4/4/03

LC030404

VAL ZAVALA>> TONIGHT ON LIFE AND TIMES --

JESS MARLOW>> THE GOVERNOR WANTS A BIGGER SHARE OF NATIVE-AMERICANS’ CASINO MONEY, BUT THEY SAY THEY’VE GOT GOOD REASON TO HOLD ON TO EVERY NICKEL THEY CAN.

BUTCH MURPHY>> I’VE SEEN IT, YOU KNOW. I’VE SEEN IT AS A TRIBAL COUNCIL PERSON. I SEE SMILES ON PEOPLES’ FACES NOW AND YOU SEE THEM DRIVING NICER CARS AND WEARING NICER CLOTHES. IT’S GREAT.

VAL>> AND THEN, STILL SEXY AFTER SIXTY. WE’LL LOOK AT SOME CLASSIC FILM NOIR MOVIES AND PREVIEW A FESTIVAL THAT CELEBRATES THE GRITTY CRIME FILMS FROM THE THIRTIES AND FORTIES.

JESS>> PLUS, CUTTING COSTS BY TOSSING INMATES OUT OF COUNTY JAIL. SHERIFF LEE BACA TALKS ABOUT HIS DILEMMA.

VAL>> IT’S ALL STRAIGHT AHEAD ON TONIGHT’S LIFE AND TIMES.

LIFE AND TIMES IS MADE POSSIBLE BY THE FOLLOWING FOUNDATIONS:

THE L.K. WHITTIER FOUNDATION
DEDICATED TO IMPROVING THE QUALITY OF LIFE BY SUPPORTING INNOVATIVE ENDEAVORS IN THE FIELDS OF MEDICINE, HEALTH, SCIENCE AND EDUCATION.

AND THE CALIFORNIA ENDOWMENT
THE STATE'S LARGEST HEALTH FOUNDATION SUPPORTING ORGANIZATIONS THAT DIRECTLY IMPROVE THE HEALTH AND WELL-BEING OF CALIFORNIA'S DIVERSE COMMUNITIES. THE CALIFORNIA ENDOWMENT, A PARTNER FOR HEALTHIER COMMUNITIES.

VAL>> SHOW ME THE MONEY. THAT’S WHAT GRAY DAVIS IS SAYING TO CALIFORNIA’S NATIVE-AMERICAN TRIBES.

JESS>> HE WANTS A BIGGER SHARE OF THEIR GAMBLING DOLLARS TO HELP CURB THE DEFICIT AND WE’RE TALKING BIG MONEY. THE STATE’S TRIBAL CASINOS GENERATE ABOUT FIVE BILLION DOLLARS A YEAR. TONIGHT A LOOK AT HOW SOME OF THAT CASH HAS TRANSFORMED ONE LOCAL TRIBE, THE PECHANGAS OF RIVERSIDE COUNTY. AS PHILIP BRUCE REPORTS, A NEW CASINO HAS TURNED THEIR POVERTY-STRICKEN RESERVATION INTO A COMMUNITY OF MILLIONAIRES.

[FILM CLIP]

PHILIP BRUCE>> FOR THE PECHANGA INDIAN TRIBE, THIS IS THE SOUND OF MONEY. EVER SINCE THEIR NEW CASINO OPENED LAST SUMMER NEAR TEMECULA, IT’S HAD NO TROUBLE DRAWING CUSTOMERS. THE CASINO ALSO INCLUDES A CONVENTION CENTER, A THEATER AND A THIRTEEN-STORY FIVE HUNDRED-ROOM HOTEL.

PATRICK MURPHY>> THIS PROJECT HAS BEEN VERY SUCCESSFUL. IT HASN’T STOPPED SINCE DAY ONE. OUR MARKET IS PRIMARILY FROM LOS ANGELES AND ORANGE COUNTY AND WE’VE REACHED DOWN INTO SAN DIEGO COUNTY. IT’S BEEN TREMENDOUS.

PHILIP BRUCE>> THE CASINO IS OWNED AND OPERATED ENTIRELY BY MEMBERS OF THE PECHANGA TRIBE AND, UNLIKE SOME OTHER INDIAN CASINOS IN CALIFORNIA, THERE ARE NO OUTSIDE PARTNERS INVOLVED. IN SHORT, NO WHITE MEN TO SIPHON OFF PART OF THE TRIBE’S RICHES.

BUTCH MURPHY>> WE DON’T ANSWER TO ANY OUTSIDE ENTITY. I THINK IT’S REALLY GRATIFYING FOR THE TRIBE. WE DON’T ANSWER TO THEM EITHER THROUGH POLICY OR THROUGH MONETARY COMPENSATION.

PHILIP BRUCE>> TRIBAL COUNCIL MEMBER, BUTCH MURPHY, HAS WATCHED THE PECHANGAS’ FORTUNES IMPROVE GOING BACK TO THE MID-1990’S WHEN THEY FIRST GOT INTO THE GAMING BUSINESS. THAT’S WHEN THE TRIBE BROUGHT IN EIGHT TRAILERS AND SET UP ITS FIRST CASINO. BEFORE LONG, THEY WERE SUCCESSFULLY RUNNING SEVERAL OTHER BUSINESSES, INCLUDING A GASOLINE STATION AND AN RV PARK. IT’S A FAR DIFFERENT WORLD FROM THE ONE MURPHY REMEMBERS WHEN HE WAS GROWING UP ON THE RESERVATION. BACK THEN, HIS WAS ONE OF ONLY FIVE OR SIX FAMILIES STILL LIVING HERE.

BUTCH MURPHY>> THERE WERE A LOT OF OPEN SPACES, YOU KNOW, TO RUN AROUND IN AS I RECALL AND, ONCE IN A WHILE, YOU’D SEE SOMEBODY THAT WAS OUT OF PLACE, IF YOU WILL, THAT WASN’T AROUND ALL THE TIME. I CAN REMEMBER SCRAMBLING BACK TO THE HOUSE BECAUSE WE WERE SO EXCITED, I SUPPOSE, AS WELL AS SCARED OF THIS NEW PERSON THAT SHOWED UP.

PHILIP BRUCE>> WHEN HE FINISHED HIGH SCHOOL, MURPHY LEFT THE RESERVATION FOR COLLEGE AND EVENTUALLY BECAME A TEACHER.

BUTCH MURPHY>> I GREW UP FOR EIGHTEEN YEARS IN A HOME THAT HAD NO ELECTRICITY AND NO RUNNING WATER. I HAVE TOLD THAT STORY TO A LOT OF STUDENTS THAT HAVE BEEN IN THE CLASSES THAT I’VE TAUGHT. IT REALLY DRAWS A BLANK LOOK. I CAN RECALL ONE TIME, ONE INSTANCE, IN EXPLAINING THAT TO ONE OF MY STUDENTS. HE LOOKED UP AT ME AND, IN ALL SERIOUSNESS, SAID, “BUT, MR. MURPHY, HOW DO YOU WATCH TV?”

PHILIP BRUCE>> TODAY, WITH THE DEVELOPMENT OF THE TEMECULA VALLEY AND THE CASINO ITSELF, THERE ARE UPWARDS OF FIVE HUNDRED TRIBAL MEMBERS LIVING ON THE RESERVATION AND IT’S PROBABLY SAFE TO SAY THAT ALL OF THEM HAVE ELECTRICITY, RUNNING WATER AND AT LEAST ONE TV.

BUTCH MURPHY>> WE HAVE ABSOLUTELY NOT ONE SINGLE TRIBAL MEMBER ON WELFARE. IT’S NO SMALL SECRET, I THINK, THAT PEOPLES’ LIVES HAVE DEFINITELY BEEN CHANGED. CERTAINLY, I’VE SEEN IT. YOU KNOW, AS A TRIBAL COUNCIL PERSON, YOU SEE SMILES ON PEOPLES’ FACES NOW AND YOU SEE THEM DRIVING NICER CARS AND WEARING NICER CLOTHES. IT’S GREAT.

PHILIP BRUCE>> THE NEW-FOUND WEALTH HAS ALSO LET THE TRIBAL GOVERNMENT DEVELOP PROGRAMS AND FACILITIES ON THE RESERVATION. THERE’S A LARGE NEW GOVERNMENT CENTER ALONG WITH A FIRE STATION AND A LARGE PARK WITH TENNIS, BASKETBALL AND HANDBALL COURTS, AS WELL AS A SOFTBALL FIELD. THERE’S ALSO A NEW HEALTH PROGRAM, ALONG WITH A SENIOR CITIZENS CENTER AND AN EDUCATIONAL CENTER. PLUS THERE ARE CULTURAL AND LANGUAGE PRESERVATION EFFORTS. THE LIST GOES ON AND THE BENEFITS HAVE GONE TO MORE THAN JUST TRIBAL MEMBERS. BUT WHEN THE CASINO WAS FIRST PLANNED, MANY IN TEMECULA WERE WARY.

JEFF STONE>> WE HAD SOME STRONG CONCERNS. WE WERE BASICALLY SCARED, BUT WE WERE ALSO IGNORANT OF SOME OF THE BENEFITS THAT THE PECHANGA CASINO WOULD ULTIMATELY BRING TO THE CITIZENS. SO IT WAS A POLITICAL ROLLER COASTER, BASICALLY, UNTIL THEY GOT BUILT AND THAT’S WHEN THE RELATIONSHIP REALLY STARTED TO IMPROVE BETWEEN THE PECHANGAS AND THE CITY OF TEMECULA.

PHILIP BRUCE>> NOW TEMECULA OFFICIALS KNOW THAT VISITORS TO THE CASINO ARE LIKELY TO SPEND MONEY IN THE CITY AS WELL.

JEFF STONE>> THAT DERIVES MILLIONS OF DOLLARS A YEAR IN POTENTIAL REVENUE FOR THE CITY. BUT IN ADDITION TO THAT, THE PECHANGA TRIBE HAS BEEN VERY CAREFUL TO TRY TO SPEND WHATEVER MONEY THEY CAN LOCALLY HERE, TO OUR LOCAL VENDORS.

PHILIP BRUCE>> THEN THERE ARE THE JOBS. THE TRIBE HAS 2,600 EMPLOYEES AND A GOOD NINETY-FIVE PERCENT OF THEM AREN’T TRIBAL MEMBERS. SO FAR, IT’S BEEN A HUGE BOOST TO THE SURROUNDING COMMUNITY.

BUTCH MURPHY>> FOR EXAMPLE, OUR LOCAL HIGH SCHOOLS, FIVE HIGH SCHOOLS, IN FACT, FROM LAKE ELSINORE TO THE TEMECULA VALLEY GET AN UPWARDS OF $100,000 A YEAR FROM US AND HAVE FOR THE LAST THREE YEARS.

PHILIP BRUCE>> BUT AS INDIAN GAMING HAS GROWN, THE BUSINESS HAS DRAWN CRITICS. THERE’S NO DENYING THAT GAMING INTERESTS HAVE HIRED POWERFUL LOBBYISTS AT THE STATE AND NATIONAL LEVELS AND THE TRIBES ARE MAJOR DONORS TO POLITICAL CAMPAIGNS. BUT MURPHY WONDERS WHY ANYONE THINKS THERE’S SOMETHING WRONG WITH ALL OF THIS.

BUTCH MURPHY>> I DON’T THINK THAT THERE SHOULD BE ANYTHING WRONG WITH INDIANS MAKING MONEY. THERE SHOULDN’T BE ANYTHING WRONG WITH INDIANS HAVING LOBBYISTS IN WASHINGTON, D.C. OR, IN OUR CASE, IN SACRAMENTO. THERE SHOULDN’T BE ANYTHING WRONG WITH INDIANS GETTING INVOLVED IN THE POLITICAL SYSTEM OF THIS COUNTRY AND, IF THERE IS, WHY?

PHILIP BRUCE>> MURPHY CLAIMS INDIAN GAMING IS ABOUT MORE THAN JUST MONEY AND POWER.

BUTCH MURPHY>> IT ISN’T JUST ABOUT MAKING A BUCK. IT’S ABOUT BEING ABLE TO DIVERSIFY. IT’S ABOUT BEING ABLE TO BUY BACK TRIBAL LANDS THAT WERE TAKEN FROM US. I MEAN, FOR LACK OF A BETTER TERM, THEY WERE STOLEN, AND NOW WE’RE IN A POSITION TO BE ABLE TO BUY THOSE PROPERTIES BACK RIGHT HERE IN THIS VALLEY, AND GOOD FOR US FOR DOING THAT.

PHILIP BRUCE>> ONE PROPERTY THE PECHANGAS HAVE RECENTLY PURCHASED IS A RANCH LYING JUST OUTSIDE THE RESERVATION. THERE STANDS WHAT’S BELIEVED TO BE THE WORLD’S OLDEST CALIFORNIA LIVE OAK TREE. FOR MURPHY, THIS IS MORE THE ISSUE. PRESERVING THE PAST AND PLANNING FOR THE LIVES OF THE GENERATIONS TO COME.

BUTCH MURPHY>> YOU KNOW, I’VE GOT FOUR BOYS WHOSE LIVES ARE GOING TO BE DIFFERENT THAN WHAT MINE WAS, AND I’VE GOT GRANDCHILDREN WHOSE LIVES ARE GOING TO BE DIFFERENT. SO THE GENERATIONS TO COME ARE THE ONES WHO ARE GOING TO BENEFIT FROM THE EFFORTS THAT WE’RE PUTTING FORTH.

JESS>> IRONICALLY, SOME OF THE PEOPLE WHO WORK FOR NATIVE-AMERICAN CASINOS CLAIM THEY’RE BEING EXPLOITED AND PAID POVERTY WAGES. THIS WEEK AT A STATE HEARING IN SACRAMENTO, THE WORKERS CLAIMED THE CASINOS PROVIDE LITTLE OR NO HEALTH INSURANCE AND THEY ACCUSE TRIBAL LEADERS OF SABOTAGING THEIR EFFORTS TO UNIONIZE. NATIVE-AMERICAN LEADERS DENIED THE ALLEGATIONS AND SAID UNION ORGANIZERS WERE BEHIND MUCH OF THE UNREST.

VAL>> MONDAY ON LIFE AND TIMES, THE BIGGEST CULPRITS BEHIND SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA’S AIR POLLUTION, AND IT’S NOT SUVS.

>> WE TOOK FIFTY YEARS TO LEARN ABOUT HOW HARMFUL CIGARETTE SMOKING IS. IS IT GOING TO BE ANOTHER FIFTY YEARS FOR US TO REALIZE THAT TEN COMMON CHEMICALS ARE NOW DOING ABOUT AN EQUAL AMOUNT OF HARM?

JESS>> HE RUNS THE BIGGEST COUNTY JAIL IN AMERICA, BUT SHERIFF LEE BACA HAS HUNG UP THE NO VACANCY SIGN. HE’S GONE A STEP FURTHER BY RELEASING CERTAIN NONVIOLENT INMATES TO SAVE MONEY. THE SHERIFF SAYS HE HAS NO CHOICE, GIVEN THE DOWNSIZED BUDGET HE’S FORCED TO WORK WITH, BUT LEE BACA’S CRITICS SAY HE’S SENDING THE WRONG MESSAGE AND POSSIBLY PUTTING THE PUBLIC AT RISK.

VAL>> AND HE JOINS US NOW TO TALK ABOUT THE BUDGET CRISIS AND OTHER MATTERS. SHERIFF LEE BACA, WELCOME.

LEE BACA>> THANK YOU.

JESS>> HOW MANY PRISONERS ARE YOU GOING TO HAVE TO RELEASE?

LEE BACA>> WE WILL EARLY RELEASE -- THAT MEANS PRISONERS HAVE SERVED FIFTY PERCENT OF THEIR SENTENCE -- WE WILL EARLY RELEASE AS MANY AS 2,600 OR 2,700 INMATES.

VAL>> AND HOW MUCH MONEY DO YOU THINK THAT WILL SAVE?

LEE BACA>> IT WILL SAVE US APPROXIMATELY $17 MILLION DOLLARS.

VAL>> $17 MILLION, AND YOU STILL HAVE TO CUT HOW MUCH MORE?

LEE BACA>> WE HAVE TO TOTALLY CUT $75 MILLION DOLLARS IN THE UPCOMING BUDGET.

VAL>> SO THIS WILL NOT SOLVE ALL YOUR BUDGET PROBLEMS? IT WILL JUST SOLVE PART OF THEM?

LEE BACA>> IT WILL ALSO NOT SOLVE THE CURRENT CUTS WHICH TOTAL ABOUT $84 MILLION DOLLARS, SO WE’RE LOOKING AT ABOUT $159 MILLION DOLLAR TOTAL CUT ROLLING OVER FROM ONE YEAR TO THE NEXT.

JESS>> MOST OF THE CRITICS ARE REALLY CONCERNED ABOUT WHAT IT MEANS IN TERMS OF RELEASING INMATES EARLY. DOES IT SUGGEST WE’RE GOING SOFT ON CRIME, AS SOME HAVE FEARED?

LEE BACA>> WELL, I DON’T BELIEVE WE’RE GOING SOFT ON CRIME. WE’RE NOT DOING WHAT I THINK IS THE RIGHT THING TO DO AND THAT IS TO FUND THE COUNTY JAIL SYSTEM PROPERLY.

JESS>> YOU’D LIKE TO KEEP THEM IN JAIL.

LEE BACA>> ABSOLUTELY, SO THIS IS SOMETHING WE’RE DOING PURELY BECAUSE OF THE BUDGET PROBLEMS THE STATE AND THE COUNTY ARE FACING.

VAL>> I WAS GOING TO ASK YOU, IS THIS A PRODUCT OF THE STATE DEFICIT?

LEE BACA>> IT’S A COMBINATION. WE ARE INTERDEPENDENT IN THIS STATE BECAUSE OF WHAT WE’VE ENCOURAGED AS VOTERS IN VARIOUS PROPOSITIONS AND WE HAVE BASICALLY RELIED ON THE STATE FOR A LOT OF OUR FUNDS. THE SHERIFF DEPARTMENT’S FUNDING, FOR EXAMPLE, $996 MILLION, ARE FROM OUTSIDE THE COUNTY SOURCES, SO APPROXIMATELY $660 MILLION DOLLARS ARE COUNTY-GENERATED DOLLARS, AND THAT’S WHERE THIS CUTTING IS GOING ON NOW.

JESS>> THIS IS NOT THE FIRST TIME YOU’VE BUTTED HEADS WITH THE SUPERVISORS OVER YOUR BUDGET, BUT IT’S REALLY SERIOUS THIS TIME, ISN’T IT?

LEE BACA>> WELL, IT WAS SERIOUS LAST TIME, IT’S SERIOUS NOW AND IT’S SERIOUS IN THE FUTURE. THIS IS WHY I’M WORKING WITH A NUMBER OF LEGISLATORS TO WORK ON HOW CAN WE INCREASE REVENUES, WHETHER IT’S THROUGH PERSONAL INCOME TAX, SALES TAX OR OTHERWISE.

JESS>> MIKE ANTONOVICH HAS BEEN PARTICULARLY CRITICAL OF YOUR CHOICE OF A WAY TO REDUCE THE BUDGET IS BY RELEASING PRISONERS. BUT SOME PEOPLE WOULD SUSPECT YOU’RE PLAYING CHICKEN WITH THE SUPERVISORS.

LEE BACA>> NOT AT ALL. I THINK LAST YEAR A THOUSAND PEOPLE WENT TO THE BOARD OFFICES TO DECRY THE CUTS OF FIFTEEN PROGRAMS OF THE SHERIFF’S DEPARTMENT. IT WAS A RATHER ACRIMONIOUS TIME AND I THINK WE’VE PATCHED UP ALL THAT SINCE THEN. I’M AT THE POINT NOW WHERE I SEND MESSAGES AND LETTERS AND EXPLANATIONS TO EACH BOARD MEMBER AND TALK TO THEM AND SAY, HERE, THIS IS WHAT WE’RE DOING. OUR CHIEF ADMINISTRATIVE OFFICER TOTALLY UNDERSTANDS IT. SUPERVISOR ANTONOVICH AND I ARE GOOD FRIENDS, SO I UNDERSTAND HIS FRUSTRATION BECAUSE HE IS MY STAUNCHEST SUPPORTER IN MANY RESPECTS. SO IT ISN’T PERSONAL. WE’RE JUST TRYING TO DO THE BEST WE CAN, GIVEN THE LIMITED DOLLARS THAT WE HAVE.

VAL>> SO IF WE HAVE TO RELEASE UP TO 2,600 INMATES, THE QUESTION IS HOW ARE THEY GOING TO BE SELECTED? HOW CAN YOU BE SURE THAT YOU ARE NOT RELEASING PEOPLE WHO ARE GOING TO BE A DANGER TO THE PUBLIC?

LEE BACA>> YES. IN CONTRAST TO THE PAST WHEN PRIOR SHERIFFS HAVE HAD TO DO THIS, I CREATED A COMMUNITY TRANSITION UNIT AND I HAVE AN EVALUATION TEAM THAT ARE LOOKING AT THE HISTORIES OF ALL THE INMATES. I’M PUTTING TOGETHER AN OVERSIGHT PANEL OF PEOPLE, LIKE PEOPLE FROM “MOTHERS AGAINST DRUNK DRIVERS”, DOMESTIC VIOLENCE ADVOCACY GROUPS, AND THE DISTRICT ATTORNEY ALONG WITH THE CITY ATTORNEY, SO THAT SELECT CASES THAT ARE PROBLEMATIC IN VIEW OF THE CRIME AREN’T PART OF THIS PROGRAM. I THINK THE PEOPLE THAT ARE BEING RELEASED, IT SHOULD BE CLEAR TO THOSE WHO ARE LISTENING, THAT WE ARE GOING TO PUT THEM IN PROGRAMS AND ANKLE BRACELET MONITORING. THEY’RE NOT JUST WALKING OUT THE DOOR WITH NO OBLIGATIONS.

JESS>> THIS IS NO LONGER WALKING FREE THEN? THEY’RE STILL --

LEE BACA>> -- THEY’RE STILL UNDER OUR CONTROL AND THEY STILL HAVE TO PERFORM EITHER IN THESE PROGRAMS THAT WE ARE PARTNERING WITH COMMUNITY-BASED ORGANIZATIONS OR THEY HAVE TO COMPLY WITH THE ANKLE BRACELET SYSTEM.

JESS>> WHAT SORT OF CRIMES ARE WE TALKING ABOUT?

LEE BACA>> WELL, WE’RE TALKING ABOUT THE WHOLE RANGE OF MISDEMEANOR SENTENCES, AND THIS IS DRUNK DRIVING, DOMESTIC VIOLENCE, TO SOME EXTENT. WE’RE TALKING ABOUT THEFT, WE’RE TALKING ABOUT NARCOTICS, WE’RE TALKING ABOUT FRAUD, AND WE’RE TALKING ABOUT DRUNK DRIVING ALONG WITH ANYTHING THAT PEOPLE DO TO LOCALLY SERVE TIME IN THE COUNTY JAIL.

VAL>> ARE THEY GENERALLY NONVIOLENT CRIMES? I MEAN, DOMESTIC VIOLENCE IS ACTUALLY --

LEE BACA>> -- WELL, DOMESTIC VIOLENCE IS A LARGE SPECTRUM OF WHAT THAT CONSTITUTES. OBVIOUSLY, THERE IS SOME VIOLENCE INVOLVED, BUT THERE’S ALSO WOMEN WHO COMMIT DOMESTIC OFFENSES AS THERE ARE MEN. WHEN YOU LOOK AT EACH CASE INDIVIDUALLY, REMEMBER THAT THESE PEOPLE HAVE SERVED HALF OF THEIR SENTENCE AND THEREFORE ARE GOING TO GET OUT WITHIN A PERIOD OF TWO TO THREE WEEKS AS IT IS. SO THE POINT HERE THAT WE’VE GOT TO UNDERSTAND IS THAT, IN THE COUNTY JAIL SYSTEM, THE AVERAGE SENTENCE IS FORTY-FIVE DAYS, SO IF A PERSON SERVING TWENTY TO TWENTY-FIVE DAYS INSTEAD OF FORTY-FIVE DAYS, THE CIRCUMSTANCES ARE THAT THE SHERIFF’S GOT TO LET THEM OUT ANYWAY AT SOME POINT IN TIME.

VAL>> THE AVERAGE SENTENCE IS ONLY FORTY-FIVE DAYS?

LEE BACA>> RIGHT.

VAL>> WE ALWAYS PICTURE THESE PEOPLE WITH THREE OR FOUR OR FIVE YEARS.

LEE BACA>> NO. I MEAN, IT’S A COUNTY JAIL.

JESS>> IT’S NOT STATE PRISON.

LEE BACA>> RIGHT. STATE PRISON IS WHERE YOU’RE REALLY DEALING WITH THE BAD, BAD PEOPLE.

VAL>> THOSE ARE FAIRLY SHORT SENTENCES ANYWAY.

LEE BACA>> RIGHT.

JESS>> THERE ARE SOME CRITICS WHO ARE SUGGESTING THAT SOME OF THESE PEOPLE MAY HAVE PLEA-BARGAINED DOWN FROM MORE SERIOUS OFFENSES.

LEE BACA>> WELL, YEAH, BUT YOU SEE THAT’S --

JESS>> -- BUT, IN YOUR BACKGROUND CHECK, CAN YOU DETERMINE THAT?

LEE BACA>> RIGHT, AND WE’LL LOOK AT THE WHOLE HISTORY OF THE INDIVIDUALS. WE DO A PROFILE OF EVERY INMATE THAT COMES IN THE COUNTY JAIL SYSTEM BEFORE THE CUT BECAUSE I’M A BIG BELIEVER IN RECOVERY FOR DRUG ADDICT PROGRAMS, RECOVERY FOR DOMESTIC VIOLENCE PROGRAMS. I HAVE THE FINEST DOMESTIC VIOLENCE RECOVERY PROGRAM IN THE NATION IN THE JAIL SYSTEM. I’M NOT GOING TO CUT THAT.

I HAVE LITERACY PROGRAMS ALONG WITH PARENTING PROGRAMS BECAUSE THERE’S A RELATIONSHIP BETWEEN BEING A GOOD PARENT AND STAYING OUT OF TROUBLE WITH THE LAW. ALL OF THAT IS STILL A PART OF THIS SYSTEM AND THEREFORE WHEN WE TALK ABOUT THESE THINGS, WE’RE LOOKING AT THE MOST PROGRESSIVE JAILING SYSTEM IN THE COUNTRY OF WHICH IS A MODEL. BUT AT THE SAME TIME, I DON’T WANT TO RELEASE THESE INMATES IF I HAD MY CHOICE.

VAL>> AND HOW DO YOU ANSWER BOTH MAYOR HAHN AND THE NEW POLICE CHIEF, BILL BRATTON, WHO’VE WRITTEN YOU A LETTER AND SAID THAT YOU’RE SENDING A DANGEROUS MESSAGE THAT THE CRIMINAL JUSTICE SYSTEM CAN BE LENIENT?

LEE BACA>> WELL, I THINK THEY KNOW EXACTLY WHY THIS IS BEING DONE AND I DON’T DISAGREE WITH THEIR FEELING ABOUT THINGS. BUT THE DANGEROUS MESSAGE IS THIS: THE SHERIFF’S DEPARTMENT POLICES 2.8 MILLION PEOPLE ITSELF. I’M NOT SELECTIVELY TAKING L.A. CITY ARRESTS OR ANY OTHER COMMUNITY’S ARRESTS. ALL OF US ARE IN THIS TOGETHER. THE SHERIFF IS A CONSTITUTIONAL OFFICER MANDATED TO BALANCE HIS BUDGET. I DON’T HAVE ENOUGH MONEY. HELP ME FIND THAT MONEY. WE’LL FIX THE PROBLEM. BUT UNTIL THE ECONOMY TURNS AROUND OR I FIND EXTRA REVENUE, I CAN’T FIX THE PROBLEM. I’M WILLING TO MAKE THE TOUGH DECISIONS FOR THE SAKE OF THE ALMIGHTY DOLLAR THAT THE TAXPAYER WORKS SO HARD TO PAY --

JESS>> -- AND TAKE THE HEAT FOR IT.

LEE BACA>> AND TAKE THE HEAT AND FIGHT TO RESTRUCTURE THE STATE FINANCES BECAUSE THE STATE TAKES TOO MUCH MONEY FROM LOCAL GOVERNMENT.

VAL>> (LAUGHTER) THERE YOU GO. SHERIFF LEE BACA, ALWAYS FUN TO HAVE YOU ON THE PROGRAM AND GOOD LUCK WITH THE TASK.

LEE BACA>> MY PLEASURE, AND HERE’S THE WHOLE BOOK.

JESS>> POUND FOR POUND.

LEE BACA>> POUND FOR POUND, RIGHT HERE.

VAL>> THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

TO SEND A COMMENT OR A QUESTION TO OUR PROGRAM, YOU CAN REACH US BY MAIL AT THIS ADDRESS:

LIFE AND TIMES
4401 SUNSET BLVD.
LOS ANGELES, CALIFORNIA 90027

YOU CAN ALSO CALL OUR VIEWER COMMENT LINE (323) 953-5555) OR CONTACT US THE FAST WAY BY E-MAIL AT KCET.ORG.

JESS>> THEY’RE SEXY, SINISTER AND STILL POPULAR AFTER MORE THAN SIXTY YEARS. FILMS SUCH AS “STRANGERS ON A TRAIN” AND “FORCE OF EVIL” HAVE STOOD THE TEST OF TIME AND NOW A FESTIVAL WILL BRING SOME OF THE BEST NOIR MOVIES BACK TO THE BIG SCREEN.

VAL>> AND ALONG WITH THE FESTIVAL, A BOOK ON FILM NOIR POSTERS, CALLED “THE ART OF NOIR” BY EDDIE MULLER. WE’LL TALK WITH HIM IN A MOMENT, BUT FIRST THIS SCENE FROM “KISS ME DEADLY” STARRING A VERY YOUNG CLORIS LEACHMAN.

[FILM CLIP]

JESS>> JOINING US NOW IS THE AUTHOR OF THE BOOK AND THE COORDINATOR OF THE FESTIVAL, EDDIE MULLER. HOW DID YOU MANAGE TO GET FARLEY GRANGER TO COME BACK TO HOLLYWOOD? (LAUGHTER)

EDDIE MULLER>> WELL, I’VE BEEN TRYING TO DO THAT FOR A NUMBER OF YEARS AND HE’S STILL AROUND. IT HAPPENED BECAUSE, WHEN THIS BOOK CAME OUT IN NEW YORK, JOHN GARFIELD’S DAUGHTER, JULIE GARFIELD, CAME TO A BOOK SIGNING AND, JUST OUT OF THE BLUE, I HAPPENED TO SAY TO HER, “DO YOU KNOW FARLEY GRANGER?” SHE SAID, “YEAH, HE LIVES IN MY BUILDING.” SO WE KIND OF MADE THE CONNECTION AND THEN I HAD LUNCH WITH FARLEY IN NEW YORK AND HE WAS KIND ENOUGH TO SAY, YEAH, I’LL COME BACK TO HOLLYWOOD JUST FOR THIS.

VAL>> NOW WHY DO YOU THINK THESE FILMS HAVE LASTED? YOU KNOW, THERE WERE TONS OF MOVIES MADE IN THE THIRTIES AND FORTIES AND FIFTIES, AND THESE ARE THE ONES THAT WE’RE WATCHING AGAIN AND AGAIN.

EDDIE MULLER>> IT’S BECAUSE THEY’RE SO STYLISH, THEY’RE SO WELL-WRITTEN, THEY’RE SO WEIGHTY AND THEY LOOK GREAT. THEY AREN’T SAPPY AND NOSTALGIC, YOU KNOW, SO THEY STILL SPEAK TO A MODERN AUDIENCE. THE MOVIES ARE TOUGH AND, YOU KNOW, THEY’RE ABOUT GRITTY THEMES AND CRIME DRAMAS AND THINGS, BUT THEY’RE --

VAL>> -- THEY WERE VERY CREATIVELY DIRECTED FOR THEIR TIME. I MEAN, WE’RE WATCHING THIS SCENE HERE.

JESS>> “KISS ME DEADLY”.

VAL>> THIS IS ALMOST AHEAD OF ITS TIME IN TERMS OF DIRECTION.

EDDIE MULLER>> OH, IT IS. IT IS COMPLETELY. ROBERT ALDRICH DIRECTED THIS PICTURE AND IT’S SORT OF CONSIDERED THE ZENITH OF CLASSIC FILM NOIR STYLE. IT’S VERY, VERY JAZZY.

VAL>> “KISS ME DEADLY”, I THINK THIS IS.

EDDIE MULLER>> YEAH, “KISS ME DEADLY”.

JESS>> DOES CLASSIC FILM NOIR HAVE TO BE IN BLACK AND WHITE?

EDDIE MULLER>> MOST PEOPLE WOULD SAY YES.

JESS>> IT HELPS, DOESN’T IT?

EDDIE MULLER>> IT CERTAINLY HELPS, YES.

VAL>> WE’RE GOING TO SEE ANOTHER CLIP NOW. THIS IS FROM “THEY LIVE BY NIGHT” STARRING FARLEY GRANGER, THE PERSON YOU MENTIONED AND THE PERSON WHO WILL BE AT THE FESTIVAL.

EDDIE MULLER>> THAT’S RIGHT. FARLEY WILL BE THERE THE FIRST THREE NIGHTS OF THE FESTIVAL.

VAL>> LET’S TAKE A LOOK AT THIS FROM “THEY LIVE BY NIGHT”.

[FILM CLIP]

EDDIE MULLER>> THIS IS FARLEY GRANGER AND CATHY O’DONNELL. THEY WERE QUITE THE TEEN HEARTTHROBS AND THIS IS LIKE THE ROMEO AND JULIET STORY FILM NOIR.

[FILM CLIP]

VAL>> (LAUGHTER).

JESS>> THE FILMS WERE BLACK AND WHITE, BUT THE POSTERS WERE VERY COLORFUL.

EDDIE MULLER>> OH, THE POSTERS. IT IS FUNNY. PEOPLE SAID ARE YOU GOING TO DO ANOTHER FILM NOIR BOOK? I SAID, YEAH, AND IT’S GOING TO BE IN FULL COLOR, 272 PAGES OF FULL COLOR (LAUGHTER).

JESS>> HERE’S A POSTER. AND THIS ONE, “THE MALTESE FALCON”.

EDDIE MULLER>> “THE MALTESE FALCON”, YEAH. THIS WAS REALLY A GREAT PROJECT. I HAD SO MUCH FUN DOING THIS BECAUSE ONE OF THE THINGS THAT’S INTERESTING ABOUT THIS BOOK IS THEY’RE NOT JUST HOLLYWOOD POSTERS. THEY’RE ALL HOLLYWOOD MOVIES, BUT THE POSTERS THAT I CHOSE WERE FROM ALL OVER THE WORLD, SO YOU SEE POSTERS FROM DIFFERENT COUNTRIES. LIKE THIS ONE IS FROM BELGIUM.

VAL>> OH, I SEE. THE OTHER LANGUAGES.

EDDIE MULLER>> YEAH, THREE DIFFERENT LANGUAGES ON EVERY BELGIAN POSTER, AND “FORCE OF EVIL”, ANOTHER PICTURE THAT WE WILL BE SHOWING AT THE FESTIVAL. SO IT’S REALLY INTERESTING TO SEE HOW -- SEE, THIS IS AN ITALIAN POSTER FOR A MOVIE CALLED “FLAMINGO ROAD” WITH JOAN CRAWFORD, WHICH IS NOT A POSTER THAT YOU WOULD SEE. THAT’S THE U.S. POSTER FOR THE MOVIE AND YOU CAN SEE A VERY DIFFERENT GRAPHIC APPROACH. THE ITALIANS AND THE FRENCH AND THE SWEDES, JAPANESE, GERMANS, THEY ALL HAD A DIFFERENT APPROACH. HERE’S “THE LADY FROM SHANGHAI”, A U.S. HALF-SHEET FOR THIS MOVIE WITH RITA HAYWORTH AND ORSON WELLES. THIS IS THE FRENCH POSTER FOR THE SAME MOVIE. IT TAKES A SLIGHTLY DIFFERENT APPROACH. IT GIVES MORE PROMINENCE TO ORSON WELLES BECAUSE THEY LOVED HIM IN FRANCE. THEN THIS IS A DANISH POSTER FOR “THE LADY FROM SHANGHAI” --

VAL>> -- EMPHASIZING THE WOMAN.

EDDIE MULLER>> EMPHASIZING THE WOMAN AND ALSO A LITTLE MORE, YOU KNOW, STREAMLINED GRAPHICS. THEN THE ITALIAN IS THE MOST LUSH AND SEXY OF THE BUNCH, PAINTED BY A MAN NAMED ENSELMO BALLISTER, WHO’S ONE OF THE GREAT POSTER ARTISTS.

JESS>> COLLECTORS OF SCREEN POSTERS ARE DROOLING.

EDDIE MULLER>> OH, YEAH, YEAH. THAT’S ONE OF MY PERSONAL FAVORITES. THAT’S A GERMAN POSTER FOR A VERY OBSCURE HOLLYWOOD MOVIE CALLED “HIGHWAY 301” WITH STEVE COCHRAN, NOT A POSTER THAT YOU WOULD SEE PRODUCED IN THE UNITED STATES. ALAN LADD IN “CALCUTTA”, YOU KNOW --

VAL>> -- ART IN THEMSELVES. YOU MENTIONED “FORCE OF EVIL”. WE HAVE A CLIP FROM “FORCE OF EVIL” WHICH STARRED A BIG STAR AT THE TIME, JOHN GARFIELD. WE’RE GOING TO TAKE A LOOK AT THAT.

[FILM CLIP]

VAL>> THOSE ACTORS ARE GREAT. JOHN GARFIELD, OF COURSE, WAS A BIG STAR IN HIS DAY, AND THE WOMAN WAS?

EDDIE MULLER>> MARIE WINDSOR. SHE SORT OF BECAME KNOWN AS THE QUEEN OF THE BEES. SHE WAS SYNONYMOUS WITH FILM NOIR. SHE ALWAYS PLAYED VERY STATUESQUE, SEXY VIXENS.

JESS>> GARFIELD DIED VERY YOUNG, A TRAGIC LIFE?

EDDIE MULLER>> YEAH, THIRTY-NINE YEARS OLD, IF YOU CAN BELIEVE THAT. A HEART ATTACK. HE DIDN’T FARE WELL DURING THE WITCH HUNT. EVEN THOUGH HE WAS NEVER NAMED AS A COMMUNIST, HE REFUSED TO NAME NAMES AND THE PRESSURE SORT OF GOT TO HIM.

JESS>> HE WAS BLACKLISTED THEN?

EDDIE MULLER>> YEAH, HE WAS SORT OF RUN OUT OF HOLLYWOOD AND TRIED TO GET A SECOND START ON THE STAGE BACK IN NEW YORK WHERE HE CAME FROM, AND HE HAD A HEART ATTACK AT THIRTY-NINE.

VAL>> NOW PEOPLE WHO GO TO THE FESTIVAL WILL BE ABLE TO MEET A LOT OF THE PEOPLE WHO ARE ASSOCIATED WITH THESE FILMS?

EDDIE MULLER>> OH, ABSOLUTELY, YEAH. THAT’S A VERY SPECIAL THING THAT WE DO. I MEAN, SO MANY OF THE PEOPLE STILL LIVE HERE IN HOLLYWOOD AND IT’S GREAT TO BE ABLE TO BRING THEM BACK OUT. WHEN WE DO “FORCE OF EVIL”, WE’RE HAVING AS A GUEST DAVID RAKSIN WHO WROTE THE SCORE FOR THAT FILM. HE’S A PHENOMENAL COMPOSER. I MEAN, HE’S VERY FAMOUS FOR WRITING THE SCORE TO “LAURA” AND THE FAMOUS SONG FROM “LAURA”. HE WILL COME OUT ON SUNDAY WHEN WE SHOW THAT FILM. YEAH, WE TRY TO BRING OUT AS MANY PEOPLE AS POSSIBLE, WHETHER THEY’RE WRITERS, DIRECTORS, ACTORS, ACTRESSES.

JESS>> NOW THESE ARE VINTAGE FILMS, BUT FILM NOIR IS STILL BEING PRODUCED?

EDDIE MULLER>> YEAH, I THINK SO. I MEAN, IT’S INTERESTING THAT THE PURISTS ARGUE THAT IT HAPPENED DURING A SPECIFIC TIME FROM LIKE THE EARLY 1940’S UP TO MAYBE 1960 OR 1959 AND THEN IT HAD TO BE IN BLACK AND WHITE AND THAT THEY WERE KIND OF “B” MOVIES. THEY ALWAYS HAD TO DO WITH A CRIME BEING COMMITTED. THAT STYLE OF THOSE FILMS HAS ENDED. YOU REALLY CAN’T DO THAT AGAIN. BUT WHAT THE MOVIES ARE ABOUT AND THE THEMES AND THE CONTENT, YOU KNOW, ORDINARY PEOPLE KIND OF DOING BAD THINGS AND DESCENDING INTO DARKNESS, YEAH, THEY’RE MADE ALL THE TIME. I MEAN, GO IN YOUR LOCAL VIDEO STORE AND THERE ARE RACKS FULL OF THEM (LAUGHTER).

JESS>> OR YOUR LOCAL NEWS (LAUGHTER).

VAL>> (LAUGHTER) BUT THEY’RE NOT LIKE THE ONES FROM THE THIRTIES AND FORTIES.

EDDIE MULLER>> NOT QUITE AS STYLISH.

VAL>> EDDIE MULLER, WE WANT TO THANK YOU FOR COMING ON. I ALSO WANT TO MENTION THAT YOU’VE WRITTEN YOUR OWN CRIME NOVEL, “SHADOW BOXER”. CONGRATULATIONS ON THAT.

EDDIE MULLER>> THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

VAL>> WE’LL LOOK FORWARD TO THE FESTIVAL. SOUNDS FANTASTIC.

EDDIE MULLER>> THANKS FOR HAVING ME.

VAL>> THE AMERICAN CINEMATHEQUE’S FIFTH ANNUAL FESTIVAL OF FILM NOIR STARTS TONIGHT WITH HITCHCOCK’S “STRANGERS ON A TRAIN”. YOU CAN GO THEIR WEBSITE OR CALL THE NUMBER ON YOUR SCREEN FOR MORE INFORMATION.

WWW.AMERICANCINEMATHEQUE.COM
WWW.EGYPTIANTHEATRE.COM
323-466-FILM

JESS>> A REMINDER THAT YOU CAN FIND TRANSCRIPTS OR HEAR THE AUDIO OF RECENT PROGRAMS THROUGH OUR NEWLY-DESIGNED WEBSITE AT KCET.ORG. CLICK ON LIFE AND TIMES.

VAL>> THANKS SO MUCH FOR WATCHING. THAT’S OUR PROGRAM FOR THIS EVENING. TAKE CARE AND GOOD NIGHT.

LIFE AND TIMES WAS MADE POSSIBLE BY THE FOLLOWING FOUNDATIONS:

THE L.K. WHITTIER FOUNDATION
DEDICATED TO IMPROVING THE QUALITY OF LIFE BY SUPPORTING INNOVATIVE ENDEAVORS IN THE FIELDS OF MEDICINE, HEALTH, SCIENCE AND EDUCATION.

AND THE CALIFORNIA ENDOWMENT
THE STATE'S LARGEST HEALTH FOUNDATION SUPPORTING ORGANIZATIONS THAT DIRECTLY IMPROVE THE HEALTH AND WELL-BEING OF CALIFORNIA'S DIVERSE COMMUNITIES. THE CALIFORNIA ENDOWMENT, A PARTNER FOR HEALTHIER COMMUNITIES.

TO REACH US AT LIFE AND TIMES, CALL 323-953-5555. SEND US AN E-MAIL TO LIFEANDTIMES@KCET.ORG OR LOG ONTO OUR WEBSITE AT WWW.KCET.ORG TO SEND MESSAGES OR DOWNLOAD TRANSCRIPTS OF TONIGHT’S PROGRAM.