4/11/03

LC030411

VAL ZAVALA>> TONIGHT ON LIFE AND TIMES --

JESS MARLOW>> A NEW KIND OF ENGINE THAT COULD DRIVE US ALL TO A BRAND NEW FUTURE WHERE NO ONE BURNS GASOLINE.

RICHARD CROMWELL>> YOU KNOW, YOU’RE NOT GOING TO FORCE ANYBODY TO DO ANYTHING. WE ALL UNDERSTAND THAT. BUT, BY GOLLY, IF WE HAVE THE AVAILABILITY OF A CHOICE THAT’S CLEANER, WORKS JUST AS WELL, WHY WOULDN’T I CHOOSE THAT?

VAL>> AND THEN HITTING THE ROAD WITH TWO WRITERS WHO TELL US YOU CAN SEE AMERICA AND FIND YOURSELF, ALL IN ONE TRIP.

JESS>> PLUS, JUST HOW BAD IS CALIFORNIA’S BUDGET CRISIS AND IS THE STATE HEADED FOR INSOLVENCY?

VAL>> IT’S ALL STRAIGHT AHEAD ON TONIGHT’S LIFE AND TIMES.

LIFE AND TIMES IS MADE POSSIBLE BY THE FOLLOWING FOUNDATIONS:

THE L.K. WHITTIER FOUNDATION
DEDICATED TO IMPROVING THE QUALITY OF LIFE BY SUPPORTING INNOVATIVE ENDEAVORS IN THE FIELDS OF MEDICINE, HEALTH, SCIENCE AND EDUCATION.

AND THE CALIFORNIA ENDOWMENT
THE STATE'S LARGEST HEALTH FOUNDATION SUPPORTING ORGANIZATIONS THAT DIRECTLY IMPROVE THE HEALTH AND WELL-BEING OF CALIFORNIA'S DIVERSE COMMUNITIES. THE CALIFORNIA ENDOWMENT, A PARTNER FOR HEALTHIER COMMUNITIES.

VAL>> A NEW HIGH-TECH ENGINE THAT NEVER RUNS OUT OF FUEL.

JESS>> IT’S SO CLEAN THAT YOU CAN ACTUALLY DRINK THE STUFF THAT COMES OUT OF THE TAILPIPE. THIS MAY SOUND LIKE SOME PIE-IN-THE-SKY NOTION FOR A UTOPIAN FUTURE, BUT IN FACT, THE ENGINE WE JUST DESCRIBED IS IN USE NOW NEAR PALM SPRINGS. AND AS DAVID GARCIA REPORTS, IT COULD SOLVE A LOT OF PROBLEMS AMERICA NOW FACES.

DAVID GARCIA>> THE BUBBLES ARE THE ONLY THING YOU CAN SEE MOVING, BUT THIS FUEL CELL DEVELOPED BY SUNLINE’S TRANSIT AGENCY IN THE DESERT COMMUNITY OF THOUSAND PALMS TURNS OUT ALL THE ELECTRICITY NEEDED TO POWER A SMALL OFFICE BUILDING.

RICHARD CROMWELL>> IF THIS CAN BE PERFECTED OR GO TO WHERE IT NEEDS TO GO, WE’RE NOT GOING TO HAVE TO HAVE WARS OVER OIL ANYMORE. PRETTY NEAT CONCEPT.

DAVID GARCIA>> THE TECHNOLOGY IS THE SAME POWER SOURCE THAT RUNS THIS FUEL CELL BUS ALSO DEVELOPED BY THE SUNLINE’S TRANSIT AGENCY, THE OLD DIESEL STINKPOTS REPLACED WITH POWER PRODUCED FROM NATURAL ELEMENTS ALL AROUND US. WHAT WE’RE SEEING IS A DIFFERENT MINDSET FOR POWER?

RICHARD CROMWELL>> YEAH, A TOTALLY DIFFERENT MINDSET TO WHERE WE’RE NO LONGER DEPENDENT ON FOREIGN OIL OR ANY OIL ANYWHERE, WHETHER YOU’RE FOREIGN OR NOT FOREIGN. A RICH COUNTRY, POOR COUNTRY, MAKES NO DIFFERENCE BECAUSE THE PLAYING FIELD IS LEVEL. HYDROGEN ALLOWS US TO DEVOTE THOSE KINDS OF ENERGIES, WAR ENERGIES, TO SOMETHING ELSE.

DAVID GARCIA>> AND THAT DEMONSTRATION OF SOMETHING ELSE IS UP AND RUNNING, CRANKING OUT ELECTRICITY IN ONE OF THE SUNLINE BUILDINGS.

RICHARD CROMWELL>> YOU CAN ACTUALLY SEE HOW IT WORKS. YOU’LL SEE THE SUN MAKING ELECTRICITY, SPLITTING THE WATER, THE HYDROGEN BROUGHT TO HERE, RECOMBINED AND MAKING ELECTRICITY TO RUN THE LIGHTS IN THIS BUILDING. WE THINK THIS IS A PRECURSOR TO WHAT MIGHT BE IN YOUR HOME SOMEDAY. NOT QUITE AS BIG AS THIS BECAUSE IT WILL GET SMALLER AND MORE COMPACT AND SIMPLER, BUT WE HAVE TO KEEP BUILDING ON THAT TECHNOLOGY. JUST LIKE WE DO WITH CARS, WE’VE GOT TO DO THAT WITH STATIONARY, SO THAT WE REALLY CAN BE THAT ALTERNATIVE.

DAVID GARCIA>> FUEL CELL TECHNOLOGY IS NOW A PART OF OUR NATIONAL ENERGY POLICY, PRESIDENT BUSH ANNOUNCING THE COMMITMENT IN HIS STATE OF THE UNION SPEECH AT THE BEGINNING OF THE YEAR.

GEORGE W. BUSH>> TONIGHT I’M PROPOSING $1.2 BILLION DOLLARS IN RESEARCH FUNDING SO THAT AMERICA CAN LEAD THE WORLD IN DEVELOPING CLEAN HYDROGEN-POWERED AUTOMOBILES.

DAVID GARCIA>> ACCEPTANCE OF THE FUEL CELL AS AN ALTERNATIVE BEGINS WITH SOLID PROOF THAT IT WORKS, WHICH IS THE PURPOSE OF THIS DEMONSTRATION UNIT.

MICHAEL JOHNSON>> IT IS A WORKING TECHNOLOGY NOW. THERE ARE, YOU KNOW, COMPANIES WITH CARS ON THE ROAD THAT RUN WITH FUEL CELLS AND THIS IS A UNIT RIGHT HERE THAT WILL RUN A HOUSE.

DAVID GARCIA>> AND ADD THE ADDITIONAL BENEFIT THAT IT’S NONPOLLUTING. THE ONLY BYPRODUCT IS, IN FACT, WATER.

RICHARD CROMWELL>> I THINK OUR MOST EXCITING EFFORT IS THE FACT THAT THERE ARE CHOICES THAT COULD BE MADE TODAY. YOU KNOW, YOU’RE NOT GOING TO FORCE ANYBODY TO DO ANYTHING. WE ALL UNDERSTAND THAT. BUT, BY GOLLY, IF WE HAVE THE AVAILABILITY OF A CHOICE THAT’S CLEANER, WORKS JUST AS WELL, WHY WOULDN’T I CHOOSE THAT? AND FOR THE FIRST TIME, OUR YOUNG PEOPLE HAVE THAT CHOICE.

YOU KNOW, THERE WAS GASOLINE OR THERE WAS DIESEL. THAT’S ALL THERE WAS. WELL, NOW THERE IS NATURAL GAS AND VERY SOON THERE’S GOING TO BE HYDROGEN. IF WE TEACH EVERYBODY THE PLUSES AND THE MINUSES OF ALL OF THIS, I HAVE A LOT OF FAITH THAT OUR FOLKS ARE GOING TO CHOOSE THE RIGHT CHOICE AND THAT’S THE CLEAN CHOICE, THE HEALTHY CHOICE.

[FILM CLIP]

JESS>> DAVID GARCIA JOINS US NOW. YOU DON’T RECOMMEND THAT WE DRINK OUT OF THE TAILPIPE, DO YOU?

VAL>> (LAUGHTER) HE ONLY DRANK A LITTLE BIT, YOU NOTICED.

DAVID GARCIA>> HE DRANK IT AND HE DID NOT FALL OVER --

JESS>> -- NOT YET --

DAVID GARCIA>> -- AND THE WATER IS ABSOLUTELY CLEAN, AND IT’S THE ONLY BYPRODUCT OF THIS PROCESS.

JESS>> ON SEVERAL OCCASIONS, HE MADE SOME PROVISOS. AT ONE POINT, HE SAID “IF” THIS CAN BE PERFECTED, AND HE SAYS THIS IS A PRECURSOR OF WHAT “MIGHT” POWER YOUR HOME.

DAVID GARCIA>> MIGHT IF, IN FACT, THE PUBLIC ACCEPTS IT. IT’S HARD FOR PEOPLE TO GRASP, FOR EXAMPLE, THAT A CAR WILL RUN ON ANYTHING OTHER THAN THIS BIG ENGINE OR THAT A HOUSE WILL TAKE ELECTRICITY FROM ANYTHING OTHER THAN A POWER LINE AND THOSE GIANT LINES THAT CRISS-CROSS OUR STATE. BUT A FUEL CELL IS A SELF-CONTAINED UNIT THAT, IN FACT, CAN POWER A VEHICLE, CAN POWER A HOME, CAN POWER AN OFFICE BUILDING, AND WHAT IT USES IS THE NATURAL ELEMENTS THAT ARE, IN FACT, ALL AROUND US. THIS IS A VERY DIFFICULT THING FOR PEOPLE TO ACCEPT.

VAL>> BUT BE MORE SPECIFIC. WHAT NATURAL ELEMENT?

DAVID GARCIA>> YOU START WITH WATER --

VAL>> -- YOU START WITH WATER, OKAY.

DAVID GARCIA>> YOU START WITH WATER. THEN IT’S A CHEMICAL PROCESS. IT GOES AROUND AND AROUND AND THEN IT COMES OUT HERE. IN EFFECT, IF YOU WANT IT VERY COMPLICATED, I’LL TRY TO MAKE IT VERY SIMPLE. WATER SPLITS INTO HYDROGEN AND OXYGEN. OXYGEN IS VENTED. HYDROGEN THEN BECOMES -- NOW YOU HAVE HYDROGEN, NOW YOU ADD AIR, OKAY? NOW THESE TWO TRY TO COMBINE IN A NATURAL PROCESS, A CHEMICAL REACTION, BUT THEY CAN’T. THEY’RE SEPARATED BY A MEMBRANE. THIS ENERGY THEN FORCES THE HYDROGEN TO PRODUCE ELECTRONS, PROTONS -- REMEMBER YOUR HIGH SCHOOL CHEMISTRY -- THE ELECTRONS, IN FACT, CREATE ELECTRICITY THAT POWERS THE HOUSE. SO IT’S A NATURAL PROCESS AND THE BYPRODUCT IS WATER. THAT STARTS THE PROCESS ALL OVER AGAIN. WATER IN, WATER OUT, TO CREATE THIS CYCLE TO CREATE ELECTRICITY OR THE POWER TO FUEL A VEHICLE.

JESS>> SO WHAT’S THE NEXT STEP THEN IN THE DEVELOPMENT?

DAVID GARCIA>> THE NEXT STEP, PRESIDENT BUSH HAS PUT THE NATION ON A COURSE OF AN ALTERNATIVE ENERGY POLICY, IF YOU WILL. FIRST FOR A VEHICLE, BE IT A BUS, BE IT A CAR, WHATEVER. CARS EXIST THAT RUN ON FUEL CELLS. IT’S USED IN SPACE ALL THE TIME. IT’S JUST THAT IT’S NOT USED IN THE APPLICATIONS ON EARTH YET IN A WIDESPREAD MANNER. BUT, AGAIN, IT’S PUBLIC ACCEPTANCE OF THIS NATIONAL POLICY TO EXPAND THAT TO INCLUDE YOUR HOME.

VAL>> I WOULD LOVE TO HEAR THE RESPONSE FROM OIL COMPANIES, BUT WE’LL HAVE TO DO THAT AT A LATER DATE.

DAVID GARCIA>> WELL, THAT’S THEIR PROBLEM (LAUGHTER).

VAL>> (LAUGHTER) THAT’S ANOTHER STORY. DAVID GARCIA, THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR BEING HERE.

DAVID GARCIA>> CERTAINLY. MY PLEASURE.

VAL>> MONDAY ON LIFE AND TIMES, A GET-OUT-OF-JAIL CARD FOR CALIFORNIA PRISON INMATES, BUT ARE WE PUTTING SAFETY ON THE LINE JUST TO SAVE A FEW DOLLARS?

>> THIS DOESN’T MAKE SENSE TO ME. IF YOU HAVE A BURGLAR IN CUSTODY AND HE OR SHE IS SENTENCED FOR NINE MONTHS AND YOU SAY TO THIS BURGLAR THAT WE’RE GOING TO LET YOU OUT EARLY WITHIN SIX MONTHS, HE’S STILL A BURGLAR.

JESS>> CALIFORNIA’S BUDGET CRISIS HAS CREATED A FAMILIAR SHOWDOWN AMONG LAWMAKERS IN SACRAMENTO. SHOULD THEY RAISE TAXES OR CUT SPENDING? THE STATE’S PUBLIC SCHOOLS HAVE A LOT RIDING ON THE OUTCOME OF THAT DEBATE. EVEN GOVERNOR GRAY DAVIS IS PROPOSING SUBSTANTIAL CUTS IN EDUCATION. THE RESULT MAY BE FEWER TEACHERS AND MORE CROWDED CLASSROOMS. BUT CRITICS SAY WHAT CHOICE DOES THE GOVERNOR HAVE, ESPECIALLY SINCE CALIFORNIA MAY BE TEETERING ON THE EDGE OF INSOLVENCY?

VAL>> WELL, LIKE GRAY DAVIS, OUR NEXT GUEST IS A DEMOCRAT, BUT HE STRONGLY DISAGREES WITH MAKING BIG CUTS IN EDUCATION. JOINING US NOW IS STATE TREASURER, PHIL ANGELIDES. WELCOME TO LIFE AND TIMES.

PHIL ANGELIDES>> GOOD TO BE HERE WITH YOU.

JESS>> SINCE EDUCATION TAKES SO MUCH OF THE STATE’S BUDGET AND SINCE WE HAVE SUCH A HUGE DEFICIT, DOES THE GOVERNOR HAVE ANY CHOICE?

PHIL ANGELIDES>> WELL, I THINK THERE IS A CHOICE AND IT’S A PRETTY FUNDAMENTAL CHOICE. YOU KNOW, IF YOU LOOK AT CALIFORNIA IN DECADES TO COME, OUR ONLY CHANCE TO BE SOCIALLY STRONG AND TO HAVE A COMPETITIVE ECONOMY ON THE GLOBAL SCENE IS TO HAVE THE BEST EDUCATED WORKFORCE IN THE WORLD. WE’RE NOT GOING TO COMPETE WITH A WHOLE SET OF THIRD WORLD NATIONS IN TERMS OF PRODUCING PRODUCTS AT THE CHEAPEST PRICES. OUR TICKET TO ECONOMIC STRENGTH IS A WELL-EDUCATED WORKFORCE, CHILDREN AND YOUNG PEOPLE WHO KNOW HOW TO READ, WRITE, DO MATHEMATICS.

LOOK, WE’RE A STATE WITH A $1.4 TRILLION DOLLAR ECONOMY. WE SPEND MORE EACH YEAR AS CALIFORNIANS BUY NEW AUTOMOBILES THAN WE DO ON TEACHING ELEMENTARY THROUGH HIGH SCHOOL STUDENTS. WE DO HAVE A CHOICE. IT WILL REQUIRE INCREASED REVENUES, FAIR TAXES, BUT I THINK IT’S AN INVESTMENT WE ABSOLUTELY HAVE TO MAKE. CUTS AT THIS POINT, I THINK, WOULD BE WRONG-HEADED.

VAL>> OKAY, SO HOW MUCH ARE WE LOOKING AT? HOW MUCH DO OUR SCHOOLS REALLY NEED? HOW MUCH ARE YOU SUGGESTING OUR TAXES SHOULD GO UP?

PHIL ANGELIDES>> WELL, FIRST OF ALL, IF YOU WERE JUST TO MAINTAIN EDUCATION SPENDING -- AND BY THE WAY, FOR THE FIRST TIME IN DECADES BECAUSE THERE ARE INCREASED COMMUNITY ENGAGEMENT, PARENTAL ENGAGEMENT, MORE SPENDING ON EDUCATION, TEST SCORES ARE GOING UP IN CALIFORNIA. NOW IS THE WRONG TIME TO RETREAT. THE BUDGET PROPOSES TO CUT ABOUT $2.5 BILLION DOLLARS THIS YEAR AND NEXT YEAR. THAT’S $10,000 PER CLASSROOM --

VAL>> -- OUT OF EDUCATION.

PHIL ANGELIDES>> OUT OF EDUCATION, AND I BELIEVE THAT WE OUGHT TO BE WILLING, IF IT’S INCREASES IN CORPORATE TAX RATE, IF IT IS INCREASES, FOR EXAMPLE, IN INCOME TAXES FOR THOSE WHO CAN MOST AFFORD IT, THAT WE OUGHT TO MAINTAIN THAT $2.5 BILLION DOLLARS IN SPENDING --

VAL>> -- BUT THAT WOULD JUST KEEP US AT THE CURRENT LEVEL?

PHIL ANGELIDES>> RIGHT, AND I MIGHT ADD THAT THAT KEEPS US AT THE CURRENT LEVEL WHERE, FOR THE FIRST TIME, ELEMENTARY SCHOOL TESTS ARE GOING UP. WE CAN’T AFFORD, GIVEN THE CHALLENGES IN FRONT OF US, TO RETREAT RIGHT NOW IN TERMS OF TRYING TO BRING ALONG OUR WORKFORCE FOR THE TWENTY-FIRST CENTURY.

JESS>> YOU’RE GOING AROUND THE STATE TALKING WITH SCHOOL GROUPS AND PARENT GROUPS AND TELLING THEM TO GET ON THE PHONE AND GET ON THE E-MAIL AND PUT SOME FIRE UNDER THE LEGISLATORS TO KEEP THEM FROM CUTTING THE STATE’S EDUCATION BUDGET. ARE YOU HAVING SUCCESS?

PHIL ANGELIDES>> WELL, I’VE BEEN ALL OVER THE STATE FROM SACRAMENTO TO CHICO TO SAN DIEGO TO FRESNO. WHAT I FIND IS THAT, AT THE COMMUNITY LEVEL, PEOPLE HAVE A WILLINGNESS TO INVEST IN EDUCATION BECAUSE THEY GET IT. I THINK THE REAL CHALLENGE HERE IS WHETHER THEY CAN BUILD ENOUGH MOMENTUM AND FIRE IN SACRAMENTO AND I JUST HOPE PEOPLE DO IT.

YOU KNOW, THE ONLY GOOD THING THAT CAN BE SAID ABOUT A TOUGH ECONOMIC TIME LIKE TODAY IS THAT IT DOES FORCE SOCIETIES TO CHOOSE. I CANNOT THINK OF A MORE WORTHY PLACE TO SPEND MONEY AS A SOCIETY THAN ON EDUCATING CHILDREN. YOU KNOW, WHEN RONALD REAGAN WAS GOVERNOR OF THIS STATE, HARDLY A RADICAL, WE SPENT 5.6 CENTS OF EVERY DOLLAR OF PERSONAL INCOME THAT WE ALL MADE ON EDUCATING CHILDREN. WE WERE ONE OF THE TOP FIVE IN THE COUNTRY AMONG STATES. WE NOW SPEND 3.9 CENTS FOR EVERY DOLLAR AND WE’RE ONLY THIRTY-SECOND IN EDUCATING SPENDING DESPITE THE INCREASES THE LAST FEW YEARS.

VAL>> WE ARE REALLY FACING SOME DIRE FINANCIAL SITUATIONS ON THE STATE LEVEL. THE BUDGET IS HUGE, SOMEWHERE AROUND $26 BILLION TO $30 BILLION DOLLARS. THERE HAVE BEEN DELAYS. THEY HAVEN’T BEEN ABLE TO SOLVE IT. THERE ARE ALL SORTS OF, YOU KNOW, CONFUSION IN SACRAMENTO. ARE WE AT THE RISK OF ENDING UP BANKRUPT PRETTY SOON? OR DO YOU SEE A SOLUTION TO THE BASIC DEFICIT PROBLEM?

PHIL ANGELIDES>> WELL, WE DO HAVE TO GET OUR FISCAL HOUSE IN ORDER. WE’RE NOT TEETERING ON BANKRUPTCY, AS I SAID EARLIER.

VAL>> WE’RE NOT.

PHIL ANGELIDES>> WE’RE A RELATIVELY WEALTHY SOCIETY. WE HAVE THE ABILITY TO FUND BASIC SERVICES. WE SHARE THE SAME FATE RIGHT NOW OF FORTY-SIX OF FIFTY STATES THAT ARE IN DEFICIT BECAUSE OF THE NATIONAL ECONOMIC RECESSION AND THE LACK OF AID FROM WASHINGTON. BUT HERE’S WHAT WE NEED TO DO. WE NEED TO BALANCE OUR CHECKBOOK, OUR BUDGET, AND WE NEED TO DO IT BY JUNE 30. BUT IMPORTANTLY, --

VAL>> -- IS THAT DEADLINE HARD AND FAST? BECAUSE IT SEEMS LIKE THOSE DEADLINES ALWAYS GET MUSHY AND --

PHIL ANGELIDES>> -- WELL, THE SOONER, THE BETTER. I WILL TELL YOU THAT IT’S GOING TO BE INCREASINGLY HARD TO BORROW TO KEEP THE STATE SPENDING GOING IF THERE IS DELAY, DELAY, DELAY.

JESS>> BUT, IN FACT, THEY DON’T REALLY GET SERIOUS ABOUT THE BUDGET IN SACRAMENTO UNTIL MAY.

PHIL ANGELIDES>> WELL, WE OUGHT TO BE SERIOUS ABOUT IT NOW. I DO SEE THIS AS AN EXTRAORDINARY OPPORTUNITY TO TALK ABOUT THE BIG ISSUES. HOW MUCH DO WE WANT TO INVEST IN EDUCATION? IN TRANSPORTATION? THIS IS THE TIME WHEN WE OUGHT TO BE HAVING THAT ROBUST DEBATE. MY VIEW IS THAT WE OUGHT TO DO IT QUICKLY, BUT WE OUGHT TO DO IT WELL. I DON’T WANT A BALANCED BUDGET THAT JUST SLASHES EDUCATION. WE CAN’T BE PENNY-WISE AND POUND-FOOLISH. EVERY DOLLAR WE DON’T SPEND ON EDUCATION WILL BE A DOLLAR OR MANY TIMES OVER WE’LL SPEND IN THE FUTURE. OUR PRISON BUDGET HAS GONE FROM $400 MILLION DOLLARS A YEAR IN 1982 TO $5.3 BILLION DOLLARS A YEAR NOW. EITHER SPEND WELL AT THE FRONT END AND MAKE INVESTMENTS, OR YOU DO PAY AS A SOCIETY LATER.

VAL>> WE’RE GOING TO HAVE TO MAKE SOME CUTS SOMEWHERE, EVEN IF WE KEEP EDUCATION THE SAME WAY, EVEN IF WE RAISE TAXES, ACCORDING TO YOU, ON THE MORE WEALTHY AND AFFLUENT FOLKS. BUT IF WE’RE GOING TO HAVE TO CUT, WHERE WOULD YOU CUT?

PHIL ANGELIDES>> WELL, LET ME TELL YOU, I DO THINK WE SHOULD TRIM THE SIZE OF THE STATE WORKFORCE. I DO THINK WE OUGHT TO LOOK --

VAL>> -- NOT TEACHERS, THOUGH.

PHIL ANGELIDES>> LET ME JUST BE CLEAR. I THINK, JUST LIKE I WAS IN BUSINESS IN THE TOUGH TIMES IN THE RECESSION IN THE 1991, 1992, 1993 PERIOD, YOU CUT ALL THOSE THINGS THAT ARE LOWER PRIORITY. THEN YOU’VE GOT TO ASK YOURSELF WHAT ARE THE MOST IMPORTANT THINGS WE DO? AND THE STATE’S MOST IMPORTANT FUNCTIONS ARE TO CREATE ECONOMIC PROSPERITY FOR THE FUTURE, WHICH MEANS INVESTING IN EDUCATION AND INFRASTRUCTURE LIKE TRANSPORTATION, PARKS, COMMUNITY CENTERS, THINGS THAT ENRICH OUR COMMUNITIES. THEN DOWN FURTHER ON THE PRIORITY LIST IS WHERE YOU’VE GOT TO FIND THE CUTS. BUT I’LL BE CLEAR. NO ONE IN THEIR RIGHT MIND, EXCEPT FOR SOME OUT-OF-TOUCH, IDEOLOGICAL REPUBLICANS WHO ARE JUST DOING POLITICAL GAMES, BELIEVES YOU CAN BALANCE THIS BUDGET ON CUTS ALONE.

JESS>> WE’RE NOT TEETERING ON BANKRUPTCY, YOU INSIST, AND YET WALL STREET DOESN’T LOOK KINDLY ON CALIFORNIA AT THE MOMENT AND THEY HAVE SAID WE’RE NOT AS CREDIT-WORTHY AS WE ONCE WERE. THE STATE TREASURER HAS SOME INTEREST, IF NOT RESPONSIBILITY, FOR THAT.

PHIL ANGELIDES>> WELL, WALL STREET DOES, I THINK, FROWN RIGHT NOW ON THE FACT THAT WE HAVE A BUDGET DEFICIT. WE’RE SPENDING MORE THAN WE’RE TAKING IN. THAT’S NEVER A GOOD STORY TO PRESENT TO A LENDER. WE CAN AND MUST GET THE BUDGET STRUCTURALLY IN PLACE. BUT JUST TO PUT A LITTLE PERSPECTIVE ON THIS, WHILE CALIFORNIA HAS ITS CHALLENGES RIGHT NOW, IN A WORLD OF UNCERTAIN INVESTMENTS, THE STOCK MARKET, INTERNATIONAL INVESTMENTS, CALIFORNIA BONDS STILL LOOK PRETTY DARN GOOD TO A LOT OF INVESTORS. WE’VE NEVER DEFAULTED IN 153 YEARS. WE’RE THE FIFTH BIGGEST ECONOMY IN THE WORLD. SO WHILE WE HAVE OUR CHALLENGES, WE’RE STILL A RELATIVELY GOOD INVESTMENT IN A WORLD OF VERY VOLATILE CHOICES.

JESS>> AND IT CAN SUPPORT EDUCATION.

PHIL ANGELIDES>> WE MUST.

VAL>> STATE TREASURER, PHIL ANGELIDES, THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR TAKING THE TIME TO BE HERE.

PHIL ANGELIDES>> GOOD TO BE WITH YOU.

TO SEND A COMMENT OR A QUESTION TO OUR PROGRAM, YOU CAN REACH US BY MAIL AT THIS ADDRESS:

LIFE AND TIMES
4401 SUNSET BLVD.
LOS ANGELES, CALIFORNIA 90027

YOU CAN ALSO CALL OUR VIEWER COMMENT LINE (323) 953-5555) OR CONTACT US THE FAST WAY BY E-MAIL AT KCET.ORG.

JESS>> MILLIONS OF GRADUATING COLLEGE STUDENTS ARE FACED WITH THE SAME QUESTION. WHAT DO I REALLY WANT TO DO WITH MY LIFE? IF THEY’RE LUCKY, THEY KNOW. BUT MANY ARE IN CAREER LIMBO.

VAL>> WELL, THAT’S WHERE OUR NEXT GUESTS COME IN. WHEN MIKE MARRINER AND NATHAN GEBHARD WERE IN COLLEGE, THEY SKIPPED THE NORMAL SUMMER JOBS AND THEY HIT THE ROAD. THEY INTERVIEWED ALL SORTS OF PEOPLE WHO JUST LOVE THEIR JOBS AND THEY GOT A SENSE OF HOW WE ALL MIGHT FIND OURSELVES. THEY ALSO PUT IT IN A BOOK CALLED “ROAD TRIP NATION: A GUIDE TO DISCOVERING YOUR PATH IN LIFE”. AND NOW NATHAN AND MIKE JOIN US HERE. THANKS FOR BEING HERE, GUYS.

MIKE MARRINER>> THANKS.

JESS>> GENTLEMEN, YOU CAME WITH SOME VERY INTERESTING STORIES, AS YOUR BOOK SUGGESTED, BUT HAVE YOU FOUND YOURSELVES?

MIKE MARRINER>> WE’RE GETTING THERE. I THINK IT’S FUNNY BECAUSE A LOT OF THOSE PEOPLE THAT WE INTERVIEWED SHOWED THAT LIFE ISN’T REALLY ABOUT EVER GETTING TO THAT DESTINATION. IT’S MORE ABOUT THE JOURNEY, SO I CAN’T SAY THAT WE REALLY FOUND OURSELVES, BUT WE’RE KIND OF ON THAT ROAD.

JESS>> IT’S BEEN A GREAT JOURNEY?

MIKE MARRINER>> THAT’S FOR SURE.

NATHAN GEBHARD>> AWE-INSPIRING, NONE THE LESS.

VAL>> AND WE SHOULD SAY, NO, YOU AREN’T RELATED EVEN THOUGH YOU LOOK LIKE IT (LAUGHTER). YOU GUYS HAVE BEEN ON THE ROAD TOGETHER TOO LONG BECAUSE YOU’RE LOOKING LIKE EACH OTHER.

NATHAN GEBHARD>> YOU GROW TOGETHER, I GUESS.

JESS>> SURFER DUDES FROM LAGUNA BEACH (LAUGHTER).

VAL>> OKAY, SO YOU WENT AND YOU HAD TO JUST, WHAT, KNOCK ON PEOPLES’ DOORS? THESE ARE NOT JUST, YOU KNOW, AVERAGE JOES. THESE ARE LIKE CEOS AND SUPREME COURT JUSTICES AND, YOU KNOW, SYMPHONY CONDUCTORS AND SO FORTH. YOU HAD TO JUST TALK THEM INTO TALKING TO YOU?

MIKE MARRINER>> YEAH, IT WAS LIKE BASICALLY GUERILLA COLD-CALLING. I MEAN, WE’D BE LITERALLY AT THAT LOCAL MAGAZINE STAND AND WE’D OPEN UP THE MAGAZINE, LIKE ENTERTAINMENT WEEKLY OR SOMETHING, AND I’D BE READING AN ARTICLE ABOUT BETH MCCARTHY MILLER, WHO’S LIKE THE FIRST FEMALE DIRECTOR OF “SATURDAY NIGHT LIVE”. I READ THIS AWESOME STORY ABOUT HER AND I’M LIKE IT WOULD BE SO NEAT TO SIT DOWN WITH HER, SO 411, NEW YORK, NEW YORK, SATURDAY NIGHT LIVE, YOU KNOW, YOU GET LIKE THE BOTTOM DISPATCH AND YOU JUST KIND OF SHARE YOUR STORY.

VAL>> YOU WORK YOUR WAY UP?

MIKE MARRINER>> YOU WORK YOUR WAY UP, YEAH.

VAL>> AND THEN WHAT DO YOU DO? JUST SHOW UP WITH A VIDEO CAMERA OR DID YOU --

NATHAN GEBHARD>> -- YEAH, THERE WERE FOUR OF US ON THE ROAD TRIP AND WE WOULD LITERALLY WALK IN. I MEAN, WE DIDN’T KNOW HOW TO FILM ANYTHING. I MEAN, WE HAD LITTLE TINY DIGITAL CAMERAS THAT WE’D BOUGHT AT A HOME DEPARTMENT STORE --

JESS>> -- AND YOU DIDN’T KNOW HOW TO USE (LAUGHTER).

VAL>> (LAUGHTER) IN FACT, WE’RE GOING TO SEE JUST HOW TECHNICALLY SOPHISTICATED YOU WERE. HERE’S A CLIP NOW FROM YOUR VIDEO, “ROAD TRIP NATION”.

[FILM CLIP]>> “WHERE I WAS AT EIGHTEEN AND NINETEEN? I WAS TRYING TO PICK A MAJOR, TAKING ALL MY CORE CLASSES, AND THERE JUST WAS NOTHING OF INTEREST. I MEAN, I TRIED ACCOUNTING, I TRIED ECONOMICS. THEY WERE JUST BLAH, BORING. I WAS DOING THIS FOR MY SPENDING MONEY ON THE SIDE, A COUPLE DAYS A WEEK LOBSTERING. I WENT TO COLLEGE AND, WELL, SCHOOL AND LEARNED HOW TO WORK ON COMPUTERS AND GOT A JOB AND DID THE NINE TO FIVE, YES SIR, NO SIR, YOU KNOW? CAN I HAVE A RAISE, SIR? BUT THE WHOLE TIME I WAS DOING IT, I WASN’T HAPPY. I COULDN’T WAIT TO GET DONE WITH IT AND GET BACK OUT HERE. I WOULDN’T DO ANYTHING ELSE, GIVEN THE CHOICE.

>> SO YOU FEEL LUCKY?

>> OH, I KNOW I’M LUCKY.”

JESS>> NOW THAT’S A MAN WHOSE SUCCESS WAS AS A LOBSTERMAN.

NATHAN GEBHARD>> ABSOLUTELY. HE WAS PROBABLY ONE OF THE MORE AWE-INSPIRING INTERVIEWS WE HAD.

VAL>> REALLY? WHY IS THAT?

NATHAN GEBHARD>> WELL, JUST BECAUSE I THINK HE WAS ABSOLUTELY TRUE TO WHAT HE SAID AND WHAT HE WANTED TO DO. YOU KNOW, HE HAD A JOB WORKING ON Y2K COMPLIANCE STUFF AND THE WHOLE TIME HE JUST SAID I CAN’T WAIT TO GET ON THE SEA. SO RUNNING INTO HIM ON THE DOCKS ONE DAY WAS JUST AMAZING TO BE ABLE TO SIT DOWN WITH HIM AND TALK TO HIM ABOUT HIS WHOLE STORY. IT WAS REALLY EXCITING.

JESS>> NOW IN YOUR BOOK, YOU’RE RECOMMENDING THAT OTHERS IN YOUR SAME SITUATION DO EXACTLY WHAT YOU DID.

MIKE MARRINER>> THE OTHER NIGHT, THAT WAS THE BIG --

JESS>> -- NOT NECESSARILY WRITE A BOOK TO COMPETE, BUT --

MIKE MARRINER>> -- OR TO JUMP IN A BIG MOTORHOME, BUT THE REAL MESSAGE IS TO GET OUT THERE AND EXPLORE THE WORLD, AND A GREAT WAY TO DO THAT IS JUST MEET THE PEOPLE. YOU KNOW, PEOPLE FROM ALL WALKS OF LIFE. I MEAN, WHEN YOU’RE YOUNG, YOU’RE FORCED TO FIGURE OUT WHAT YOU WANT TO DO WITH YOUR LIFE RIGHT AWAY. IT’S KIND OF A PARADOX BECAUSE YOU DON’T EVEN KNOW WHAT’S OUT THERE. YOU’RE SO BUSY STUDYING AND BEING IN COLLEGE OR JUST KIND OF WORKING OR WHATEVER THAT YOU DON’T GET THAT EXPOSURE.

I THINK WHAT WE’VE LEARNED AFTER 15,000 MILES ON THE ROAD AND OVER EIGHTY INTERVIEWS IS THAT THE KEY TO KIND OF FINDING YOUR PATH IN LIFE IS JUST EXPLORING AND FIRST SEEING WHAT’S OUT THERE. THEN ONCE YOU HAVE A SENSE OF WHAT’S OUT THERE, THEN YOU CAN KIND OF CONNECT WHAT YOU SEE IS OUT THERE WITH KIND OF WHAT LIGHTS YOU UP AS AN INDIVIDUAL.

VAL>> ANOTHER VERY INTERESTING PERSON THAT YOU INTERVIEWED WAS A COMPOSER FOR THE BOSTON SYMPHONY. WE’RE GOING TO SEE A LITTLE BIT OF A CLIP FROM THAT INTERVIEW RIGHT NOW.

[FILM CLIP]>> “I HAVE A VERY FUNNY STORY WHEN I WAS NINE. I WROTE SOME COMPOSITIONS, YOU KNOW, AS KIDS DO. I JUST WROTE THESE LITTLE THINGS. MY MOTHER PUT THEM IN FOR AN ARTS FESTIVAL IN OUR VILLAGE. EVERYBODY IN ENGLAND, EVERY VILLAGE, HAS AN ARTS FESTIVAL. THE TIME CAME FOR GIVING OUT THE AWARDS AND PRIZES. HE HELD MY COMPOSITIONS ABOVE HIS HEAD AND HE SAID, “THESE COMPOSITIONS ARE SO BAD THAT NOT ONLY CAN I NOT CONSIDER THEM FOR THE COMPETITION, THAT GOES WITHOUT SAYING, BUT THIS YOUNG MAN SHOULD BE DISCOURAGED FROM EVER COMPOSING AGAIN.” THAT’S WHAT HE SAID. SO IT’S IMPORTANT TO KNOW WHAT YOU’RE AFTER. THEN IF YOU KNOW WHAT YOU’RE AFTER AND YOU REALLY WANT IT, THEN YOU DON’T LOOK AROUND WONDERING WHETHER YOU’RE BETTER OR WORSE THAN THE NEXT PERSON BECAUSE IT’S NOT ABOUT THAT. IT’S ABOUT WHAT YOU WANT TO DO.”

JESS>> NOW HE’S AUTOGRAPHING THE RV THAT YOU TOURED THE COUNTRY IN?

MIKE MARRINER>> YEAH, THAT WAS WHAT ROAD TRIP TRADITION IS, THAT EVERYONE WE INTERVIEWED SIGNED THE CEILING OF THE MOTORHOME. THE GUY WHO DECODED THE HUMAN GENOME PUT HIS ACTUAL REPORT FROM JOURNAL OF SCIENCE UP ON THE CEILING.

NATHAN GEBHARD>> WE GOT A SNOWBOARD FROM BURTON’S SNOWBOARDS UP THERE (LAUGHTER).

JESS>> YOU STILL HAVE THE RV, OBVIOUSLY?

NATHAN GEBHARD>> YES, WE DO. IT’S IN THE SHOP RIGHT NOW, BUT IT’S STILL GOING.

VAL>> I HEARD YOU HAD SOME CLOSE CALLS IN THAT RV.

NATHAN GEBHARD>> ABSOLUTELY.

VAL>> WHAT HAPPENED?

NATHAN GEBHARD>> WELL, THE GOOD STORY IS THAT THE FIRST DAY WE LEFT, IT FIRST OF ALL DIDN’T START. THEN IN THE MIDDLE OF THE FIRST WEEK, WE’RE DRIVING DOWN THE STREETS OF SAN FRANCISCO AND A MOTORCYCLIST COMES UP TO US, KNOCKS ON THE WINDOW, AND SAYS DO YOU KNOW YOUR TRAILER’S ALMOST BROKEN IN HALF? WE HAD NO IDEA. WE GOT OUTSIDE AND ALL THE BEAMS WERE BROKEN. I MEAN, IT WAS JUST LIKE WE WERE ALMOST DRAGGING THIS THING. SO WE LITERALLY HAD TO CHAIN IT TO A TREE AND GO TO OUR INTERVIEW WITH THE GUY THAT DID THE SPECIAL EFFECTS FOR “ET” AND “STAR WARS” RIGHT AFTER.

MIKE MARRINER>> ALL THOSE PROBLEMS.

NATHAN GEBHARD>> AMAZING.

JESS>> ONE OF THE CAREERS YOU’RE NOT GOING TO CHOOSE IS AUTO MECHANICS, I TAKE IT? (LAUGHTER)

NATHAN GEBHARD>> IT COULD BE A GOOD CAREER (LAUGHTER).

MIKE MARRINER>> NAT AND I, I THINK, WE PUT INTO THIS.

JESS>> OKAY, YOU MUST HAVE HAD FAMILY PRESSURES TO COME ON AND GET SERIOUS AND DO WHAT YOU KNOW YOU SHOULD DO.

VAL>> TIME FOR LAW SCHOOL? OR DO YOU KNOW?

MIKE MARRINER>> I THINK IT WAS DEFINITELY WHEN WE WERE IN COLLEGE GETTING READY TO GRADUATE, I MEAN, I WAS PRE MED GETTING READY TO GO TO MEDICAL SCHOOL. MY WHOLE FAMILY WAS IN MEDICINE AND THAT’S, AGAIN, THE EXPOSURE THING. YOU KNOW, YOU ONLY KNOW WHAT YOU KNOW, SO NATURALLY IT’S JUST EASIER TO JUMP INTO THAT. BUT IT’S GETTING EASIER NOW, YOU KNOW. WE HAVE A BOOK (LAUGHTER).

JESS>> (LAUGHTER) WE’RE ABOUT OUT OF TIME, BUT I CANNOT RESIST. YOU TALKED TO ALL THESE SUCCESSFUL PEOPLE ABOUT HOW THEY GOT AHEAD AND, IN YOUR SPECIAL THANKS, YOU THANK A GUY NAMED NOAH BUTKISS? (LAUGHTER) IS THAT THE WAY YOU GET AHEAD?

MIKE MARRINER>> THAT’S HIS REAL NAME (LAUGHTER).

VAL>> IT’S HIS REAL NAME? OH, MY GOSH.

NATHAN GEBHARD>> HE’S ACTUALLY A DESIGNER FOR BURTON’S SNOWBOARDS.

JESS>> WAY TO GO, NOAH (LAUGHTER). THE BOOK IS CALLED “ROAD TRIP NATION: A GUIDE TO DISCOVERING YOUR PATH IN LIFE”.

VAL>> AND BEFORE WE LEAVE YOU TONIGHT, WE THOUGHT THAT WE’D WANT TO GIVE YOU JUST A TASTE OF A STORY THAT WE’RE PLANNING FOR NEXT WEEK. IT’S ALL ABOUT THE UPCOMING LOS ANGELES DEBUT OF “THE PRODUCERS”.

JESS>> THAT’S MEL BROOKS’ MUSICAL COMEDY. THE PRESS TURNED OUT TO SEE THE NEW STARS, JASON ALEXANDER AND MARTIN SHORT. BUT TO NO ONE’S SURPRISE, MEL BROOKS DOMINATED THE MOMENT.

MEL BROOKS>> “THESE GUYS WERE BORN TO PLAY THESE PARTS EMOTIONALLY, SPIRITUALLY AND PHYSICALLY. I MEAN, IT’S A TRUE GOOSEBUMP THRILL TO WATCH THESE GUYS IN ACTION. GET TICKETS NOW. THIS IS NOT A JOKE BECAUSE HERE’S WHAT’S GOING TO HAPPEN. THIS IS NOT HYPE. THIS IS TRUTH. PEOPLE ARE GOING TO SEE THE SHOW AND THEY’RE GOING TO SAY, HEY, THEY’RE SURPRISINGLY GOOD, YOU KNOW? I THINK THEY’RE BETTER -- HEY, THEY’RE -- HEY, AND THEY’RE GOING TO STAND UP AND GIVING STANDING OVATIONS, I PROMISE YOU. THEN THEY’RE GOING TO SAY -- EVERYBODY HAS A CELL PHONE. CALL JAKE, CALL TILLY, AND WE’RE GOING BACK. AND THEY WILL GO BACK. THE FIRST AUDIENCE THAT SEES THE SHOW WILL SEE IT FIFTY-FIVE TIMES. THERE WILL BE NOBODY ELSE BUT THAT AUDIENCE. THEY’LL KEEP GOING BACK. TRUE. I’M TELLING YOU. PEOPLE ARE GOING TO SEE THE SHOW MORE THAN THEM.”

VAL>> (LAUGHTER) “THE PRODUCERS” OPENS AT THE PANTAGES NEXT MONTH. YOU CAN SEE OUR STORY ON IT NEXT WEDNESDAY. IN THE MEANTIME, CHECK OUT OUR NEW AND IMPROVED WEBSITE AT KCET.ORG.

JESS>> AND THAT’S OUR BROADCAST FOR THIS EVENING. NOW FOR ALL OF US HERE AT LIFE AND TIMES, THANK YOU AND GOOD NIGHT.

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