUSE THEY'VE DONE SO WELL.

JESS>> THEY MAY ALSO PROVE TO BE THE GRINCH THAT STOLE CHRISTMAS, THOUGH.

WALLY BAKER>> WELL, THEY WERE GETTING CLOSE TO STEALING HALLOWEEN AND MAYBE SOME PEOPLE ARE STILL GOING TO HAVE TO MAKE UP THEIR OWN COSTUMES THIS YEAR --

VAL>> -- OH, WE'LL HAVE TO GET CREATIVE (LAUGHTER).

WALLY BAKER>> (LAUGHTER) BUT CHRISTMAS IS DEFINITELY THE TIME OF YEAR THAT WE'RE IN AND THIS IS ONE OF THE THINGS THAT EVERYONE'S HOPING THAT WE CAN GET THROUGH THIS TIME FRAME AND GET AT CHRISTMAS.

JESS>> BUT NATIONAL SECURITY, WHICH THE PRESIDENT INVOKES, IS THAT VALID?

WALLY BAKER>> I THINK IT IS, I THINK IT IS. WHAT WE HAVE SEEN WITH THE RAILS SIDE OF THIS IS A CONSOLIDATION. AGAIN, THERE ARE SO MANY PEOPLE HERE. THERE ARE NOT AS MANY ROUTES BACK EAST AS THERE USED TO BE. SO THE CHOICES ARE BECOMING LIMITED AND THE MILITARY ABSOLUTELY DEPENDS ON THESE PORTS AS PART OF THEIR MOVEMENT OF GOODS AND SUPPLYING THEMSELVES WITH PRODUCTS. IT'S VERY IMPORTANT.

VAL>> NOW I UNDERSTAND THE AVERAGE WAGE FOR SOME OF THESE LONGSHOREMEN IS LIKE $100,000, SO IT'S --

WALLY BAKER>> -- IT'S A GOOD JOB (LAUGHTER).

VAL>> (LAUGHTER) IT'S A VERY GOOD JOB, AND WHEN NATIONAL SECURITY IS AT STAKE, THOSE TWO THINGS COMBINED DO NOT EXACTLY ENGENDER PUBLIC SYMPATHY.

WALLY BAKER>> YEAH, I THINK THAT WILL BE THEIR CHALLENGE, TO OVERCOME THAT PERSPECTIVE.

JESS>> WE'LL SEE. WALLY BAKER OF THE LOS ANGELES ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT CORPORATION, THANK YOU FOR BEING WITH US.

WALLY BAKER>> THANKS.

VAL>> THANK YOU. THAT IS OUR PROGRAM FOR THIS EVENING. YOU CAN KEEP TRACK OF THE NEWS AND GET UPDATES ON FUTURE STORIES BY LOGGING ONTO OUR WEBSITE AT KCET.ORG.

JESS>> THANKS FOR SPENDING SOME TIME WITH US. NOW FOR ALL OF US HERE AT LIFE AND TIMES, HAVE A GREAT EVENING.

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