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Life & Times Transcript
12/07/06 Coverage of Town Hall Los Angeles speakers on Life and Times is made possible by a grant from the Boeing Company. Val Zavala>> Tonight on Life and Times -- Did a firehouse prank lead to the resignation of Los Angeles's fire chief or was it a history of discrimination? Captain Jerry Thomas>> We've had women injured. We've had black men, you know, dehumanized in terms of verbal abuse. You know, we've had people called names with impunity in terms of the "N" word. Val Zavala>> And then, a film that may make you think twice about diamonds for Christmas. Did it put our critics in a joyous mood? It's all straight ahead on tonight's Life and Times. Announcer>> Life and Times is made possible through the generous support of the L.K. Whittier Foundation dedicated to improving the quality of life by supporting innovative endeavors in the fields of medicine, health, science and education. And by a generous grant from Jim and Anne Rothenberg. Val Zavala>> It all started as a fire station prank and it's blown up into a racial discrimination lawsuit, public outcry, political feuding and the resignation of a fire chief. It has also put a spotlight on hazing practices inside the Los Angeles Fire Department. Sam Louie takes a look at the tumultuous event that all started with a can of dog food. Sam Louie>> Los Angeles city fire officials have been trying to quench the flames of a political firestorm embroiling the department. The City Council approved a $2.7 million dollar settlement for firefighter, Tennie Pierce. It all started two years ago when Pierce's colleagues served dog food in his spaghetti. They considered it a prank, but Pierce sued the city claiming it was racism. Tennie Pierce>> "This is wrong and if four black firemen did it to a white fireman, I would stand up for the white fireman and say it's wrong because that's the kind of person I am." Sam Louie>> Shortly after the approved settlement, these pictures were posted on KFI's radio website. They showed Tennie Pierce also participating in similar pranks and hazing rituals more than ten years ago. The pictures influenced Mayor Antonio Villaraigosa to promptly veto the settlement. Some members of the City Council tried to overturn the mayor's veto, but failed. Councilman Greig Smith, who represents the San Fernando Valley, was among the nine who voted to throw out the settlement. Councilman Greig Smith>> When I saw the pictures, I was livid, livid as to the nature of the pictures, which changed for me the entire basis of the case and it was that Mr. Pierce was really the instigator of the things that he was claiming he was a victim of. Sam Louie>> Councilman Smith says he did not consider the dog food prank enough to constitute racism, but he's in no way defending the firefighters. Councilman Greig Smith>> We have to get the message out there that it's not acceptable behavior anymore and we're not going to stand for it and there will be repercussions if anybody participates in it. Sam Louie>> The firefighters in question, including two captains, were suspended for a month without pay. Pierce plans to take his case to court. In the meantime, the incident casts a spotlight on the issue of bias and discrimination in the LAFD. Tennie Pierce>> "And the city did not step up. They didn't step up. Bring in the advocates and investigate. We wouldn't be here today. We would not be here today if the advocates would have came in. They turned the advocates away." Sam Louie>> Three days after Pierce's appearance before the City Council, Fire Chief William Bamattre announced his resignation. William Bamattre>> "I have become the focus of the debate and that is to the detriment of the LAFD. I will not allow that to continue." Sam Louie>> Some of his close colleagues were in shock that the chief stepped down after eleven years at the top. Tim Manning>> I'm disappointed that it has happened. Again, I think Chief Bamattre was a great fire chief and has taken us a great distance. Sam Louie>> Assistant Chief, Tim Manning, served as Chief of Staff during part of Bamattre's term. Tim Manning>> He developed a five-year plan and nearly doubled the amount of ambulances that we have serving the community. Captain Jerry Thomas>> "But back at the fire station, that's where we have the problem." Sam Louie>> But others are quick to voice their opposition. Captain Jerry Thomas, in a telephone interview to a radio show, denounced what he considers a department deeply entrenched in racism and sexism. Captain Jerry Thomas>> "We've had some really egregious things that happened to people in this. They've really been injured. We're talking about physically, psychologically, emotionally." Sam Louie>> Captain Thomas joined the department thirty-one years ago and rose through the ranks. During his career, he says he's seen his fair share of discrimination cases crop up even after the city instituted a zero tolerance policy. Captain Jerry Thomas>> We've had zero tolerance in existence for ten years, but that didn't stop the hazing and discrimination, you know, and the misogynistic attitude about women, you know, defecating in female showers and urinating in female mouthwashes. Sam Louie>> The Los Angeles Fire Department is fifty percent white, almost a third Latino, twelve percent black, and just under three percent women. Captain Jerry Thomas>> We've had women injured. We've had black men, you know, dehumanized in terms of verbal abuse. You know, we've had people called names with impunity in terms of the "N" word. Niggers, to be more specific, and chief officers covering it up. "This is when I made Captain. Some of my peers gave me this in appreciation." Sam Louie>> But even as a fire captain, he was not immune from discrimination. Several years ago, he filed a lawsuit against the city for defamation of character. Specifically, he says there was false information put into his performance review. Captain Jerry Thomas>> I felt betrayed because of my work ethic. I've always gotten excellent evaluations. I take pride in how I handle my people. Sam Louie>> Thomas says that his superiors did not look into his complaint. He eventually settled out of court for an undisclosed amount of money. Captain Jerry Thomas>> We have cases and cases after cases of chief officers turning a blind eye because they don't want to deal with the problems of the fire department. Sam Louie>> The problems were outlined in a recent city audit which found that more than eighty percent of those surveyed reported being harassed or being aware of harassment. However, critics consider the survey unreliable. Less than a quarter of all minorities and women in the fire department responded. One of the critics is John McDuffie. He's with the United Firefighters of Los Angeles, the union that represents the city's fire department. John McDuffie>> If you look at it, a very small percentage of women and a very small percentage of minorities responded to that survey. So to say that there is a problem in the fire department, yeah. We have problems that we need to overcome just like any other organization, but to label it as rampant is just incorrect and the audit did not reflect what the fire department really looks like. Sam Louie>> He disputes that there is a culture of prejudice, but McDuffie acknowledges that, out of a total of thirty-six hundred firefighters, there are going to be a few who get out of line. John McDuffie>> What you see are occasions of racial insensitivity just like you'd see in any other organization. It just so happens because we have the public trust that, when we occasionally make mistakes, those mistakes become public and people feel as though it might be rampant. Sam Louie>> To help steer the department back on course, Assistant Fire Chief Douglas Barry was appointed by the mayor to take over as Interim Chief. Barry is the first African American to run the city's fire department. Mayor Antonio Villaraigosa>> "The leadership will help set a new tone to extinguish the incendiary practices of hazing and harassment that has plagued the department for some time." Sam Louie>> McDuffie feels the new chief could go a long way in restoring the department's reputation. John McDuffie>> We have a grand opportunity to make the correct changes or make changes that are going to benefit not only the members of the fire department, but the citizens of Los Angeles. Sam Louie>> Bamattre announced that his last day will be December 31 and, after three decades with the city, leaving under such difficult circumstances was painful. William Bamattre>> "I want to thank all the firefighters and my family. Thank you." Sam Louie>> This whole episode has been difficult for the department, city officials and the public. But in the end, it could be a defining moment for the department leading to real reform. Councilman Greig Smith>> It's an ugly chapter, I think, for Los Angeles, but in the long run, things will come out better and what's going to come out better is we're going to put a whole new system in play that's going to resolve these issues and stop it. Sam Louie>> I'm Sam Louie for Life and Times. Val Zavala>> So what do you think of the firefighter controversy? We'd love to hear your opinion and you can post it on our Blog. Just go to kcet.org and click on the Life and Times Blog. Announcer>> Kcet.org is the place to look for the very latest on Life and Times. You'll find previews of upcoming stories, plus transcripts and audio of past episodes and links to some of our most interesting features. Just go to kcet.org, scroll down the page and click on "Life and Times". Val Zavala>> Forty-six million Americans do not have health insurance. That's sixteen percent of our population. And some people say that health care will be a major issue in the 2008 presidential election. That would be just fine with Tommy Thompson. He's thinking of running for president. Thompson is the former Secretary of Health and Human Services under Bush, a former Governor of Wisconsin and a Republican. He's currently working in the private sector as a health care policy consultant. I asked him what he would do to fix America's health care system. Tommy Thompson>> The first thing we have to do is understand it. Understand it, then you're a long way towards solving it. To understand it, I always tell people that you would never really put together a health care system like we have today. Val Zavala>> No. You meaning starting from scratch? No way. Tommy Thompson>> So let's look at it. It's got really a great deal of problems. Ninety-three percent of two trillion dollars, sixteen percent of our GDP, goes to wait for you to get sick. Then we pay lots of money to get you well. Less than seven percent of the money is used to keep you well in the first place. Now nobody in their right mind would set up a system like that. So the number one fix is to change this system from a curative system, waiting for people to get sick and then cure them, to a wellness system, keeping people well in the first place. It's safe money. It improves your quality of health. I always tell people that, if you improve your quality of health, you'll improve your quality of life. Val Zavala>> That makes total sense, but how do you unlock the grip that insurance companies, drug companies, the medical profession have on our political system? They're vested in the way it is now and those people, at least, are winning. Patients are not. But how do you change something fundamentally? Tommy Thompson>> You change something fundamentally by first through programs like you're doing, programs that are put out by the CDC, programs that are put out through our medical schools. Those people in the medical schools really haven't done a good enough job talking about chronic illnesses, about wellness and about managing diseases. Insurance companies have got a vested interest in the current system, but the truth of the matter is, they recognize that it's starting to collapse. The whole health care system is on the verge of collapsing unless we do something about it. I'm not going to be one of those individuals that's going to stand around and say, "I told you so". I'm out speaking like I am today here in Los Angeles to groups trying to get them motivated on a bipartisan basis to do something about the health care system right now because I sincerely believe it's worth saving. We also have to get information out to the consumer because the consumer is not very well educated about himself or herself, about their bodies or how to take care of themselves. Why is tobacco smoking still such a bad thing for people to do? Why diabetes? It just drains the medical treasury and there's ways to deal with it. It's especially a huge problem for minorities. The third thing is, let's face it, we're just all too fat in America. I know when you wake up in the morning and say, "Chunky is good, but slim is better", and we have to get that message out and we can do it. Val Zavala>> You coined a phrase of "medical diplomacy". What do you mean? What is medical diplomacy? Tommy Thompson>> Medical diplomacy is a way that I believe we can do our foreign policy much better. When I travel the world and talk to individuals all over the world, especially in developing countries, it's amazing. The common denominator that I always get back from people is how do we improve our health? How do we improve it, especially with mothers and children? I think if we're ever going to win this war on terror, I think it's going to be through medical diplomacy. A good example is, before the tsunami in Indonesia, there was a poll done in Indonesia and -- Val Zavala>> -- which is predominantly Muslim. Tommy Thompson>> Predominantly Muslim. It's the largest Muslim country in the world. It came back about seventy-five percent of polls on the United States were about twenty-five percent were in favor. Then the tsunami came and we sent what was called one of our big floating medical ships, Project Mercy, and we had volunteer help and stayed there for several weeks. The day it left, thousands of people from Indonesia came down to the shore to wave goodbye and to say thank you. About three weeks later, the same pollster did a poll in Indonesia and it came back just the opposite. Seventy-five percent were favorable disposed to the United States. And still today, people in Indonesia, because of the tsunami, because of the outpouring of generosity and our medical help and support from the United States, came back much more favorably disposed to our country. That's why I am absolutely certain that medical diplomacy is a way to really start changing peoples' attitudes about Americans and America. Val Zavala>> We know you're exploring the possibility of running for president. If that ambition actually comes to fruition, what would be the first thing you would do to fix our health care? What would that be? Tommy Thompson>> The first bill I would introduce would be a bill on information technology, setting up a program so that we would have electronic medical records, we would do "e-prescribing", and we would also go paperless. We would set up a system whereby the fraud and abuse money that comes in would be used to transform health care in America. Val Zavala>> This is for like all people on Medicare? Tommy Thompson>> On Medicare and everybody else across the gamut. Val Zavala>> Really? Tommy Thompson>> Absolutely. There are seven steps that I've got to actually improve and make the health care system in America affordable, accessible and easily understood. It's a holistic approach. We're going to change the system, as I've already talked to you about, going into prevention rather than a curative system. We're going to start managing diseases, making sure people get an opportunity. We're going to require health insurance in America just like we do automobile insurance and liability insurance. Val Zavala>> Employer-provided? Tommy Thompson>> Well, you cannot require the employer to provide it. I'm talking about a subsidy from the state government and the federal government and the employers to be able to allow for it. It's just a mistake that forty-six Americans are without health insurance because who pays for it? You do. I do. So let's change it so that, instead of having it a drag on the economy, let's stimulate the economy and make health care work and let individuals who are uninsured be able to get insurance because where does the uninsured go for their health care? To emergency wards. What's the most expensive health care? Emergency wards. Does that make any sense at all? So it's common sense ideas like that that I would actually set and transform health care in America. Val Zavala>> Well, Tommy Thompson, best of luck to you and thank you so much for your time. Tommy Thompson>> Well, thank you. It's a pleasure being interviewed by you and thank you very much for the kind work you do. Val Zavala>> Tommy Thompson was a guest of Town Hall Los Angeles. If you'd like information on upcoming speakers, you can go to their website at townhall-la.org. Announcer>> To send a comment or a question to our program, you can reach us by mail at this address: Life and Times 4401 Sunset Blvd. Los Angeles, California 90027 You can also call our viewer comment line (323) 953-5555) or contact us the fast way by e-mail at kcet.org. Larry Mantle>> Welcome to FilmWeek on Life and Times. I'm Larry Mantle of 89.3 KPCC. Our first film this week is "Apocalypto". It's co-written by and directed by Mel Gibson and takes us to the final days of the Mayan civilization. [Film Clip] Larry Mantle>> I'm joined this week by critic Peter Rainer of the Christian Science Monitor. Peter, what did you think of "Apocalypto"? Peter Rainer>> Well, this is a very powerfully violent movie. It also happens to be powerful, but in ways that I think ultimately are somewhat pointless because we're supposed to be seeing the destruction of the Mayan culture as demonstrated in essentially a chase film. The guys and others of the tribe are enslaved by these Mayan captors and they're about to be put up for human sacrifices. His escape is about half of the movie. You know, we don't see any sense in the film of what the great Mayan civilization might have been that's about to be, you know, destroyed. Instead, what we see is the very elemental drama that almost goes back to the silent era where you have cuts of running away and then cuts of the captors chasing and then the wife and child in distress in the bottom of a well and then you cut back to the guy. You know, there's all of that kind of very basic filmmaking. On some level, it's quite effective. He's a strong filmmaker, but it's so overpoweringly violent in ways that go way beyond the requirements of the script. Organs were pulled out of bodies, eaten heads. The movie lost me pretty much after the fourth decapitation and heads rolling down the Mayan temples bouncing along the way. There are about ten of those shots and that's typical of the movie. It's literally overkill. Gibson seems to have a fetish for showing mostly half-naked men being, you know, stripped and flayed and disemboweled and that's so much a part of what this film is about that it becomes what the film is about. I think that's a disservice to what might have been a terrific film. Larry Mantle>> Our next film this week is both an adventure and a political thriller. It's directed by Edward Zwick. "Blood Diamond" stars Leonardo DiCaprio, Djimon Hounsou and Jennifer Connelly. [Film Clip] Larry Mantle>> Peter, what did you think of "Blood Diamond"? Peter Rainer>> "Blood Diamond" is a pretty good film. It's a mix of elements that are quite strong and others that don't really gel. It's set in Sierra Leone in 1999 during a vicious civil war there between rebels and the government. It involves the selling of blood diamonds for, among other reasons, fuel for the war. It's a powerful polemic against the whole blood diamond industry that exists now in the world, particularly in Africa. Leonardo DiCaprio is, again, quite good in this film as he was in "The Departed". I think he's sort of finally become an adult. You can believe him in adult roles. He plays this Zimbabwean soldier of fortune, I guess is the best way to spin it. Djimon Hounsou is quite good as his counterpart, the fisherman who wants to retrieve his son from kidnappers who've brainwashed him into being a child soldier. The problem with the movie is that the action sequences are first-rate, but the polemic part of the film is clunky and very often, particularly with the Jennifer Connelly character who plays an American journalist, you find that you're being fed exposition and sort of being spoon-fed plots, narratives and messages. That all becomes kind of tiresome and it slows the action down periodically so that the two types of films here, the polemic and the action-adventure picture, never really gel. But there's some first-rate action filmmaking and some very good performances, and it's an important subject too. So I think that shouldn't be discounted. Larry Mantle>> And on a much lighter note, we conclude with "The Holiday" from writer-director, Nancy Meyers. It stars Cameron Diaz, Kate Winslet, Jude Law and Jack Black. [Film Clip] Larry Mantle>> Peter, as a guy, did "The Holiday" work for you? Peter Rainer>> No (laughter). I'm not sure this is such a gender-specific issue here. It's possible that intelligent women may not like this movie as well. It's a very sugary, star-driven chick flick which isn't necessarily good or bad. Nancy Meyers, who's the writer-director, did "What Women Want" and other films, you know, "Irreconcilable Differences". She co-wrote a terrific film, "Private Benjamin" years ago. But this was such a piece of fluff that it just wafts off the screen and never quite sinks in. Cameron Diaz is sort of your nightmare professional woman. She's obviously been told to act in a way that she's, you know, living off a metronome inside of her. She is just like a wind-up doll. Jude Law is once again playing essentially Jude Law. Kate Winslet is actually quite charming. Her love interest in this film is Jack Black. As much as I like Jack Black, I'm not sure that really works, partly because he's supposed to be playing a sort of normal guy, but his inner Jack Black keeps erupting and, you know, his eyebrows keep doing the tango, so that doesn't really work. Eli Wallach is wonderful in the film in a small role as a famous Hollywood screenwriter who kind of mentors Kate Winslet and talks her through her romantic troubles. He's, I believe, ninety and it's a wonderful little performance. But the movie overall is completely contrived and, even if you want to suspend belief, there's only so far you can suspend anything and that's the case in point in this film. Larry Mantle>> That's it for another FilmWeek on Life and Times. I'm Larry Mantle of 89.3 KPCC joined by critic Peter Rainer of the Christian Science Monitor. We invite you to join us next week at this same time for the next FilmWeek on Life and Times. Val Zavala>> For the hour version of FilmWeek, you can listen to KPCC radio on Fridays at eleven a.m. And that's our program. I'm Val Zavala. For everyone at Life and Times, thanks for watching. We'll see you next time. Announcer>> Life and Times was made possible through the generous support of the L.K. Whittier Foundation dedicated to improving the quality of life by supporting innovative endeavors in the fields of medicine, health, science and education. And by a generous grant from Jim and Anne Rothenberg. Sponsored in part by:  | |
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