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Life & Times Transcript
08/02/05 Val Zavala>> Tonight on Life and Times -- Can we dig our way out of our traffic problems? Is building a ten-mile tunnel a crazy idea or a real solution? Art Brown>> I kind of hope that we do do the tunnel. I'd like to travel that way. Be able to just get on a road through a tunnel and end up in Riverside County thirty minutes later with no problem? That would be nice. Val>> And then, it's history told for the ear. We listen to Los Angeles's audio heritage from California music to symphonic concerts. These stories and more next on tonight's Life and Times. Life and Times is made possible through the generous support of the L.K. Whittier Foundation dedicated to improving the quality of life by supporting innovative endeavors in the fields of medicine, health, science and education. And by a generous grant from Jim and Anne Rothenberg. Val>> New York has the Lincoln Tunnel. England has the "chunnel". So why shouldn't Orange County have its own traffic tunnel? It's not just a crazy idea. It's a real proposal and, if it's built, this tunnel would be the longest traffic tunnel in the United States. As Orange County reporter, Roger Cooper, tells us, it will take a dramatic step to help relieve Orange County's freeway congestion. Roger Cooper>> There are those of us who spend huge chunks of our lives on the 91 Freeway. Ten hours, even twenty hours, of precious time a week just trying to get in and out of the Inland Empire, trying to reach jobs in Orange County or Los Angeles. A quarter of a million people every day, all attempting to squeeze through the Santa Ana Canyon, all at the same time, and it keeps getting worse. Art Brown>> Well, if we don't do something, freeways speeds will drop by fifty percent. Wes Bannister>> Every time I get on the 91, I say there's got to be a better way. Tony Rahimian>> Our projections show that we need at least fifty more percent capacity on State Route 91 in order to stay ahead of the growth. Roger Cooper>> Even the Vice Chairman of the Orange County Transportation Authority shares the pain. Art Brown>> I'm just happy the Toll Road is there because I couldn't get through otherwise. I've got the transponder and I take the Toll Road all the time. Without that, I look over at the other side and see traffic at a dead stop. Roger Cooper>> But there is a man who sees light at the end of the tunnel. Actually, he sees a tunnel. Stated very simply, it's your opinion that you can't continue to go through the canyon. You can't go on 74, so what do you do? Bill Vardoulis>> There's only one thing left. You have to under the mountain. Roger Cooper>> Bill Vardoulis is an engineer, a former mayor of Irvine. For years now, he's tried to convince anyone who would listen that the best answer to the 91's congestion, perhaps the only answer, is to go underground right through the mountain, a tunnel through Orange County. Bill, when lots of people hear you propose building a tunnel through the mountain in Orange County, they look at you like you're crazy. Bill Vardoulis>> Yeah. In this country, again, we're twenty, thirty, maybe fifty years behind the rest of the world when you look at the tunnels that are being throughout the world. Roger Cooper>> Vardoulis envisions three tubes as much as forty-five feet wide buried deep underground ten to twelve miles long. Under the proposal, the tunnel would be dug into the mountain here in the Inland Empire at a spot just south of Corona up Interstate 15. The tunnel would come out of the mountain over here in Orange County. Only fifteen minutes after leaving the Inland Empire, drivers would be on the eastern tollway linking up with the 5 at the Irvine Spectrum and taking pressure off of other freeways. Vardoulis says it won't be as difficult to build as the "chunnel", as they call it, under the English Channel. Bill Vardoulis>> They really think not only is it daunting, it would take forever. Well, yeah, if you people out there with picks and shovels digging the tunnel. But with the new technology, with tunnel boring machines, you start at each end and you go ten to twelve miles, five or six each, and you meet in the middle hopefully. So you're not looking at a real long construction period. Very, very short, very quick. They did the tunnel under the English Channel, start to finish, thirty-two miles. They had the tunnel done in three years. Roger Cooper>> That was boring the tunnel. The full chunnel construction took seven years. Bill Vardoulis>> And that was thirty-two miles, about three times the magnitude of what we've talking about here. Roger Cooper>> Over the past five years, Vardoulis has appeared before more than a hundred civic groups trying to get people to listen to his tunnel idea and he's beginning to be heard in high places. That just-passed federal highway bill contains more than 15.8 million for the Riverside-Orange Corridor Authority to study the tunnel, money local Congressmen Cox, Miller and Calvert went to bat for. Transportation Authorities for Orange and Riverside Counties are nearing the end of an eighteen-month study into what to do about 91 congestion. For those who think the tunnel idea is crazy, there's another proposal. Engineering consultant Tony Rahimian says it would add two new lanes to the 91. Tony Rahimian>> Also adding an elevated structure with a six-lane capacity over or beside the railroad tracks through the Santa Ana Canyon just immediately north of the 91 Freeway. Also improving Ortega Highway to a four-lane facility from the existing two-lane. Roger Cooper>> The other two alternatives would also add lanes to the 91 and the Ortega Highway and build Bill Vardoulis's tunnel. As an engineer, is this a doable thing? People think of tunnels as really big projects. Tony Rahimian>> Right. Well, as engineers, we believe everything is doable (laughter). If you throw enough money at it, just about everything is doable. Art Brown>> It may turn out that the tunnel isn't possible after we do the geotechnical studies, so we've got to have the other options open. Roger Cooper>> The tunnel is not just for cars and trucks. It could also carry utilities, phone, electric and water pipes. In fact, the tunnel just got a major boost from the Metropolitan Water District of Southern California. Chairman Wes Bannister says MWD would help pay for the tunnel if they could run a water pipe through it. Wes Bannister>> So this is an opportune time to do that and, if we could join with the transportation people to put in a tunnel that would accommodate both, it would just be a synergistic thing that would work for everybody. Save a lot of money and provide a lot of services. Roger Cooper>> And you're willing to put some of your money where your mouth is on this? Wes Bannister>> Absolutely, absolutely. Roger Cooper>> A lot of people hear a tunnel, they think that's kind of a crazy idea. To you, this is a serious proposition. Wes Bannister>> Absolutely. We're in the process right now of doing a tunnel all the way from -- well, in the San Bernardino Mountains, an equal length for this tunnel, it will bring water from Lake Pyramid all the way down to DBL. Right now, we're in the process of building those. Roger Cooper>> So how would we pay for it? Vardoulis believes the three to five billion to build the traffic tunnel could be offset by tolls and payments from utilities running through the tube. He'd like to see the tunnel include high-speed light rails. Bill Vardoulis>> You can buy your ticket and get your boarding pass in Irvine and fly, let's say, out of Ontario. It would be a benefit to Ontario and would be a benefit to everybody in Orange County. Roger Cooper>> Can you personally imagine getting on a tunnel and going to Riverside County? Art Brown>> After looking at the plans and studying this for the last almost a year now I've been on the committee, yes, I can. I kind of hope that we do do the tunnel. I'd like to travel that way. Roger Cooper>> Can you envision yourself in your car with your family here in Orange County driving into the Santa Ana Mountain? Tony Rahimian>> Well, I certainly can and I hope that I live long enough to do that. That's definitely going to be a challenging project and, again, maybe I should emphasize that the tunnel by no means has been picked. It's one option out of many that we're looking at, but it is a promising alternative and it does make sense. Roger Cooper>> If you had to bet in a few years from now, will there be a tunnel through the Santa Ana Mountain? Wes Bannister>> Well, we're talking politics, so I think there's probably a lot involved. I would say yes. I would think that it's the only thing that really makes sense. Roger Cooper>> A man who believes in tunnels is giving us something to think about and anyone driving the 91 has plenty of time for that. In Orange County, I'm Roger Cooper for Life and Times. Val>> So what's the next step? Transportation officials will be recommending one alternative or the other sometime in the fall and, don't worry, the public will have a chance to respond. Kcet.org is the place to look for the very latest on Life and Times. You'll find previews of upcoming stories, transcripts and audio of past episodes and links to some of our most interesting features. Just go to kcet.org and click on "Life and Times". Val>> Remember all those stories about crack babies and how they were going to grow up to be damaged and dysfunctional adults? Well, those dire predictions turned out to be wrong. Well, now there's a new term: meth babies, as in methamphetamines. Could it be another case of media exaggeration? The experts say yes and they're trying to get the term purged from the headlines. Richard Rawson studies addictive drugs for UCLA's Integrated Substance Abuse Program. He is among eighty-five researchers, psychologists and doctors who have signed an open letter to major news organizations urging them to stop using the term "meth babies". They say the term lacks scientific validity and shouldn't be used. I talked with Richard Rawson about methamphetamines, or speed, and what the real impact is on fetuses and infants. You're going to say something that a lot of people will not believe or will consider counter-intuitive and that is basically that there is no such thing as a crack baby, there's no such thing as a meth baby. After all these years we've been reading about these young kids, what's going on? Richard Rawson>> Well, the information about the effects of drugs when taken by women when they're pregnant has a lot of emotion associated with it. We do know that it's not a good thing to do. We do know there's plenty of data that drug use by women affects them, affects their health and can affect the fetus. But what's happened is, in some cases, what happened in the eighties around crack cocaine and what's happening today around methamphetamines are these rumors that the use of drugs by women when pregnant produces babies, produces children, who are somehow damaged permanently and are never going to be able to function, and that's not correct. Val>> There's no scientific evidence to show that there are long-term effects from either crack or meth? Richard Rawson>> There are some data that we're just starting to collect on methamphetamines that shows that babies born to women who used cocaine or methamphetamines during their pregnancy are slightly lighter at birth rate, have a smaller head size, do have some increased startle response. It's not as though the drugs don't affect the fetus at all. It does affect the fetus and you can see some effects long-term, but the rumors and the hysteria about the fact that crack babies or meth babies are people that aren't going to be able to be functional people, there's no evidence of that at all. Val>> And this is after many years of research? Richard Rawson>> With crack cocaine, we've been studying this now for about fifteen years. With methamphetamines, we have a study currently in place where we've looked at kids now who are one and two years old. Although we can see some effects, the effects are relatively modest and do appear to be reversible and these children, for the most part, are doing quite well. Val>> So it's this kind of hysteria that you're trying to cut off at the pass before it gets too far. So you and a large group of professionals, doctors, scientists, are putting out the word and trying to get the media not to go in that direction? Richard Rawson>> Yeah, I think the point of what we're trying to do is to get people to look at the real information, to look at the science, to look at the data that we have and not make hysterical over-reactions because these over-reactions affect policies. If people think that the effects of methamphetamine prenatally are producing dramatic, horrific effects on the children that are born, pretty soon you see initiatives come up that want to see women arrested and put in jail and have children taken away from them forever if they've ever had any evidence of meth use at all. We think these kinds of policies are based on bad information. Val>> In fact, there are some cases where murder charges have been brought against women who have taken meth while they're pregnant? Richard Rawson>> There's one case in Riverside that's currently underway. There was a case in Honolulu, Hawaii where a woman was convicted of murder for delivering a baby who was born dead. She had been using methamphetamines. Now that's currently on appeal and they're currently reviewing the medical data and many of the experts are saying there's no evidence that it was the meth use per se that caused the fatality of the baby. Val>> It could have been a lot of things. Richard Rawson>> It could have been a lot of things. I mean, meth use is usually only one of a bunch of things going on during a situation. Again, it's not to downplay the seriousness. I mean, it's a very serious thing and it's definitely not a good thing for women to do when they're pregnant. But the policy about how severe it is and what policy should come from that should be based on accurate information, not hysteria. Val>> What is the difference between crack babies and meth babies? Crack babies came up in the public consciousness about, what, fifteen or twenty years ago? Richard Rawson>> Right. Val>> And now meth babies. Is there a difference? Richard Rawson>> Well, in most of the United States, we saw large increases in cocaine use and crack use during the late eighties and early nineties and we started seeing a lot of women deliver babies that had been prenatally exposed to cocaine. There was a lot of exposure of that problem, newspaper headlines, Newsweek and Time Magazines, and a lot of concern. A lot of that attention occurred in the major urban centers of the east coast where crack cocaine was a real problem. Meth is much more of a rural drug. It's been a drug that is infested in small communities, suburban communities throughout the west, and now the midwest and the south. Val>> And here in the Inland Empire. Richard Rawson>> Oh, the Inland Empire, the San Joaquin Valley. California still is the capital for methamphetamine production and use. I mean, we've had this problem for some time, but it's affected communities that didn't really see a lot of the crack cocaine epidemic. So we're revisiting the same problem with methamphetamine that we had fifteen years ago with crack cocaine. Val>> Now if you say, well, there's really no such thing as a crack baby or meth baby, yet we see video or we have seen many times little babies shaking and they seem to be in withdrawal. What's going on there? Richard Rawson>> Well, many of the pictures of babies in withdrawal or looking distressed like that often come from pictures of heroin. Heroin babies do go through severe withdrawal, so that is a significant medical concern. I'm sure it can occur with women who have taken stimulants, including cocaine and methamphetamine, but in general, they're also using a lot of other things. They tend to be using a lot of alcohol. They tend to be using a lot of marijuana and nicotine. Their diets have been very bad. The babies that are born to women who have been abusing drugs and in that lifestyle, there are a lot of factors that go into it. Val>> Now some of the reports that the letter from your group of scientists and doctors cite are the Los Angeles Times, CBS News, CNN, ABC, very credible news sources. Where are they getting their information if it's not right? These are very, you know, respected news sources. Richard Rawson>> If you go to any nursery or any hospital where babies are born and some of the women are using methamphetamine, you'll be able to find cases and anecdotal information of pregnancies where obviously the baby has been affected by bad prenatal care or by the fact that the woman hasn't taken care of herself or has used methamphetamine and all sorts of other drugs. You can find a case where there is that situation, so they tend to over-emphasize or highlight those real serious problem cases. But many of these reports imply that, because this is all a bad thing, these children are going to be permanently damaged and they're going to be permanently defective as the result of the exposure prenatally. That's just not supported by the science. We do want to see people respond to the needs of the children, to respond with treatment to the women and have good policy that is benefiting both the mother and the child, but not to be based on hysteria and based on misinformation that's been generated so far. Val>> Well, Dr. Rawson, we wish you all the best of luck and thank you for your efforts. Richard Rawson>> Thank you very much. To send a comment or a question to our program, you can reach us by mail at this address: Life and Times 4401 Sunset Blvd. Los Angeles, California 90027 You can also call our viewer comment line (323) 953-5555) or contact us the fast way by e-mail at kcet.org. Val>> You can look at Southern California through a variety of prisms: economics, demographics and, of course, politics. But have you ever thought about our musical history? It stretches from Native American songs to jazz. Vicki Curry talked with the University of La Verne professor, Kenneth Marcus, about his new book, "Musical Metropolis". Vicki Curry>> Ken Marcus, you put together a book and a companion CD called "Musical Metropolis: Los Angeles and a Creation of a Music Culture, 1880 to 1940". So you were focusing on really putting together a musical history of Los Angeles. Is that right? Kenneth Marcus>> That's right, and it's also a social history, a cultural history. It's trying to provide historical and social context in which that music was created, which was a part of Los Angeles's culture. I wanted to show how a study of music was really a reflection of a study of the city itself, that the development of that music reflected the development of the city. So that diversity and decentralization were very much a part of the development of the city, they were also very much a part of the city's music. Downtown would have been a thriving theater district and yet, at the same time, you have these very important, I think, developments in the suburbs in Pasadena, in San Gabriel, in Hollywood, in Boyle Heights, where each one of these areas has music, music groups, musical offerings that are at least as important, I think, as what's going on downtown. Vicki Curry>> One example from this period is, as you mentioned, Rosa and Luisa Villa and their family. You have a recording on your CD, one of the earliest recordings known. Is that correct? Kenneth Marcus>> That's right. Charles Loomis was a big city booster and there's the Loomis home right downtown off the 110. He got a wax cylinder recording machine and he went out across the southwest and recorded hundreds of different people, mainly Native American tribes, but also quite a few Hispanic singers, performers, musicians, guitarists and so forth. One group that he recorded was the Rosa and Luisa Villa sisters. I think they harmonized so nicely together because they grew up playing music together. The brothers and sisters were a musical family. So it's the kind of music that was extremely common in the nineteenth century and the early twentieth century throughout Los Angeles. They sing and they accompany themselves on guitars. Vicki Curry>> Oh, wow. And this recording is from 1904. It's called "La Serenata". Let's take a listen. [Film Clip] Vicki Curry>> Another local musician that probably many of us have never heard about from this era is Jose Arias and you have a recording of his as well. Even though he got started in the teens, he had quite a long career. Kenneth Marcus>> That's right. He immigrated from Mexico in 1910 and he came out and played the guitar and he wanted to teach and to perform. That was his love. He got into the film industry and silent pictures and also was in the talkies. He performed throughout the southwest. This recording is from 1949. It's the only known recording of Jose Arias and his band called the Jose Arias Troubadours. It's the type of music that was common for the area, the early California music with strong emphasis on guitars, mandolins, and violins. There are essentially no horns. Vicki Curry>> Great. Let's take a listen. [Film Clip] Vicki Curry>> Moving on, then, to the 1920's, we get to the jazz era which many of us have heard about. Tell me more about Central Avenue. Kenneth Marcus>> Well, Central Avenue was certainly at the heart of that. African-Americans who were migrating to Los Angeles mainly from the south, and Kid Ory came through there and he formed a band of musicians that he met. He came out in 1919. Vicki Curry>> And Kid Ory recorded a song here in 1922, "Ory's Creole Trombone", and it was quite significant. Kenneth Marcus>> Yes, Andrew Nordskog set up his studio in Santa Monica and went out and got a variety of different composers, performers and so on to try out this acoustic recording machine and he invited Kid Ory to come and perform a few tracks. So this one is the first known recording of an African-American jazz band west of the Mississippi, 1922. [Film Clip] Vicki Curry>> Now you spend quite a bit of time talking about the Hollywood Bowl. Kenneth Marcus>> Well, the Hollywood Bowl really was founded as sort of a multi-purpose arts center, so they were really trying to make it a community center in the 1920's to try to reflect some of the musical diversity of the region. The Los Angeles Philharmonic which used the Hollywood Bowl as its summer residence -- Vicki Curry>> -- and still does. Kenneth Marcus>> And still does -- linked up with Eugene Goossens who was a British conductor. He conducted Dvorak's "Carnival Overture". RCA set up sort of a makeshift recording studio, mobile recording studio, and recorded what is believed to be the first outdoor symphonic performance in 1928. [Film Clip] Kenneth Marcus>> The people saw that, out here, there would be fewer regulations, fewer limitations, that somehow the west would be a more free place, so that attracted musicians as it attracted composers and it attracted many other people. Especially, I think, composers found that they could come out here and try to be part of a very different kind of music culture than they saw in the midwest or on the east coast that is extremely diverse and that it really is spread out over such a large area. You did not have to go downtown to hear music. Really that music was really taking place throughout the entire region. Vicki Curry>> Ken Marcus, author of "Musical Metropolis", thank you for taking the time to speak with us. Kenneth Marcus>> Oh, it's my pleasure. I enjoyed it very much. Val>> And that's our program. I'm Val Zavala. For everyone at Life and Times, thanks for watching. We'll see you next time. Life and Times was made possible through the generous support of the L.K. Whittier Foundation dedicated to improving the quality of life by supporting innovative endeavors in the fields of medicine, health, science and education. And by a generous grant from Jim and Anne Rothenberg. Val>> Next time on Life and Times -- They go door to door to improve life in their neighborhood, but are they welcomed? >> They are very cute, because they like children coming to talk about this issue. It's like a cute thing, but we also get people that slam the door and that's important for the kids to learn. You know, that not everybody is willing to hear the message. Val>> That's tomorrow on Life and Times. Sponsored in part by:  | |
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